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tonytone
07-09-2007, 11:11 AM
Yes, I know you folks have probably read dozens and dozens of "line-cutting" stories in the past...but I just had to get this particular line-cutting incident off my chest:

So here we (my family and I) were, first in line at Aladdin waiting for the Mezzanine line queue to open up (unlike the Orchestra line queue, the Mezzanine and Balcony line queues don't open up right away); CM eventually opens the Mezzanine queue...we follow the CM to the base of the stairway that leads to the Mezzanine level, where we wait until the CM gives us the okay to go up the stairs. We're still first in line at this poing, mind you...w/ about at least two dozen other folks behind us.

Anyways, we're waiting patiently when next thing I knew, these two teenage kids push their way up so that they're right next to me; I give them the "How the heck did you get all the way up to the front?" look. I think they recognized that look 'cuz the girl responded w/ a "We were told to fill in any available space in the queue"; which was pretty much complete BS because they were clearly trying to position themselves in front of me, and they kept this act up the entire time we were waiting to be let in (I kept trying to reposition myself back to the front of the line).

I'll cut to the chase--in the end, they managed to cut in front of us and hog the very center of the front row of the Mezzanine level (seven seats, front and center, to be exact). Now, the "act first, think later" part of me wanted to lay into them (verbally, not physically!) for being inconsiderate rude teenage p*nks...but I had my three small kids w/ me and didn't really want to make a scene in front of them; otherwise, believe me--I would have forcefully nudged my way in front of them...or, plopped myself right in the middle of the bunch of seats they were saving for the rest of their party (BTW, CMs clearly announce--at least a few times--that there is no seat-saving allowed) and make them try to force me out of my seat.

What got me to post this rant wasn't so much that these idiots cut in line--which is rude in itself--but that they had the gall to cut to the very front (they weren't even in the pre-waiting area prior to the CM opening up the Mezzanine line queue) of the line...and on top of that, save seats for the rest of their party who were quite a ways behind us. :mad: BTW--I have little respect for the adults that were in their group (I think they were the kids' mother/aunt), as well--especially given comments like "I can't believe you were able to get us such great seats!" that were coming out of their mouths. Boy, was I tempted to respond by saying "Well yeah, I could get great seats too if I cut in front of everybody else..."--actually, I would have probably interjected a few rude words into that reply. In retrospect, I wish I did...but again, I didn't want this incident to possibly lead to a shouting/arguing match in front of the kids...so it's probably just as well that I didn't.

Had they been honest w/ us and just flatout asked if they could get in front of us so that they could get good seats--rather than BS me w/ the "we're just filling in space" baloney--I may have been more receptive to accomodating their request.

As it is--they may think that they were able to get away with what they did because they felt that I may have been too intimidated to say/do anything about it...well, such is farther from the truth--like I said, the main reason I didn't raise a big stink about it is that I had my three small kids w/ me.

How would you have handled such a situation if you were in my exact shoes (remember, I had my little kids w/ me)? Believe me, I was really tempted to say and/or do stuff that I may either should have phrased a bit more appropriately...or regret doing altogether...but I somehow managed to keep my cool.

Sorry for the long post--I just had to rant... ;)

P.S.--to the two teenage line cutters (and the rest of their line-cutting party) at the 7/8 1:50pm Aladdin show...if you're reading this--you know who you are, and you're lucky I had my kids w/ me--otherwise, I guarantee you would not have gotten away with what you pulled.

Boo's Mommy
07-09-2007, 11:16 AM
I'm sorry that happened! I can't believe that the CM holding you at the stairs didn't say anything to them!!

houseofmouse
07-09-2007, 11:22 AM
I think you do what I would have done with my kids in line with me. Although I might have started a conversation with my children within ear shot of the rude line cutting teenagers. Something like" Wow, aren't they so lucky they made it all the way up here filling in the avaliable space?" My kiddos are older though, 8,11,13 most likely would have said" Mom, why did they cut in the line?" That would have lead to a whole conversation about line etiquette. I think you did the right thing and set a good example for your kids. :)

