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Thread: Parenting in the Parks: Fine Dining With Children at Disney Theme Parks

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    Parenting in the Parks: Fine Dining With Children at Disney Theme Parks

    Fine Dining With Children at Disney Theme Parks by Adrienne Krock

    The Parenting Panel shares their experiences and opinions about taking young children to dine at finer restaurants on Disney properties.

    Read it here!


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    Ready for MA World Explorers! Drince88's Avatar
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    Great article!
    I don't have kids of my own, but am a very proud Auntie, so I too, am willing to allow kids to behave like kids, provided the parents behave like parents.

    My worst experience with dining near children was at Ralph Brennan's Jazz Kitchen in Disneyland's Downtown Disney. I had to tell a small child who had his stuffed dog barking at my sister and I that we don't feed dogs at the table (ignoring him wasn't working). And he responded (as if I were derranged) that it was a toy dog. The kids were so disruptive and not-well-prepared to be at the opposite end of the table as their parents, aunts and uncles, and grandparents (they needed to be NEXT to their parents) that I had to call their server over and compliment him on his handling of the table, because they were running him ragged. When I told him he deserved a big tip from that table, he mentioned that his 'server experience' told him that wasn't going to happen. If your children are causing the server to work double time than he/she would be for the same size table of adults - respond with the tip appropriately!!

    But I've also had wonderful experiences dinining with and non-remarkable experiences dining near children at Disney parks. (if I'm not dining with your children, it SHOULD be non-remarkable to me - with the exception of the 10 year old at V&A - THAT is remarkable!) I do agree Disney is a good place to practice what they've been learning at home about table behavior.

    Cathy

  4. #3

    "Even with toys to distract them, parents need to remember that the lure of the rides and attractions outside of the restaurant will be stronger than the appeal of a toy and food."

    This is bizarre advice. A child will need distractions at a dining room. They are easily bored. This is true of my 3 year old toddler. They need to be entertained or distracted at any moment. It doesn't work to delay such needs even temporarily. That's why it is the perogative for the parent to decide if fine dining is worth the effort. Many parents like myself decide to not take our kids to fine dining for this reason, but on some occasions it is necessary.

    Another advice is "Practice dining out"? Huh? Everyday is a practice day. You must practice at home and practice out in public.

    Fine dining at Disney is a oxymoron. You have to accomodate the kids. That's the way it works.


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    OK, here's my unpopular opinion - while there are always exceptions, I think that for the most part, children shouldn't be brought to fine dining restaurants, even in a kid-friendly environment like a Disney theme park resort. Now, the not-so-defined lines are at what age the "children" part comes in, and what level of restaurant/price point is "fine dining". Technically, a 12-year-old is still a child, but I could see a kid that age being brought to a nicer restaurant as opposed to a 5-year-old.

    I get that the parents want a nice night out. I get that they want to enjoy a nice dinner at a nice restaurant as well. I get that there isn't always a family member or friend to watch their child while they go out for dinner, especially if they're on vacation. But, to me, that means that the nice dinner out will just have to wait for another time, rather than bringing along the 5-year-old to someplace like Napa Rose.

    I don't have kids, so no, I don't have any personal experience. I have been around family and friends who have small children, and for the most part, they either found someone to watch their child while they went out to a nice place, or they didn't go until the child was old enough to go with them or be left home.

    On a recent trip to WDW, the husband and I had dinner at Biergarten one night, and one of the parties we were paired up with at a table was a family of four, 2 parents and 2 youngish (5 and 7) kids. The parents had visited WDW many times before, but it was the first time they'd eaten at a place like that because their kids were now old enough to be in that kind of environment and there was enough on the menu that they liked where food preference wasn't an issue. On another evening, we had the chef's tasting dinner at Flying Fish, and the couple we sat next to had never been before, but their kids were now old enough that they felt comfortable leaving them with the Disney childcare service while they went out for a nice dinner. It was the first time they'd done that.


