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Thread: Non-Californian (Fully Vaccinated) visitor

  1. #1

    Non-Californian (Fully Vaccinated) visitor

    Crazy thoughts here...

    "To all Californians who come to this happy place, welcome!"

    I am a non-Californian who is fully vaccinated with tickets and a reservation for later in the month. I am coming to visit Anaheim and relax either way and hope to be able to attend the parks. If I can't get in I will hang out in DTD. I understand the official park stance is currently a big "NO" to non-Californians. I hope that changes before I get there. However, how do they know if you are a Californian or not? I have heard they CAN check an ID but that they are not really checking IDs. I would think the reservation site would filter out non-Californians but it did not... I have heard a person could use a passport for ID with no reference to which state you are from. I have also heard you could make your own utility bill with a California address as proof, no way they can verifying these are real or not...

    This feels more like a public stance to get the government to allow them to open and to keep Californians happy thinking they have the Disneyland visitor market cornered, but that the company doesn't really have a way to deny folks. Turning away a person with a reservation just costs the company money. This turning away of non-Californians is obviously not the long term plan so investing in a big procedure or program to deny folks that will be accepted soon doesn't make financial sense. The California government updated the state blue print to state that non-Californians that are fully vaccinated are exempt from the non-California guidelines.

    When I show up am I going to be able to get in? Is there an actual procedure in place to keep folks like me out? Has anyone been denied entrance because of their state of residency?


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    It is my understanding that the only California residents at this time is a State of California requirement and not something the Disney Corporation came up with, so do not be mad at Disney if you are denied entry to the Disneyland Resort Parks.

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  4. #3

    I have so many opinions. First, the ethics. Just because you can get away with something, doesn't mean that you should. This is the perennial debate every year when Disney releases the So Cal ticket offer. Can you get a friend to buy it for you? Should you take advantage? etc? My opinion on what is morally permissible may differ from yours, and I'm not going to go there, just know that it's an issue.

    Second, the legality. Disney is trying to abide by the rules in place by the State of CA, without having to become vaccine police. Sea World has opted to allow in guests who attest or have proof of being fully vaccinated. I'm not sure what checking they are actually doing, but that's there right based on the clause that out-of-state can be treated as though in-state if fully vaccinated. Disney has announced that they are not participating in that exemption/clause. If Disney is caught allowing in unvaccinated out-of-state guests, they could be shut down. And since they aren't checking vaccination status, if they let you it will be as an unvaccinated out-of-state guest, regardless of your actual vaccination status.

    This isn't a "public stance to get the government to allow them to open and to keep California's happy thinking they have the Disneyland visitor market cornered" this was a rule put in place by the State of CA as a condition of reopening. And after Iger quit the committee several months ago, I'm not sure who was lobbying on behalf of amusement parks. It was only a few months ago that the state changed the policy from only allowing a partial opening in yellow, to the rules we currently have.

    Disneyland is largely for families. And since kids can't be vaccinated yet, it is not too surprising that Disney is opting for the easy to implement "no out of state guests" rather than "any guest under age 2, CA only for ages 3-15, CA or proof of vaccine if 16+". And then what do they do with kids to prove residency? Mine started getting IDs in middle school, but the 3-11 crowd tends to not have ID that proves residency. Do people on vacation from out-of-state start trying to get kids to go through the turnstiles with other family that "look CA" since they won't have vaccine cards to show, or do they start screaming at the gate how they spent $x to come here only to have the kids turned away who obviously don't have vaccines because they are not yet available and Disney has ruined their vacation? Why would Disney want that?

    It sounds like you are planning to come regardless of Disney's official policies, and you will probably be let in. But I think you are missing that these are not Disney restrictions and if too many out-of-state guests come, then there could be consequences for everyone including, theoretically, the entire park being shut back down.


  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Promo-Man View Post
    It is my understanding that the only California residents at this time is a State of California requirement and not something the Disney Corporation came up with, so do not be mad at Disney if you are denied entry to the Disneyland Resort Parks.
    I'm not mad about it and I'm not gonna be mad at anybody if I'm denied. I expect to be denied, if they set themselves up to do so. I get it was a California state requirement that has since been amended to allow those from other states if they are vaccinated. Disney has not yet adjusted to the amended part of that guideline.

