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Pony Sugrue
07-11-2002, 04:24 PM
Found this interesting from Jim Hill (it was from a few months ago)?:


Well, one of the projects that reportedly got talked about at last week's "Town Hall" meeting was WDI's proposed redo of Disneyland's "Pirates of the Caribbean." (Again, for those who don't know, Walt Disney Imagineering supposedly has something very special in the works for the Anaheim theme park's 50th anniversary. According to the current scenario, five of Disneyland's most popular attractions - the Haunted Mansion, the Jungle Cruise, it's a small world, Space Mountain and Pirates of the Caribbean - are each slated to receive significant makeovers before that park's year long anniversary celebration gets underway in January 2005. These multi-million dollar makeovers will allegedly include installation of elaborate new special effects and even whole new sequences being folded into these Disneyland fan favorites in an attempt to freshen up these venerable old attractions.

Don (Goodman) & Marty (Sklar) revealed WDI's preliminary plans for the redo of Disneyland's "Pirates" ride. These reportedly involve a significant upping on the "Wow!" factor in the attraction's harbor sequence. Instead of just floating past a single pirate ship firing on an old Spanish fort, guests would now find themselves quickly caught in the crossfire between two huge warring galleons. According to the proposed new layout for this sequence, the tourist-filled bateaus would pass through the very heart of the battlefield - with simulated cannon balls whizzing just inches above guests heads.

Also, WDI wants to expand & clarify the whole "Pirates of the Caribbean" curse storyline. That's why the Imagineers plan to add that giant flaming skull from Tokyo Disney Seas' "Indiana Jones Adventure" attraction to the tail end of the treasure cave portion of Disneyland's "Pirates" ride. After all, what better way is there to get across to guests that something strange & supernatural is about to happen than to have them float under a giant flaming skull that's spouting lines like "Who knows when that evil curse will strike the greedy beholders o' this bewitched treasure?".
Anyone else see this?

Does anyone know anything about what is planned for the other four "popular" attractions?

coronamouseman
07-11-2002, 04:57 PM
Interesting concept but raises some questions:

(1) Do they refurbish them all at once, leaving the park in shambles for the 6 months leading up to the big party or do they phase in the changes (which will detract a little from the marketing impact - a big bang is always better than a protracted rollout)

(2) Could such an event cut into development at DCA or more importantly, could the need for more DCA attractions cut into budget or resources for the 50th upgrades? Once ToT is built at DCA it will now be a 4-big-ride park instead of a 3-big-ride park - will DCA still need at least a 5th big ride or even a 6th before it can expect to reach a level where full price admissions can be charged and expected to be paid?

Dean Higgins
07-11-2002, 05:03 PM
Boy I sure would hate to see DCA's failure and consequent need of attention ruin DL's 50th anniversary.

stan4d_steph
07-11-2002, 05:07 PM
There's been some discussion of this on other, old threads. As you said, the article is from a few months ago.

This thread (http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/showthread.php?threadid=7005) has some discussion of upcoming plans for the 50th.

This other thread (http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/showthread.php?threadid=4401) has a discussion of the Jim Hill article.

There's also some discussion here (http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/showthread.php?threadid=4233) and here (http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/showthread.php?threadid=4212).

Pony Sugrue
07-11-2002, 05:16 PM
Yeah I was trying to find the article on DCA Central but that sight is now defunct. That's why I quoted Jim here; having no other way to show anyone.

Gee, you'd think that a page like "DCA central"; dedicated to how awesome DCA is would have lasted forever.

DisneylandKid
07-11-2002, 07:40 PM
I somewhat know what Pirates' storyline is, but could someone write it here in more detail... I think that improving the clarification of the storyline would be a good idea for the 50th.
Do they refurbish them all at once, leaving the park in shambles for the 6 months leading up to the big party or do they phase in the changes (which will detract a little from the marketing impact - a big bang is always better than a protracted rollout)
I also had this same question.

Ghoulish Delight
07-11-2002, 07:51 PM
The PoTC storyline...

You start in the "present." You find greedy, debauched pirates hording mounds of gold and living it up. Having seen this cursed treasure, you are informed via Mr. Spooky voice that you are in danger. Notice that all those pirates are dead, killed (at least indirectly) by the curse. The implication is that if you are stupid enough to go after the treasure, you too will end up dead (and morally depraved, as we soon will find out).

To illustrate the point, Mr. Spooky voice has you transported to the past where you find yourself in the middle of a group of Pirates sacking a Spanish colony. Their greed leads to debauchery of all sorts. Not an attractive life (well, at least that's what you're supposed to get out of it. Personally, "I wants da' red head!"). Finally, you stumble across a group of these fiends who have discovered the treasure. As you ascend the lift hill, you are gradually returning forward in time. The skeletons you see on your left are meant to represent the ultimate fate of those two trying to drag the loot up the hill.

DisneylandKid
07-11-2002, 08:11 PM
Originally posted by Ghoulish Delight
The PoTC storyline...