    Maybe I'm being selfish, but I don't want my dinner disrupted by an unruly child (Heck, I don't want my dinner disrupted by an unruly adult!), and frankly, I can't imagine why parents would want to spend the higher price to eat at a nicer restaurant when they won't really be able to focus on the food or decor/ambience because they have to tend to their kids. I also wonder if parents might be inclined to let their kids act up a bit more because they don't want to cut short their time at the nice restaurant. Packing up your food from a local family restaurant because your child is bored and fidgety is a much different proposition than packing up the nice food just delivered to your table in that 3 or 4 star restaurant.

    I've been at Napa Rose where a group of parents sat at one table and their not-quite-teen kids sat at another table, and those kids were loud and distracting to the other diners. Obviously, that's not an ideal situation no matter what. But I've also been at Napa Rose when I've walked by a table, and the parents are having a nice quiet dinner while their 4-year-old is fast asleep curled up on two adjacent chairs, which I thought was pretty cute.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cstephens View Post
    OK, here's my unpopular opinion - while there are always exceptions, I think that for the most part, children shouldn't be brought to fine dining restaurants, even in a kid-friendly environment like a Disney theme park resort. Now, the not-so-defined lines are at what age the "children" part comes in, and what level of restaurant/price point is "fine dining". Technically, a 12-year-old is still a child, but I could see a kid that age being brought to a nicer restaurant as opposed to a 5-year-old.

    snip to

    I've been at Napa Rose where a group of parents sat at one table and their not-quite-teen kids sat at another table, and those kids were loud and distracting to the other diners. Obviously, that's not an ideal situation no matter what. But I've also been at Napa Rose when I've walked by a table, and the parents are having a nice quiet dinner while their 4-year-old is fast asleep curled up on two adjacent chairs, which I thought was pretty cute.
    I sort of agree with you. But my opinion is going to be just as unpopular as yours...

    We took our son to Napa Rose for the first time when he was 13. He was thrilled to finally go. But here's the thing: We just don't have the budget to justify spending that much money on a meal during which we'd have to do so much work controlling our children. Because if we're going to go to a restaurant THAT NICE, I expect to spend my meal controlling my children so they do not distract other diners.

    I've been to Napa Rose when the distracting loud families are there. I've also been there and have seen the families who can control their children.

    The problem, in my opinion, is the parents who don't recognize the difference. They make it harder for those who do.
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    Happiness is that smile MammaSilva's Avatar
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    I have an unusual situation where I will freely admit I base my 'judgmental standards' if a perpetual child of 4 due to brain damage can learn the social graces to include table manners well enough to dine at Club 33 then there is absolutely no excuse other than parenting that other children can't do the same, so I'm the first to be annoyed when I see parents let their children invade my space when we're out and I don't care if it's at the food court in DCA or Carthay Circle or McDonalds across the way. When my daughter looks at the guilty parties and says momma those kids need to learn to sit down right, that says it all in a nutshell. I invested a great deal of time and energy into teaching her the skills to be able to take her to someplace like Carthay Circle or Club 33 without a hestiation and I expect others to do the same with their children or make other arrangements ...choose a McDonalds or the food court and sit away from other guests until your dumpling is old enough to behave or be allowed to run the parks while you enjoy a meal.

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    Great article, and I agree with most of it.

    Most of you know, my boys are now 5 & 6 and, most of the time, are very well behaved in restaurants. We have table rules at home, those same table rules apply when we dine out (which is frequently) and the know what type of behavior is expected of them. That being said, every kid has a bad day, gets tired or bored occasionally and that's where it's the parents' duty to intervene. And by intervening I don't mean yelling at your child, spanking your child or making the scene even worse. But, be proactive and come prepared. Sorry, Adrienne, but I disagree with the electronics at the table. If we go somewhere and the meal is taking longer than a reasonable amount of time for my child (IMO) to wait, you bet I will bust out those iPods and let them play a game silently. But, they also know that the minute someone brings their food they are to hand them back to me and they go back in my purse. P could go all day coloring and drawing and playing tic tac toe, but J, not so much. He's never liked coloring or drawing so that loses it's magic really quick. But, in your situation, it's obvious that the parents should have done SOMETHING, so they failed that child.