    By the way I've been to Disney World twice during covid and it was great!

  6. #5
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    Florida's current Covid rate is 3,155 new cases reported yesterday vs. California's 1,512. FL has 75% of the population CA does yet has twice the new cases. Something's not going well there.

    CA is doing a better job #'s-wise in terms of abating the virus at the moment than FL. Part of that is related to the longer lockdown and stricter protocols than FL.

    Just because people *can* get away with it doesn't mean they should. Integrity is doing the right thing when nobody is looking was a motto at my son's elementary school. June 15th isn't that far away.

    Karin


  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by currence View Post
    I have so many opinions. First, the ethics. Just because you can get away with something, doesn't mean that you should. This is the perennial debate every year when Disney releases the So Cal ticket offer. Can you get a friend to buy it for you? Should you take advantage? etc? My opinion on what is morally permissible may differ from yours, and I'm not going to go there, just know that it's an issue.

    Second, the legality. Disney is trying to abide by the rules in place by the State of CA, without having to become vaccine police. Sea World has opted to allow in guests who attest or have proof of being fully vaccinated. I'm not sure what checking they are actually doing, but that's there right based on the clause that out-of-state can be treated as though in-state if fully vaccinated. Disney has announced that they are not participating in that exemption/clause. If Disney is caught allowing in unvaccinated out-of-state guests, they could be shut down. And since they aren't checking vaccination status, if they let you it will be as an unvaccinated out-of-state guest, regardless of your actual vaccination status.

    This isn't a "public stance to get the government to allow them to open and to keep California's happy thinking they have the Disneyland visitor market cornered" this was a rule put in place by the State of CA as a condition of reopening. And after Iger quit the committee several months ago, I'm not sure who was lobbying on behalf of amusement parks. It was only a few months ago that the state changed the policy from only allowing a partial opening in yellow, to the rules we currently have.

    Disneyland is largely for families. And since kids can't be vaccinated yet, it is not too surprising that Disney is opting for the easy to implement "no out of state guests" rather than "any guest under age 2, CA only for ages 3-15, CA or proof of vaccine if 16+". And then what do they do with kids to prove residency? Mine started getting IDs in middle school, but the 3-11 crowd tends to not have ID that proves residency. Do people on vacation from out-of-state start trying to get kids to go through the turnstiles with other family that "look CA" since they won't have vaccine cards to show, or do they start screaming at the gate how they spent $x to come here only to have the kids turned away who obviously don't have vaccines because they are not yet available and Disney has ruined their vacation? Why would Disney want that?

    It sounds like you are planning to come regardless of Disney's official policies, and you will probably be let in. But I think you are missing that these are not Disney restrictions and if too many out-of-state guests come, then there could be consequences for everyone including, theoretically, the entire park being shut back down.

    So if they don't want people from out of state to be admitted the question is what are they doing to stop them other than just saying don't come? If they have nothing else in place than I question if they really mean it. Setting the park reservation system up to deny out of state visitors seems like the easy answer but they did not do that.

    You say these are not Disney restrictions but that is exactly what they are. The state of California says I can visit but Disney says I can't so it is by definition a Disney restriction. Once again my question is based on do they actually mean what they say to keep people away or is it just lip service. I'm wondering what else they put behind it. They are a big company with lots of resources and have even hired medical folks who will check your temperature before entering and deny you if it is high. How are they checking this rule?

    If they have a rule they are pretty good at enforcing it. They have height requirements that they check multiple times before a rider is let on. They have cameras watching guests for breaking rules on rides. They have a ticket system that takes pictures to keep people from selling partially used tickets. They have great rule enforcing tools. Do they have one for this?

  8. #7

    I would think they'd be checking IDs, but I haven't gone yet and don't know if they are doing that consistently (or at all, for that matter). When we used Socal tickets in the past, they did consistently ask for state ID (at least in my experience).


  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Karin View Post
    Florida's current Covid rate is 3,155 new cases reported yesterday vs. California's 1,512. FL has 75% of the population CA does yet has twice the new cases. Something's not going well there.

    CA is doing a better job #'s-wise in terms of abating the virus at the moment than FL. Part of that is related to the longer lockdown and stricter protocols than FL.