You start in the "present." You find greedy, debauched pirates hording mounds of gold and living it up. Having seen this cursed treasure, you are informed via Mr. Spooky voice that you are in danger. Notice that all those pirates are dead, killed (at least indirectly) by the curse. The implication is that if you are stupid enough to go after the treasure, you too will end up dead (and morally depraved, as we soon will find out).

To illustrate the point, Mr. Spooky voice has you transported to the past where you find yourself in the middle of a group of Pirates sacking a Spanish colony. Their greed leads to debauchery of all sorts. Not an attractive life (well, at least that's what you're supposed to get out of it. Personally, "I wants da' red head!"). Finally, you stumble across a group of these fiends who have discovered the treasure. As you ascend the lift hill, you are gradually returning forward in time. The skeletons you see on your left are meant to represent the ultimate fate of those two trying to drag the loot up the hill.
Wow. That's deep for a theme park attraction. But then again, it's no ordinary theme park!

MonorailMan
07-11-2002, 08:14 PM
Originally posted by DisneylandKid

Wow. That's deep for a theme park attraction. But then again, it's no ordinary theme park!

You can say that again! :)

chalkboy8
07-12-2002, 05:30 AM
Originally posted by Pony Sugrue
Yeah I was trying to find the article on DCA Central but that sight is now defunct. That's why I quoted Jim here; having no other way to show anyone.

Gee, you'd think that a page like "DCA central"; dedicated to how awesome DCA is would have lasted forever.

chalkboy8
07-12-2002, 05:32 AM
Originally posted by Pony Sugrue
Yeah I was trying to find the article on DCA Central but that sight is now defunct. That's why I quoted Jim here; having no other way to show anyone.

Gee, you'd think that a page like "DCA central"; dedicated to how awesome DCA is would have lasted forever.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



__________________
Sort of like a sote called www.InnoventionsWeekly.com

chalkboy8
07-12-2002, 05:35 AM
Sort of like a sote called www.InnoventionsWeekly.com

i meant site not sote. grrrrrrrr I'm still a newbie and learning how to post with quotes.

Bill Catherall
07-12-2002, 07:02 AM
There's also a handy-dandy "Edit/Delete" button down in the lower right corner of your post that lets you go back and fix them instead of trying it 3 times. ;) :D

RStar
07-12-2002, 08:34 AM
Originally posted by chalkboy8
Sort of like a sote called www.InnoventionsWeekly.com

i meant site not sote. grrrrrrrr I'm still a newbie and learning how to post with quotes.

I've only been on for 4 months now, and still learning (I have no idea how to post a link the way you did!) and I had a time trying to figure out how to post only a part of a quote. I easily figured out that you hit the "Quote" button. So now I just click to the left of the part you don't want and backspace untill I have erased all that I don't want. But be carefull not to erase any of the quote code in [brackets like these] or it won't come out right!;) Hang in there you'll get it.

Bob

Pony Sugrue
07-12-2002, 10:56 AM
Chalkboy,

some of this stuff can be tricky. I still can't figure out how folks get images on the posts myself.

By the way, your "tagline" about "Old Yeller had it coming to him" is rather disturbing (not that my tags aren't disturbing themselves). Even though "Yeller" did growl and look mean at the end, how can you not love the "Best doggone dog in the west". He couldn't help it that he got the "Hydro-phoby"from that wolf... or wild pigs... or whatever gave it to him.

RealDisneyLegend
07-12-2002, 11:07 AM
I don't usually reveal Imagineering's secrets, but I'll let you know what we have planned for Pirates:

REAL Cannonballs!

We've developed technology to accurately aim and fire cannonballs so they (usually) never miss the boats. Instead of seeing the "poof" and hearing the splash, an actual 120# cannon ball will go whizzing above your heads.

Just don't stand up as you pass the pirate ship.

Ghoulish Delight
07-12-2002, 11:26 AM
Originally posted by RealDisneyLegend
I don't usually reveal Imagineering's secrets, but I'll let you know what we have planned for Pirates:

REAL Cannonballs!

We've developed technology to accurately aim and fire cannonballs so they (usually) never miss the boats. Instead of seeing the "poof" and hearing the splash, an actual 120# cannon ball will go whizzing above your heads.

Just don't stand up as you pass the pirate ship. Ack, you see. THIS is how stupid rumors get started. People, adjust your sarcasm-o-meters. This one's off the scale :p :D

HowardBeale
07-12-2002, 12:56 PM
I love the justification that after 40 years, we now have to have some explanation for the whole "Lore of the Pirates"

Are we all suddently that stupid? Or is it just easier to re-do an attraction for $2million, than to build a new one for $20.

Give me a frickin' yo-ho-yo-ho break.

Ghoulish Delight
07-12-2002, 01:13 PM
Well excuse me, but I was never completely clear on the Pirates storyline until I discussed it with people. I mean, there's not a single thing that really tells you the full story. All you can really get is "Umm, some dead pirates. Uh something about a cursed treasure. Okay, it's really dark now. Oh, hey live pirates in a ship! Ooh, look, they're ransacking a town, selling women, chasing women (er.. food), and burning things. Hrmm a couple are in jail. They're pretty much all drunk. Some are shooting at each other (that doesn't seem too bright) and a couple are trying to lug treasure away (an element added late in the ride's life). Oh, look, more dead ones." Not particularly telling.