Seashellmama
07-09-2007, 11:33 AM
I'm not really sure what you considered doing that was so terrible as to not do it in front of small children- in some sense, letting them cut in front of you that way may have been an even poorer example to set than standing up for your position would have been. I would hope that I would have at least told a CM in the area about it, and might also have found the strength to respond negatively to "they told us to fill all available space", perhaps with, "that doesn't mean pushing in front of people who have been waiting, and we're here, thanks," but I'm kind of a wimp (and not because I have small children with me, though I do).

wwithers
07-09-2007, 12:02 PM
Personally, I would have politely said, "I'm sorry, the line is back there, we are all anxious to get in" and pointed to the back of the line. If they gave me the BS about "seat fillers" I would have said, "well you need to talk to the CM about that, but I've been waiting at the front of the line for X amount of time, you haven't." And if they still didn't move, I would have called a CM over.

You can be polite, yet very firm. The fact that you had 3 small kids with you doesn't mean you should be a pushover, kids should learn that there are rules to follow and consequences for rudeness.

june1st1997
07-09-2007, 12:03 PM
Let me start with... that just plain sucks. I hate that stuff.

And I know what you mean... the instinct to act and then the thought as to what you should do, instead of just acting.

Ya know my dad is the guy who would say something and as a kid it not only embarrased me, but made me feel unsafe. I'm guessing your response would have been different than his... But I never knew how someone would react to my father's demand for courtesy. Isn't that strange, to demand courtesy... He is a very polite man with a very short fuse.

I also understand the desire to teach your kids not to be pushed around...
But you had no idea how these teens were going to react. Maybe they would have slinked away, maybe they would have gotten mouthy... Maybe it could have gotten out of hand... Especially with your kids around, I think ya gotta err on the side of caution.

I have no idea if you did the correct thing. I will say this... You did exactly what I would have done. I would have wanted to say something, but I doubt I would have.

I will say to you what I would hope someone would have said to me...

I bet it felt crappy. But this nameless, faceless fellow MP supports what you did 100%

Walt'sbirthdaygirl
07-09-2007, 12:09 PM
If I were alone (or with adults) I would have stood my ground, it makes my husband crazy but I hate when line cutters hop in front of me, or people push in front of me during parades fantasmic, etc... I will manuever myself back into position and not let them back in front.

With the kids however, a totally different story, at that point you have to just hope that their sense of decency kicks in as you make pointed comments. It sucks, but it is Disneyland and you really dont want to spoil the day by getting into a confrontation with rude guests.

codewoman
07-09-2007, 12:30 PM
It is this kind of thing that prompted me to buy Fantasmic balcony seats for our visit. My husband would have his evening ruined if we waited a long time to see the show and then someone hustled in front of us. I figured I'd do us all a favor and set us up right.

That said, I am no longer afraid of teens (in most situations). I have found that if you ask them kindly and casually to do what they know they should be doing (Hey guys, we're ahead of you in line. Please stand behind us.), they'll usually comply. Example, give up your seat on the train since you're sitting in the handicapped one and someone here needs it. The more people who are around, the more likely it will work. Also, if you're in a place like a baseball stadium or an amusement park where you can get backup from security, and they know it!

Would I have spoken to them, though? I'm not sure. I think what they did was wrong. And they apparently weren't going to get the message from the adults in their party. But sometimes it just isn't worth it. And it would depend on my mood and who was around.

I'm sorry it worked out for you the way it did, because it seems to have had a negative impact on your vacation. I'm glad you got an opportunity to get it off your chest, though, and I hope it helped.

Bytebear
07-09-2007, 01:01 PM
I have heard Disneyland Paris and Hong Kong Disneyland both have huge issues with line cutting. I guess waiting patiently is not a cultural standard.

oregontraveler
07-09-2007, 01:18 PM
That's a tough call, be a jerk in front of your own kids or bite the bullet.
However, as a solo traveler headed to the park next week, I'll keep my eye out on line cutters and point them out to the CM's. Hope that makes you feel better. :cool:

mynameisearl
07-09-2007, 02:43 PM
First of all, I am sorry for your experience. It sounded really frustrating.

I think if something like that were to happen in the future you could politely and tactfully tell them that what they were doing is not okay. This is a learned practice! But it is what boundaries are all about. I read a book years ago that has been life changing for me. It is called "Boundaries" by Dr.'s Cloud and Townsend. Check it out if you get the chance.

