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odnamraortsac
08-19-2002, 09:54 AM
After more than 45 years of attending Disneyland I have finally witnessed my first fight. It happened Friday night Aug. 16th at around 8 p.m. on the pathway between Tomorrowland and Main Street. I was dining at an outdoor table at the Plaza Inn when the brawl began. Five idiots were beating up one individual. Lucky for the guy being beaten up that he fell behind one of those little fences that keep you off of the grass. The fence made it difficult for the agressors to kick or hit him any worse that they already had. Of course Security was nowhere to be found which I found strange since the 8 p.m. "Parade of the Stars" was about to begin and you'd think there would be a few of them around. Anyway the fight just ended after less than a minute and everybody scattered. I did see one Security guy patrol the area about five minutes after the incident ended. For a second I thought I was at Magic Mountain. Makes me kind of glad for the security search at the gate. Does any one know if there are metal detectors at the entrance to Disneyland?

MouseWife
08-19-2002, 10:20 AM
This is terrible. Does sound like Magic Mountain.

Do you know if the guy knew the attackers? Did security help the victim at all?

Could he have possibly been robbed or did it seem like one of those 'Hey, you wuz lookin at my girl!' type of things?

Agh!! I hate this sort of *stuff*.

How did the crowd react? Was it just so crowded at the time that not too many people noticed?

Ghoulish Delight
08-19-2002, 10:24 AM
There are no metal detectors. And how exactly would metal detectors have prevented this? Unless one of the guys doing the beating was named Logan, there's no metal in their fists.

I'm not surprised security was slow to respond at that time. With the parade starting soon, and a crowd forming for Fantasmic!, security and crowd control are stretched to their thinest at that time of day.

corrinhorn
08-19-2002, 10:28 AM
Security may have also been on a major Paramedic fun, I do not know if there was one, but I was working that night. If it was Friday night, then I am sure it was a "looking at my girl" thing, most fights are that way...

disguy
08-19-2002, 10:45 AM
I'm sorry but I think "thugz" should be left out of the gate. I hate that and that is exactly why I stay away from Magic Mt Fri&Sat. It makes me sick. To think Disney didn't notice just goes to show the lack of security they "really" have. It's like I said before people THINK they have tons of cameras and such but It's all in our heads I'm sure.

rexfarms
08-19-2002, 11:05 AM
We need more security and Disney shouldnt let some guests in. As disguy said Thugz should be left outside the gates.

bluepearl
08-19-2002, 11:31 AM
People you might think are "thugz" can behave themselves as well. Just like everybody else, there are a few bad apples in the world, but that doesn't mean you have to pigeonhole all of them. I'm not discounting the event on Friday, but I've got a couple of relatives that would probably be called thugs because of the way they dress and look on the outside. But I know they'd know better than to act up in a place like Disneyland...they have the same view of Disneyland as I do.

MammaSilva
08-19-2002, 11:36 AM
I have to add my .02 on the "no thugz", once in the Indiana Jones exit queue, my evc "died" it wouldn't climb out of there.....my nephews and niece and brandy were too small to help, I was just about to turn around and go ask a CM for assistance when a group of tatoo'd, scarf wearing, low hung pants sagging group of young men that in all honesty would have made me think twice about walking past them in a deserted area, stepped up, asked if they could help and proceeded to PUSH that evc with my large behind ON it out of the queue, up to flat land where it had just enough power to get it back to the front gate to trade for a fully charged one....another one of the many things that have happened in my life that says never judge a book by it's cover.....some of the rudest people I've had the misfortune to deal with at Disneyland have been dressed "nicely" and Looked "mainstream normal".....jerks come in all shapes and sizes and tastes in clothes

Sailor Butterfly
08-19-2002, 11:49 AM
Originally posted by Ghoulish Delight
There are no metal detectors. And how exactly would metal detectors have prevented this? Unless one of the guys doing the beating was named Logan, there's no metal in their fists.

I think the point being made is that without metal detectors, a fistfight can easily escalate into a knifefight or worse.

cstephens
08-19-2002, 11:52 AM
Originally posted by disguy
I'm sorry but I think "thugz" should be left out of the gate. I hate that and that is exactly why I stay away from Magic Mt Fri&Sat. It makes me sick. To think Disney didn't notice just goes to show the lack of security they "really" have. It's like I said before people THINK they have tons of cameras and such but It's all in our heads I'm sure.

And exactly how would you be able to figure out who would be inclined to get into a fight at an amusement park and prevent them from entering and having a basis for barring them? Pre-crime devices don't exist in real life.

I'm not sure why people think there are cameras everywhere and that they're watching everything everyone does at all times. Frankly, I'd hate that. I blame people for behaving badly, not Disney for being unable to be at every single incident.

disguy
08-19-2002, 12:22 PM
Originally posted by cstephens


And exactly how would you be able to figure out who would be inclined to get into a fight at an amusement park and prevent them from entering and having a basis for barring them? Pre-crime devices don't exist in real life.

I'm not sure why people think there are cameras everywhere and that they're watching everything everyone does at all times. Frankly, I'd hate that. I blame people for behaving badly, not Disney for being unable to be at every single incident.

Well that's easy! when they see someone that looks like a "thug" just have the cm at the gate ask nicely "Are you a thug?" and if they say yes just don't let them in.

hbquikcomjamesl
08-19-2002, 12:51 PM
THUGS?!?

I wasn't aware that anybody in Disneyland was engaged in acts of ritual murder as human sacrifice to the Hindu goddess Kali.
:eek:

JeffG
08-19-2002, 01:02 PM
Originally posted by hbquikcomjamesl
THUGS?!?