Now, personally, not realizing that there was an attempt at an underlying coherent story never ruined it for me. It was still one of my favorites. But, now that I know there is a story, I don't blame them for wanting to be a bit more, well, coherent with it. Plus, some new effect to liven up an old attraction isn't such a bad idea.

I'd thank you not to attack people's intelligence in this matter. I don't like to brag, but I must in this case to get my point accross (okay, maybe I like to a little). I happen to be a pretty bright person, if I may toot my own horn here for a minute. I also happen to know a lot of pretty bright people. And many many people (myself included) do not see the whole picture of Pirates without a little explanation. Most can follow the general idea of pirates attacking by sea, then landing and taking over the town. But the link between the skeletal pirates, to the treasure, to the living pirates is a pretty weak one.

merlinjones
07-12-2002, 03:11 PM
Can't they just leave Walt & Marc's masterpiece alone?

I really don't believe that tarting up the already popular e-tickets will increase the gate as much as bringing back long gone favorites in a tarted up form would inspire nostalgia visits (flying saucers, subs, Inner space, Hook's ship, golden horseshoe, skyway, Tomorrowland etc).

Or simply a cool new e-ticket.

dsnyredhead
07-12-2002, 06:07 PM
So are they adding a loop?

Matterhorn Fan
07-12-2002, 07:31 PM
It took me a while to figure out the "storyline" of Pirates, too.

It helps if you can hear all of the narration, which doesn't always happen, partially because often there's noice in the ride. Also you usually don't get to hear all of what that first skull says ("you come seeking adventure," "dead men tell no tales," etc.). Then "dead men tell no tales" is repeated before you see the first scenes with the skeleton pirates, before you get to the treasure room. (The captain may have his treasure, but he didn't live to tell about it--evil curses, anyone?)

After the treasure room, you enter the "dark tunnel." The voice there speaks of evil curses: "no fear hath ye of evil curses sez you. Properly warned ye be sez I. Who knows when that evil curse will strike the greedy beholders of this bewitched treasure." "Dead men tell no tales" is repeated. Then another voice says "perhaps he knows too much. He's seen the cursed treasure, he knows where it be hidden. Proceed at your own risk. These be the last friendly words you'll hear. You may not survive to pass this way again." That's us he's talking about.

Then you go through all that mist, and suddenly you're in the middle of the battle. The rest is pretty self-explanatory.

When you go up the waterfall, you see those two guys trying to get away with the treasure, as well as their fate. If it isn't clear from the skeletons that they don't get away with it, you get the echoing voice, telling you again that "dead men tell no tales."


It's all there in the narration (once you actually listen to it--and it was years before I did). I'm still wondering, however, how a flaming skull is going to make the storyling easier to follow? The line attributed to the flaming skull by Jim Hill in the quote the first poster in this thread provided (wow, that's a mouthful) is the same line that's already there. Is the flaming skull supposed to make us listen?

CaptainNemo
07-12-2002, 09:25 PM
It wouldn't be surprising if P of the C gets a makeover, as it will tie into the feature film also coming out in the near future. That's right: Pirates of the Caribbean-The Movie. There they can tell, in gory detail, the story of the bewitched treasure and its greedy beholders...uh, yes, it's true!

Ghoulish Delight
07-13-2002, 08:15 AM
Originally posted by CaptainNemo
It wouldn't be surprising if P of the C gets a makeover, as it will tie into the feature film also coming out in the near future. That's right: Pirates of the Caribbean-The Movie. There they can tell, in gory detail, the story of the bewitched treasure and its greedy beholders...uh, yes, it's true! Yes, everyone is pretty well aware of the upcoming Pirates (and Haunted Mansion for that matter) movie. But I don't expect that will enter into the decission making for a Pirates overhaul. Afterall, just months before the Country Bear movie trailers hit the theater, Country Bear Jamboree at Disneyland got an overhaul....with a bulldozer. So clearly the park operations side of the company isn't focusing TOO much on attraction/movie tie-ins right now.

CaptainNemo
07-13-2002, 10:02 AM
Originally posted by Ghoulish Delight
Yes, everyone is pretty well aware of the upcoming Pirates (and Haunted Mansion for that matter) movie. But I don't expect that will enter into the decission making for a Pirates overhaul. Afterall, just months before the Country Bear movie trailers hit the theater, Country Bear Jamboree at Disneyland got an overhaul....with a bulldozer. So clearly the park operations side of the company isn't focusing TOO much on attraction/movie tie-ins right now.


Wait a minute, you mean that the Country Bears aren't playing at DL anymore...?!? ; ^)
(Gosh, I wasn't aware...doy!)

So, uh, apparently the Pirates will be bulldozed shortly before the film releases, eh? Well, some may say "Synergy" but they just mean total destruction of Walt's legacy...yup!

(/sarcasm)