Leofoenget
07-09-2007, 04:24 PM
Couldn't you have said something to the CM? You can stand your ground in front of your kids without getting into a fist fight with the line cutters. How about: "Excuse me but please stop trying to cut in front of me. The line is back there" If they give you lip tell the CM. They can't pull the "we are trying to meet up with our party" bit since you were FIRST IN LINE. I totally would have told them sorry no way you are cutting in front of me nice try. Standing up for yourself in front of your kids is a good thing.

Crazy4DL
07-09-2007, 07:53 PM
Not a doubt in my mind that I would have had said something like "excuse me, the line starts back there". Firm but nice almost always works for me but maybe it is my age or my mom voice I can pull out when needed.

Did no one behind you object either? :confused:

I am sorry you had that pulled on you - ugh!

wvnative
07-10-2007, 08:12 AM
Chances are pretty good that I would not have been able to keep my mouth shut. I also travel with a teenager(s) who wouldn't dare to cut in line. She's used to my standing my ground by now. lol If nothing else we would have had a conversation about their bad manners within earshot of them and the adults in their party. Unfortunately, I have embarrassed her in the past by calling people on stuff like this, but now that she's a little older she understands a lot better.

Doing what you did was probably better than losing your cool in front of your kids though since this seems to have really hit a nerve with you.

danyoung
07-10-2007, 08:19 AM
Has anyone considered that the cast member could have told them to move up? There's an assumption that a line is one or two persons wide, but in some of those queues there's a lot of room. Now, in a perfect world the people immediately behind you should have moved up into the space next to you, and no one would have jumped massively forward in the queue. This used to happen all the time at Timekeeper, where there was a totally wide space, but for some reason people would line up in a narrow 2-person wide line. When people would come in and (correctly) move forward to fill in the space, many in the little line would complain, or at least flash nasty looks. Sometimes the crowd determines its own method for lining up, and sometimes the crowd is wrong.

Tinkermommy
07-10-2007, 08:22 AM
Years ago, my brother and I (then in our 20s) were in line for something at Disneyland (I think Star Wars) and there was a section where the queue went from narrow to a wider section, then got narrow again.

At the point where it got wide, people kept trying to inch forward, going around the people in front of them. Two teenaged girls did this, and ended up in front of my brother and I when it narrowed again. One of them turned around and called to the rest of their party -- who had remained behind -- to join them. She yelled to them, "I don't know how we got separated."

I said back (loudly), "It probably happened while you were shoving your way past the rest of us."

Everybody around us laughed, but my brother was SO mad at me he didn't speak to me for about an hour...LOL!

gtpinoy
07-10-2007, 08:23 AM
I haven't been to the Aladdin showing in awhile, however, I know that at Tower of Terror prior to entering the staging room, the CMs always tell everyone to 'fill in all available dead space'. I always find people in the back of the section up front because they are just following directions.

DippyDawg32
07-10-2007, 08:57 AM
I have heard Disneyland Paris and Hong Kong Disneyland both have huge issues with line cutting. I guess waiting patiently is not a cultural standard.

I was seated at the afternoon parade on Sunday at the curb with two "visitors from the Orient" to my right. One said we have a few more family memember coming could you move down when they come - mind you I was sitting with my fat butt in the shade - I said they can sit to my left if they like - then she said, but thats in the sun and we're all fair skinned and you're wearing a big hat anyway.
Needless to say all of the fair skinned "family" - all 15 of them sat in the sun. I think it was a tour group - the one who asked me to move greeted each with a comment and pointed to me - frowns all around. Mind you to my immediate left was all sun - I was the last one in the shade.

mkraemer
07-10-2007, 09:17 AM
I have heard Disneyland Paris and Hong Kong Disneyland both have huge issues with line cutting. I guess waiting patiently is not a cultural standard.