    On the note of should kids eat at fine dining establishments, I really think there are so many variables. DH and I love Napa Rose and we dine there frequently but have not taken the boys there. We have no plans to do so in the near future. It's just to long of a meal in a too quiet of an environment for them. The expectations would be way too high. So, we leave them with a sitter at home or check them into Pinnochio's workshop (which they ask for every time we go to DL). We have taken them to Carthay Circle for lunch, but wouldn't brave it for dinner. Again, that would just be asking a bit too much of them. As far as Club 33 goes, I'm ready to start thinking about taking them to brunch there. It's an environment where I think they would be comfortable and they would enjoy getting up to pick their salads and desserts. Plus, there's Goofy and Mickey, hello? Dinner, no way. We're far from that point still.

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    Ugh! Restuarants! This is a topic of torture for us right now. M just turned 2. We are a lot stricter than most of our friends about table rules (you can't get up and graze, if you push your plate away and scream "No" you have lost your right to that food for a few minutes. when you are done, you are done- no climbing on Mommy's lap) which has made dinner time oh so fun in our house these past couple of months. We haven't really bent the rules and have stopped fixing altertinatives if he won't eat. I am hopeful that this will eventually pay off for us! But, right now, there is NO way we would be eating at a fine dining place. Nope. Not going to waste my money on a meal telling M "it's chicken, you like it!" We do still force ourselves to go to Red Robin or Islands or somewhere as a family once a month or so, just to practice those eating out skills, and generally, he does well enough for those places- but that is about the level I am willing to risk it at this point! Up until about 15 months, he was wonderful at restuarants!! Then he got an opinion!

    ETA- this past weekend we went out with my in laws so we went to Rock Bottom Brewery (sort of an Olive Garden level restaurant) which is nicer than where we normally choose to eat with the kids. We went at 5:30 and it was empty!! We sat down and there was only one other table seated in our section and I hear the guy (maybe 50ish) snark "Man, have they heard of a babysitter." Now, I get seeing us coming with my 2 year old and 7 month old might not make you jump with glee, but give us a chance! K was fine, she generally is, and M was really pretty good. I was hyper aware of his behavior because of the man. He had a few small whines, but if there had been others in that section, it would have been a complete non-issue because of background noise. There was a kid on the other side of the place losing her mind on at least 4 occasions for 3-5 minutes at a time. I was just so annoyed that the guy was so rude before anything even happened, and nothing did!

    Last edited by Mermaid; 09-20-2012 at 12:32 PM.
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    It was a good day! Malcon10t's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adriennek View Post
    The problem, in my opinion, is the parents who don't recognize the difference. They make it harder for those who do.
    THIS....

    My kids learned early on what was required of them in a restaurant. We have been discussing this recently. They knew there was no getting up, playing, etc... The closest they could come would be the kids' menu coloring thingies. We didn't have iPods/iPhones, etc... I can remember leaving the kids when they were 5/6/8/9 at the table ALONE while I went to the bathroom. And I knew the WORST case scenario when I returned would be they may have changed seating arrangements. (Or they may have ordered my Margarita... correctly...) I know I instilled "This is how it will be done..." I asked MDM about it recently and what she thought would happen if she did get out of her seat or raised her voice, or stood on a bench to look at the people in the next seating area... She said she honestly didn't know, but she knew at the time, she didn't want it to happen!!

    I have a LOT of nieces and nephews. I have a few that I willingly take to Club 33. My niece (who is now 8) we took when she was 5. She is accustom to long business meals, and has no problem engaging in small talk (her vocabulary is so extensive!) I have been with a friend who brought her 8yo nephew, beautifully behaved. I have 3 nephews who cannot even make it through Billy Hill. It is embarrassing dining with them. They complain about how long it takes, they fall out of seats, they invade other's spaces. And the parents simply seem to think I am out of touch with how it is to be a parent. My brother once even looked at me and said "Ok, you fix it.." He knows I can. Problem is, then *I* am the bad guy making them do what their parents won't. But, interestingly enough, when I just have the younger 2, they behave just fine for me, once I set the boundries.
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    It was a good day! Malcon10t's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mermaid View Post
    We do still force ourselves to go to Red Robin or Islands or somewhere as a family once a month or so, just to practice those eating out skills, and generally, he does well enough for those places- but that is about the level I am willing to risk it at this point! Up until about 15 months, he was wonderful at restuarants!! Then he got an opinion!
    Here is the thing... You NEED to take him out. How will he learn if you don't? But you start with places like Red Robin/Perkos/Dennys and work your way up. When MDM trains dogs, they learn to sit in the house, in the store, in the driveway, in the backyard. Why? So they associate the behavior in all the various places. A child needs the same thing. If the child can't handle McDonalds, and can't sit still there, what makes you think he will sit at Mimi's, Morton's, or Napa Rose? I don't believe every child needs to have a babysitter. But the parent needs to realize what their child can handle.
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    Ready for MA World Explorers! Drince88's Avatar
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    You have to give the kids a chance before you say something like that out loud. And really, at a Rock Bottom Brewery? When there's NOBODY there??? (pass the eyedrops, please!)