    Just because people *can* get away with it doesn't mean they should. Integrity is doing the right thing when nobody is looking was a motto at my son's elementary school. June 15th isn't that far away.

    Since when is Disneyland a place where no one is looking? They have cameras all over that park. We play a game of find the camera for fun at times. They have massive teams of security. My daughter once accidentally left a bag in the innovations building for 5 minutes and shut down an entire floor of the building. They watch everything they can. They search bags by hand and they have metal detectors. They enforce every rule they want to. I'm just surprised that they put this rule in the, "Do it even though we aren't looking" category.

  10. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Shortpix77 View Post
    I would think they'd be checking IDs, but I haven't gone yet and don't know if they are doing that consistently (or at all, for that matter). When we used Socal tickets in the past, they did consistently ask for state ID (at least in my experience).
    I agree. They should be doing that but I have heard they are not. The rules they care about they follow consistently and thoroughly. Why make a big deal out of this one but not enforce it?

  11. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Monstro View Post
    You say these are not Disney restrictions but that is exactly what they are. The state of California says I can visit but Disney says I can't so it is by definition a Disney restriction.
    The state of CA says you can visit only if the location you want to visit is willing to be vaccine police. Disney doesn't. Their current policy is no out of state guests. Which was the same policy before CA changed the rules via an addendum to a grid summary of the current guidelines. If you want to come to CA and visit a theme park right now - go to Sea World. They are actively welcoming to fully vaccinated out of state tourists.

  12. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by currence View Post
    The state of CA says you can visit only if the location you want to visit is willing to be vaccine police. Disney doesn't. Their current policy is no out of state guests. Which was the same policy before CA changed the rules via an addendum to a grid summary of the current guidelines. If you want to come to CA and visit a theme park right now - go to Sea World. They are actively welcoming to fully vaccinated out of state tourists.
    Let's be clear about what it states.

    FULLY VACCINATED VISITORS AND SPECTATORS
    • Fully vaccinated persons from out of state may visit or attend activities or events that are restricted to in-state visitors. Fully vaccinated persons should consult the current CDPH Travel Advisory and adhere to any applicable recommendations.

    https://www.cdph.ca.gov/Programs/CID...ember_2020.pdf

  13. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monstro View Post
    Since when is Disneyland a place where no one is looking? They have cameras all over that park.
    Sometimes actual "looking" is not what integrity refers to.

    Disney is a private company and has the right to set their own rules. By buying a ticket you agree to those rules. Them not checking IDs isn't sufficient reason to break their rules. You may risk being turned away at the turnstile with no refund for the money spent on a ticket you didn't have the right to purchase. You may risk being removed at some point in the day. You may risk being banned from visiting in the future.

    If you're looking to game the system, you'll probably get away with it. If your conscious lets you feel nothing afterwards is something you'll have to deal with, not the MP audience.
    Karin


  14. #13

    We just ended up going to Disney World to get it all out of our system.

    I am fully vaccinated too and for what? Does not seem like there are any perks to that at all. I think if they want more people to get vaccinated they should give some perks to get the rest of the people off the fence.

    "If you can Dream it you can Do IT." Walt Disney


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    I think that the perks you receive from vaccination are, among others, a lower likelihood of hospitalization, intubation, and death.
    For me thats enough.
    I dont feel that anyone or any company owes me anything extra for taking care of my own health and the health of others in my community.


  16. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by sjhanksaz View Post
    I am fully vaccinated too and for what? Does not seem like there are any perks to that at all.
    Uh, not getting COVID or spreading it to other people?

  17. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Princess of Pi View Post
    I think that the “perks” you receive from vaccination are, among others, a lower likelihood of hospitalization, intubation, and death.
    For me that’s enough.
    I don’t feel that anyone or any company owes me anything extra for taking care of my own health and the health of others in my community.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shortpix77 View Post
    Uh, not getting COVID or spreading it to other people?
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    When you buy those tickets and set your reservations to the Disneyland parks right now you are also agree to Disney's rules about being a resident of the state of California. Why do this? Doesn't matter if you are in the area or not for something else or this exactly and to try to go against guidelines in place. Disney is trying to follow guidelines given to be open and its just plan disrespectful to not just the cast members that have to work there but to the residents in that city who took a major hit from COVID cases over the last year. Vaccinated or not, you can still carry COVID with you and a chance of spreading it. I just don't get why people can't just wait instead of the need to go against the rules in place. I'd be concerned if one is willing to break this rule what other ones of the COVID guidelines would a person break in the parks as well.