I wasn't aware that anybody in Disneyland was engaged in acts of ritual murder as human sacrifice to the Hindu goddess Kali.
:eek:

There may be some of that in the Indiana Jones ride...

-Jeff

bluepearl
08-19-2002, 01:20 PM
There are serious implications in stopping anyone that looks like a thug, namely stereotyping. I understand the need for safety, but the whole idea of filtering who can and cannot come into Disneyland is ridiculous to me. If they created a disturbance within the park, I can understand being asked to leave. But if a person hasn't even done anything and is denied entrance solely on their appearance, I disagree.

rexfarms
08-19-2002, 01:36 PM
I'm just saying, dont you remember the days when Disneyland wouldnt let some people in the park, i.e. men with long hair, yippies...etc. They need to do some more of this. You know what I mean.

cstephens
08-19-2002, 01:39 PM
Originally posted by rexfarms
I'm just saying, dont you remember the days when Disneyland wouldnt let some people in the park, i.e. men with long hair, yippies...etc. They need to do some more of this. You know what I mean.

Yep, I know what you mean - discriminate. Yep, that's a great solution.

Because men with long hair are inherently dangerous, of course.





(waiting...)

MammaSilva
08-19-2002, 01:40 PM
rexfarms I am going to assume you are joking.....that type of behavior wasn't acceptable when it WAS happening and it most certainly isn't appropriate now! Where do we stop, oh ok only those with BROWN eyes are allowed into this establishment? ....please tell me that I'm just not catching the "tone" correctly

innerSpaceman
08-19-2002, 03:49 PM
Originally posted by bluepearl
There are serious implications in stopping anyone that looks like a thug, namely stereotyping. I understand the need for safety, but the whole idea of filtering who can and cannot come into Disneyland is ridiculous to me.
They tried to do this quite a bit in the era of Videopolis (mid-80's). Seems all kinds of punked-out kids were thronging to the park to play at this fairly cool dance spot. Most of these kids were not dangerous, just looked that way. Eventually, it was the 'undesirable' look of the clientele that did away with Videopolis, as Disney realized there was no legitimate way to keep kids out based solely on their mode of dress.

odnamraortsac
08-19-2002, 03:52 PM
Just to add a few details to my post. I agree that it was possibly one of those "He was looking at my Girl" incidents because it was a female that was trying to pull her boyfriend away from the fight. Security could not have helped the victim because, as I said earlier, everyone scattered quickly after the incident. I don't know if the victim seeked help from First Aid or if he even reported the incident. My guess is that he left the park as soon as possible. My point about the metal detectors was that if the perpetrators had knives, or worse guns, a simple fistfight could have escalated to a more tragic incident. How do you avoid this type of thing happening? I don't know. "Profiling" guests is politically incorrect. Besides as the old saying goes,"You can't judge a book by looking at the cover". But at least metal detectors, perhaps hidden in the turnstiles to not disrupt the "Magic", could keep weapons out of the park. But then again, the September 11 hijackers accomplished their mission with plastic knives so what can you do? No one in the area of the fight was inclined to try and break it up and I don't blame them. I wasn't going to jump the fence from the Plaza Inn and try to be the peacekeeper .

Lani
08-19-2002, 04:19 PM
Oh boy. All I can say is that is that if I were there with my camera handy, I would have spent all my time taking photos of them so security could later identify the parties involved.

Call me a tattle-tale. I would rather help than to turn my back, and "helping" for me does not involve punching any member of either party with my fists.

Alex S.
08-19-2002, 04:35 PM
tattle tale

Andrew
08-19-2002, 04:55 PM
Originally posted by cstephens
Because men with long hair are inherently dangerous, of course.

(waiting...)

Hey! :eek:

Although, according to security at the DtD Monorail station, the Leatherman I always carry on my belt is dangerous... but if I put it in my pocket instead, it's not.

The moral is that rather than trying to "guess" at the gate what evils a Guest might perpetrate, Disney should a) encourage Guests to be on best behavior and b) have visible security. They're doing (b) but not (a), really. Some malls have a "Code of Conduct" posted at all the entrances--why couldn't Disneyland do something similar?

saturday97
08-19-2002, 05:08 PM
A few months ago, I was at Disneyland for a day and then spent the following day at Universal Studios. I have to say I felt much more comfortable and safer at Disneyland. When I think about the crowds at both places, they were pretty much the same in that there was a variety of folks. But I think that Disneyland does a better job at creating a feeling of safety than the other parks. In my experience, people behave better at Disney because they are expected to, and if I had witnessed a fight at Disney, I would have had more confidence in security (even though you mention they showed up after the fight broke up).

rexfarms
08-19-2002, 05:31 PM
Originally posted by cstephens


Yep, I know what you mean - discriminate. Yep, that's a great solution.

Because men with long hair are inherently dangerous, of course.

(waiting...)

Pardon me but I am a man, and I do have long hair. You know what I mean, they do need more of a code of conduct. I am just saying that things should go to to how things where when Walt was around. That can be said for a lot of things.

tredla
08-19-2002, 06:25 PM
Originally posted by Lani
Oh boy. All I can say is that is that if I were there with my camera handy, I would have spent all my time taking photos of them so security could later identify the parties involved.

Call me a tattle-tale. I would rather help than to turn my back, and "helping" for me does not involve punching any member of either party with my fists.


I couldn't agree more. The only way to stop this kind of stuff is to get involved. for example if i'm on an airplane and someone pulls a box knife or something i'm not gona stay in my seat my point is if about five guys got involved the fight would have been shorter if we always wate for security more and more people will keep geting hurt at some point we have to police our selves.