    Cathy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mermaid View Post
    We went at 5:30 and it was empty!! We sat down and there was only one other table seated in our section and I hear the guy (maybe 50ish) snark "Man, have they heard of a babysitter."
    At that time, at that kind of a place? He's a loser. I'll admit that I sometimes play with other people's kids (as in, wave at them, smile at them, say hi) if the kids are looking over and if the parents seem receptive to it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcon10t View Post
    Here is the thing... You NEED to take him out. How will he learn if you don't?
    Totally agree- which is why we do it- but it can be trying!! He is really not too bad, he always stays in his highchair (yes, he is still in a high chair in the restuarant, we tried the booster once and he wouldn't stay seated, so he is back in the high chair) and we have only had one really brutal experience at Chili's where I had to take him out, but even then the check was taking forever and he was just DONE with being in his seat! So, really, compared to what I have seen, he is generally pretty good, but it takes a lot of work to make that happen! Totally not relaxing for anyone- which is why I can not imagine taking a toddler to a nice place! I am pretty nervous for our cruise next summer, he'll be a few months shy of 3 and she will be 17 months. I am debating eating together for 45 minutes each night and then going to the nursery or just booking 2-3 full dinner times in the nursery and bringing them to the full dinner the other nights! I am leaning for the latter but 2 hour meals seem like a recipe for issues and thus far, we don't let him play with the iPad/iPod/DS at all, and I tend to agree those things aren't for the table, but I don't know!!! 10 months to hash it out I guess!

    Thanks for the support Drince and cstephens. I thought he was being a jerk too but it did make me self concious!
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    A reader sent the following by e-mail:

    I would like to thank you for your article...you've hit it right on...it’s a matter of good parenting....my wife and I have no children...although we both like them, my wife's a teacher, 6th grade.....and enjoy the opportunity of going out to eat...and have found that a good number of parents with children, have naturally? developed a complete wall around themselves when they go 'out', and don't hear or see what their children are doing, or how they may disturb both other patrons or staff by running or playing separate from the table area or over the top of the booth..I really don't think that teaching your children manners and respect is something that is not necessary or required, regardless of where you are....now as I reflect on it, since children don't know unless they are taught, maybe it’s the parents who don't care or have respect for others? .....bottom line we find it annoying, and an invasion of our wanted experience to have a peaceful enjoyable meal in an atmosphere in which to enjoy it....you and your husband definitely demonstrate good parenting skills and the awareness of others around you and we would be most pleasured sitting next to you anytime at any dining facility, fine or otherwise....again, thank you for your observations.
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  16. #15

    This is a very touchy subject for me. My girls are 5 and 7, we have never not taken them to a restaurant because it was fine dining. We as their parents have certain expectations and expect for the most part that they will be met. That being said, I have always been prepared to get up and remove them from the restaurant if need be. People can say that children shouldn't be in this place or that, but let me remind you, there are also very rude and obnoxious adults that go to fine dining restaurants as well, when I come across them I am not shy about saying something to them. In those circumstances I would rather be next to a family with kids that are acting up, after all.....they are kids, what excuse do the obnoxious and rude adults have?


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    Parenting in the Parks: Fine Dining With Children at Disney Theme Parks

    It certainly is a touchy subject, but I think this is a great platform to discuss and share views with those who have a different lifestyle from our own.