I can't speak about lines at Hong Kong, but in DLP, there doesn't seem to be the sense of personal space or propriety about 'who was there first' that we seem to take so seriously. However, how valid is it for you, as a visitor to their country, to feel like you've been cut in front of when you're the one imposing your perceptions on their culture? C'est la vie...

cynthia312
07-10-2007, 11:10 AM
I was seated at the afternoon parade on Sunday at the curb with two "visitors from the Orient" to my right. One said we have a few more family memember coming could you move down when they come - mind you I was sitting with my fat butt in the shade - I said they can sit to my left if they like - then she said, but thats in the sun and we're all fair skinned and you're wearing a big hat anyway.
Needless to say all of the fair skinned "family" - all 15 of them sat in the sun. I think it was a tour group - the one who asked me to move greeted each with a comment and pointed to me - frowns all around. Mind you to my immediate left was all sun - I was the last one in the shade.

I don't know if you're trying to be racist here but do you HAVE to put comments like "visitors from the ORIENT" or "all of the fair skinned family" while trying to explain what happened to you????? I'm sorry that you have to experience something like this, but adding that they're fair skinned or "orient" doesn't make your point any different....it just sounds like you're being racist towards asian...or "orient" people.

In fact I've seen many different races do EXACTLY what you just described up there....hispanics, americans, people from india, and yes..."orient" people as well. But once again, what does putting "visitors from Orient" prove??????

Greg in TN
07-10-2007, 12:09 PM
I don't know if you're trying to be racist here but do you HAVE to put comments like "visitors from the ORIENT" or "all of the fair skinned family" while trying to explain what happened to you?

Sounds to me like they were the ones who called themselves "fair skinned" & he was simply quoting them. :rolleyes:

danyoung
07-10-2007, 01:02 PM
I thought the descriptors "Orient" and "fair skinned" added to the story. I'm sorry, but it bugs me that we live in a society where we can't even use descriptive words that are accurate and valid, for fear of being called racist. If I'm telling a story, and the race of the other people in the story adds to the clarity of what I'm trying to say, then those are the words I'm going to use. I don't condone racism, or even generalizing. But Dawg's story used the words needed to tell the story.

wwithers
07-10-2007, 01:16 PM
I thought the descriptors "Orient" and "fair skinned" added to the story. I'm sorry, but it bugs me that we live in a society where we can't even use descriptive words that are accurate and valid, for fear of being called racist. If I'm telling a story, and the race of the other people in the story adds to the clarity of what I'm trying to say, then those are the words I'm going to use. I don't condone racism, or even generalizing. But Dawg's story used the words needed to tell the story.

Agreed.

ladodgerjon
07-10-2007, 01:24 PM
I have heard Disneyland Paris and Hong Kong Disneyland both have huge issues with line cutting. I guess waiting patiently is not a cultural standard.

I've been to Paris three times, and TDL once (No treks to HKD-- yet), but never experienced this problem. Maybe I was lucky, huh?

As for the rude kids, I guess I would have motioned to a CM to have them "plopped" into their proper (at-the-end-of-the) line placement.

tonytone
07-10-2007, 01:25 PM
To all--thanks for the support...and for the constructive criticism (and I mean that in a nice way!). FWIW--I'll try to address the constructive criticisms as best I can:

1) Re: informing the CM--I probably should have, and part of me regrets not having done so...but let's be honest here--even if he told those two to go back to where they were, they would have just told the CM that they were only doing what they were told to do--that is, fill in available space...at which point, any ensuing discussion would be pretty much a standoff...the end result probably being that nothing would be done to correct the transgression.

2) Re: I probably should have said something, polite but firm--yes, except my "problem" is that knowing what/how to say, and actually saying it sometimes don't sync with each other. I have to admit I could easily see myself escalating the discussion to the point that it may get pretty heated, with some not-so-polite comments--even if warranted--possibly coming out of my mouth.

Like I said in my initial post--it was bad enough that these two cut to the very front of the line...but they had to add insult to injury, so to speak, by saving the rest of the good seats between them once they got inside the theater. Perhaps some of you reading this thread may think that, in the overall scheme of things Disneyland, this is much ado about nothing. I will concede that, but that is besides the point--it is the principle. Again, it's one thing to cut to the very front of the line...but to add to the transgression by saving a bunch of the "good" seats also? I dare anyone to tell me that they would honestly let that fly w/o even thinking for one little moment about giving them whatfor...