    A crowded day at Disneyland beats a busy day of housework!!

    According to my princess, its not Star Wars land its "You stole my goats away from me!!......in progress land"

  19. #18

    I appreciate the concern over my personal level of integrity based on this self described crazy thought. I'm not a crazy dude who wants to get banned from the parks. I love Disneyland and have been literally hundreds of times. I appreciate the guidelines they create and enforce. I do occasionally get yelled at by park staff when I do something stupid. Note: Don't turn your upper body backwards on Thunder Mountain. They don't like that but it makes the ride freaky!

    Keep in mind I have not done anything wrong at this point related to this... I've done plenty of other things but that's another story.

    I am allowed to purchase tickets to use at the park. They are good until Dec 30, 2022. Nowhere does it say I can't buy a ticket and they already took my money happily. If I can't go by then and they keep my money so be it.

    The reservation was made by another in my party in the hopes that they will open to out of state visitors by the time of our visit. I personally don't think they will change their policy by then but I hope they do. I don't know if we will be allowed to enter, if the policy will change, or if we will be denied. I certainly don't intend to cause a big stink or get banned. I was surprised they allowed us to make a reservation knowing that our Disney account is not a California address. I found this news shocking.

    My question, which has been avoided by most who have chosen to poke at my integrity rather than examining the question (thanks again for your concern, it is noted and I will do some more reflecting on my choices in life ), is why would Disney put forth this guideline and then not put forth the tools to enforce it? Those tools are readily available and yet they have chosen to not use them. Why? Are they using them and I'm misinformed? Do they plan to start enforcing them but have not yet done so but plan to start? Do they just plan to open it sooner than later so why bother? (That's the one I'm hoping for...)


  20. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Monstro View Post
    why would Disney put forth this guideline and then not put forth the tools to enforce it? Those tools are readily available and yet they have chosen to not use them. Why? Are they using them and I'm misinformed? Do they plan to start enforcing them but have not yet done so but plan to start? Do they just plan to open it sooner than later so why bother? (That's the one I'm hoping for...)
    Personally, I don't think Disney cares where you are from, as long as you have a valid ticket & registration & don't cause them to be shut down for breaking the CA rules. So as long as they publicly state that only CA can visit, if a "glitch" allows someone not from CA to make a reservation, then I don't think that they are particularly fussed. But if too many people start bragging about this "glitch" then they will start cancelling reservations from out-of-state visitors/checking IDs at the gate.

    Disney put forth the guidance to show compliance with the state rules for theme park reopening, not because of some deep seated hatred towards people from out of state and their money. Based on WDW, I don't think that they would have independently chosen that restriction, so I'm not surprised that they are not spending a ton of time/money to make sure that it is 100% foolproof. Had the out-of-state-but-fully-vaccinated visitor exception been in place at the time of the original rules, maybe Disneyland would have created a different policy. But since that wasn't added until later, there was no obligation for Disney to immediately change all of their rules, and they have publicly stated that they remain closed to non-CA visitors at this time. Whether they are actively enforcing that closure is a different issue/question, which is what you seem to be focused on.

    As to integrity, I like that this is a Board that tries to encourage others to do the moral/right thing, even if we don't always agree amongst ourselves that that is (I know my position regarding the CA restrictions differs from others on this board, but I appreciate that the conversations remain respectful). If you want advise as to the best foam to buy to stuff kid shoes so that they can reach the height limit, or what diapers/bags are best for smuggling alcohol past security there are other websites with that information. This site is much more likely to expound on why height restrictions exist and why glass containers and drunk people in the parks are bad news. So I'm not particularly surprised at the reaction you've received.

  21. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by currence View Post
    Personally, I don't think Disney cares where you are from, as long as you have a valid ticket & registration & don't cause them to be shut down for breaking the CA rules. So as long as they publicly state that only CA can visit, if a "glitch" allows someone not from CA to make a reservation, then I don't think that they are particularly fussed. But if too many people start bragging about this "glitch" then they will start cancelling reservations from out-of-state visitors/checking IDs at the gate.