    I would absolutely want to know if something that we were allowing to happen was a disturbance or disruption to others. This is a huge reason we haven't braved Napa Rose with our kids. Not only do we feel like it's a bit much of us to ask if our kids to be so patient in this environment. But, equally, WE like to enjoy a break and a kidless dinner once in awhile as well. I'd rather focus on each course and the wind that it's paired with than worry about whether or not my child is hindering someone else's experience.

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    It was a good day! Malcon10t's Avatar
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    I think one of my biggest pet peeves (as many hear have heard me complain about) are children who don't remain seated in restaurants. I've had children play tag in Mimi's, have had kids play hide and seek, using MY table to hide, and had a child decide to play with MDM's hair... The case at Mimi's, the kids weren't even in the same ROOM as their parents, and had servers trying to avoid them. With the hide and seek, the parents were more involved in the conversation on the other side of the room. It wasn't a quick escape, they were "playing" for over 20 mins. It didn't matter to the parents that their children were disrupting other people's meals.

    That said, I promised myself after the hide and seek incident, I would start looking around more. What I found is there were usually more children sitting at the table, behaving properly. The misbehaved stood out. Yes, there are parents who don't teach their children what is acceptable, but their parents probably didn't teach them. They figure "They're kids, what can you expect". They allow them to stand on the table, they allow them to invade other's tables, they ignore the screaming, and they figure anyone giving dirty looks just don't understand kids. The 10%, ruin it for the other 90%.

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  19. #18

    That's exactly it, it's the few in the crowd who ruin it for everyone else. Often times if my girls see kids running around a restaurant they will comment on how that behaviour is not ok in a restaurant. I've also had my oldest tell one of these kids that was playing by our table that they should probably go find their parents and sit down. My girls are not perfect but we do have expectations of them and will most definitely correct them if we don't find it acceptable.


  20. #19
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    We have always taken our children to restaurants, even as small children. However, we have also had many meals ruined for one of us (we took turns) because one of the children didn't behave. We'd go sit in the car or some other appropriate (safe and boring) place until the remainder of the party finished the meal. Naturally, no fine dining until we were pretty certain they'd be okay. And I must give huge credit to my sister, who carried a small backpack in her trunk containing a half dozen little but unique toys to entertain bored children during wait times.

    My children have received frequent compliments on their good manners. I took CodeBoy to the Chef's Counter at Napa Rose when he was 10 and he was a perfect gentleman. He was allowed to read while I was finishing my dessert. Oh, and they were very good to him, too. They acted as if they were going to serve him wine. And when we received the check, they gave it to him.

    It's all very hard won. But they've got to have practice, or they won't know. I did have to dress down CodeTeen once for being rude to our waitress. I did it in public, too. And we tipped her Very Well. He has been out to eat with the family exactly twice since then (it happened in June) and he knows why.

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  21. #20

    Thank you to all the parents, aunts, uncles, and family friends here who have chosen to put in the hard work to parent (even if you aren't the actual parent) and to take the responsibility of being the grown ups by teaching your kids life skills, like how to eat in a restaurant (be it Mimi's or Napa Rose)! Your dedication and perseverence bear fruit in your kids, even if you don't always see it. We've put in a lot of hard work with our nephews, and they know that we have high expectations of them because we love them. They've known for a long time that eating at nice places is a privilege which depends on their good behavior. When we see kids behaving well in restaurants, especially nice places, we try to compliment them and the parents, because we know that the good behavior we're seeing didn't just happen overnight. And good parenting in a restaurant situation usually reflects dedicated parenting at home, too. So, again, thank you!


  22. #21

    Children can have a tremendous influence on others around them, especially at a fine restaurant. A few years ago I had a meal at the Coral Reef pretty much ruined by a small girl who crawled under her table and then screamed at the top of her lungs for the remainder of the meal. As others have said, I don't really blame the child - I blame the idiot parents who chose to ignore the screaming and continue their dinner as if nothing was wrong. By the end of the meal several surrounding tables wanted to string up the parents!

    On the other side of the spectrum, I had dinner one evening at Le Cellier, and was seated next to a young couple with a very small child. They had a portable dvd player, and the little girl was totally happy sitting there watching cartoons while her parents enjoyed a mostly quiet dinner. Know your child, know what they need, and know when to surrender and take the child outside. It's how I was raised, and I think my parents did a pretty good job!

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  23. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by cstephens View Post
    OK, here's my unpopular opinion - while there are always exceptions, I think that for the most part, children shouldn't be brought to fine dining restaurants, even in a kid-friendly environment like a Disney theme park resort. Now, the not-so-defined lines are at what age the "children" part comes in, and what level of restaurant/price point is "fine dining". Technically, a 12-year-old is still a child, but I could see a kid that age being brought to a nicer restaurant as opposed to a 5-year-old.

    I get that the parents want a nice night out. I get that they want to enjoy a nice dinner at a nice restaurant as well. I get that there isn't always a family member or friend to watch their child while they go out for dinner, especially if they're on vacation. But, to me, that means that the nice dinner out will just have to wait for another time, rather than bringing along the 5-year-old to someplace like Napa Rose.
    I absolutely, whole-heartedly, completely and totally agree with this!! My husband and I are childfree, and it seems that anytime we go out to eat ANYWHERE, we get sat next to the table with screaming toddlers and infants. There are indeed certain restaurants that are more family-oriented where such things are more or less to be expected. Carthay Circle and Napa Rose do not fall into that category. I really, really wish that there was an age requirement to eat at these establishments (and other more adult-oriented restaurants everywhere). People today have no concept of what is and is not a place or activity to bring their small children to (don't even get me started on the movies!). In my opinion, anywhere that charges more than $20 for an entre is not an appropriate place to bring anyone under 12.

    I do get the argument that it's a parenting issue, but consider this: All parents think that they're good parents. From what I've seen, I'd say maybe 1 in 5 actually are, and I'm being generous there. So please, if you want to enjoy a night out, do something else with your small children so that you (and everyone else at the restaurant) can actually enjoy it.

  24. #23

    I just spend a week in the World, and had dinner one evening at Sanaa. Seated next to me was a young couple and their 3 kids from around 3 to around 10 or so. It was really fun watching these parents deal with their kids. They were mostly well behaved, but when one of them got a little rambunctious the dad would distract them with questions about their day, just doing a little direct involvement with the child. At no time did any of them get out of hand, and it was all thanks to the attention of 2 terrific parents.

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  25. #24
    It was a good day! Malcon10t's Avatar
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    Jun 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatCrazyRedhead View Post
    I absolutely, whole-heartedly, completely and totally agree with this!! My husband and I are childfree, and it seems that anytime we go out to eat ANYWHERE, we get sat next to the table with screaming toddlers and infants. There are indeed certain restaurants that are more family-oriented where such things are more or less to be expected. Carthay Circle and Napa Rose do not fall into that category. I really, really wish that there was an age requirement to eat at these establishments (and other more adult-oriented restaurants everywhere).
    I understand, however, this is a big disservice to those children who can handle the adult restaurants. I've had people tell me "You just don't understand kids" when I've told them standing in a booth, playing with the light over the table is NOT appropriate. I have nephews that I don't even want to take to McDonalds, let alone Carthay. But I have other nieces and nephews who can and do handle the upscale restaurants without issue. It isn't fait to them to say "Because other children your age aren't capable of sitting quietly, you don't get to go." It needs to go back on the parents. They need to realize that just because the restaurant is in a theme park or hotel doesn't mean it is ok to take a child who isn't used to upscale dining. Too often I hear people say "Oh yeah, go to Napa Rose, Disneyland is right there, they are used to kids everywhere..."
    Planning 3 trips at once...

  26. #25

    I don't think you can put a blanket age limit on it. Some kids will behave wonderfully, some won't. Personally I never took mine anywhere nice because usually there was not much on the menu she'd eat and I knew I'd be spending half my evening somewhere outside the restaurant with her once she got bored. Just wasn't worth it.

    There have been times, kids playing with my hair over the top of a booth, where I do wish management would step in and ask the culprits to either get the kiddos under control or please take their dinner to go. If the parents aren't going to do anything then I do think Management should attempt to save the rest of the patrons.

    My biggest pet peeve with children and dining is the thought that if there is any sort of outdoor area like patio it's fine to let your kids run wild because they're "outside". Uh no. Unless there's a jungle gym out there it's not.


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