    Disney put forth the guidance to show compliance with the state rules for theme park reopening, not because of some deep seated hatred towards people from out of state and their money. Based on WDW, I don't think that they would have independently chosen that restriction, so I'm not surprised that they are not spending a ton of time/money to make sure that it is 100% foolproof. Had the out-of-state-but-fully-vaccinated visitor exception been in place at the time of the original rules, maybe Disneyland would have created a different policy. But since that wasn't added until later, there was no obligation for Disney to immediately change all of their rules, and they have publicly stated that they remain closed to non-CA visitors at this time. Whether they are actively enforcing that closure is a different issue/question, which is what you seem to be focused on.

    As to integrity, I like that this is a Board that tries to encourage others to do the moral/right thing, even if we don't always agree amongst ourselves that that is (I know my position regarding the CA restrictions differs from others on this board, but I appreciate that the conversations remain respectful). If you want advise as to the best foam to buy to stuff kid shoes so that they can reach the height limit, or what diapers/bags are best for smuggling alcohol past security there are other websites with that information. This site is much more likely to expound on why height restrictions exist and why glass containers and drunk people in the parks are bad news. So I'm not particularly surprised at the reaction you've received.
    Well said!!
    A crowded day at Disneyland beats a busy day of housework!!

    According to my princess, its not Star Wars land its "You stole my goats away from me!!......in progress land"

  22. #21

    I found this interesting and related to the topic. On Disney's official website it states, "At this time, only California residents may visit the parks per current state guidelines." https://disneyland.disney.go.com/ So according to them the ban is based on the state guideline.

    Obviously when they made the decision that was 100% true and "current". However, the state guideline now contains the addendum discussed above, "Fully vaccinated persons from out of state may visit or attend activities or events that are restricted to in-state visitors."

    I find it interesting that Disney is posting the rule is per "current" state guidelines yet ignoring the addendum of the now more "current" same state guideline. I know they don't want to be the vaccine checkers but that is what the "current" guideline states.

    I'm holding out hope for an adjustment!


  23. #22
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    Disney has already made it very clear this is not something they plan to do.

    A crowded day at Disneyland beats a busy day of housework!!

    According to my princess, its not Star Wars land its "You stole my goats away from me!!......in progress land"

  24. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karin View Post
    Florida's current Covid rate is 3,155 new cases reported yesterday vs. California's 1,512. FL has 75% of the population CA does yet has twice the new cases. Something's not going well there.
    Actually, California has a populations of 39.1 million. Florida's populations is 21.5. So Florida has more like 54% of the population of CA, so it is even worse than you thought!!! (I only know this cause I have been following this to prove my brother wrong.)
    Planning 3 trips at once...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Monstro View Post
    I found this interesting and related to the topic. On Disney's official website it states, "At this time, only California residents may visit the parks per current state guidelines." https://disneyland.disney.go.com/ So according to them the ban is based on the state guideline.

    Obviously when they made the decision that was 100% true and "current". However, the state guideline now contains the addendum discussed above, "Fully vaccinated persons from out of state may visit or attend activities or events that are restricted to in-state visitors."

    I find it interesting that Disney is posting the rule is per "current" state guidelines yet ignoring the addendum of the now more "current" same state guideline. I know they don't want to be the vaccine checkers but that is what the "current" guideline states.

    I'm holding out hope for an adjustment!
    The "Adjustment" will occur 6/15/21.

    That said, they are randomly checking IDs at least last weekend.
    Planning 3 trips at once...

  26. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjhanksaz View Post
    We just ended up going to Disney World to get it all out of our system.

    I am fully vaccinated too and for what? Does not seem like there are any perks to that at all. I think if they want more people to get vaccinated they should give some perks to get the rest of the people off the fence.
    If you live in a certain city in Maryland, there is a lottery you can enter for a free car. New Jersey breweries are offering a free beer for those 21 and older. Krispy Kreme is offering a free donut a day. White Castle is giving free dessert if you have a vaccination card. West Virginia is giving $100 savings bonds.

    But I didn't mine done for any reason other than to protect my family and myself.
    Planning 3 trips at once...

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