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DisneylandKid
06-06-2002, 07:11 PM
I want them to save Tom Sawyer's Island, but possibly do an extensive rehab of it to bring it back to the days of its original glory.

Vote YES on Tom Sawyer's Island.

DisneylandBoy
06-06-2002, 08:28 PM
I'm sure they aren't definate on taking out Tom Sawyer's Island. They would probably try an extensive rehab (Think 1980's Fantasyland) before they took it out completely. I least, I hope they do . . .

merlinjones
06-06-2002, 10:20 PM
Save Tom Sawyer's Island!!! Save Walt's historic Disneyland!!!

PP's old hit list is getting checked off one by one as the sands run out on Disneyland as we know it... "These things must be done del-i-cate-ly..." he cackled.

coronamouseman
06-07-2002, 04:33 AM
If the lawyers have already gotten their way with Splash Mt., can Tom Sawyer Island be far behind?

A place where kids or even adults can climb, run around or simply be on their own on the property with no real guidance? A concept that sounds like it would be eventually doomed by the risk-conscious legal eagles ........

At least DL's version still has dirt - hasn't the one in the MK already been equipped with some kind of astroturf or playground-type surface?

Mr. D. Duck
06-07-2002, 05:07 AM
Originally posted by coronamouseman
If the lawyers have already gotten their way with Splash Mt., can Tom Sawyer Island be far behind?

A place where kids or even adults can climb, run around or simply be on their own on the property with no real guidance? A concept that sounds like it would be eventually doomed by the risk-conscious legal eagles ........

At least DL's version still has dirt - hasn't the one in the MK already been equipped with some kind of astroturf or playground-type surface? I was just going to say the exact thing. Disneyland's has a very rustic feeling, and that should NEVER be replaced. I'm sure that the Imagineers and lawyers could come to some form of agreement to keep it safe while keeping its rural appeal. Could they not add more soft-brush around certain areas were kids might fall? Couldn't they pad the insides of the caves? Couldn't they have, maybe, more supervision by cast members? All of these, I think, are simple solutions! Tom Sawyer's Island should DEFINITELY not leave, and neither should its rustic feeling.

I vote YES on saving TSI!

skeleton@thewheel
06-07-2002, 06:15 AM
Disneyland's has a very rustic feeling, and that should NEVER be replaced. I'm sure that the Imagineers and lawyers could come to some form of agreement to keep it safe while keeping its rural appeal.

I couldn't agree more! all this lawyer talk makes me sad...

DL has been around for so long and it's amazing what our times are doing.... changing and sanitizing things that never were a problem so long ago...

changing a scene in Pirates to make it PC

removing the cap gun from the Jungle Cruise

removing the water from Cosmic Waves

the list goes on and on....



:(

hefferdude
06-07-2002, 07:07 AM
Are they truely nuts?!!! :eek:
Please explain " taking out" Tom Sawyer Island.
Like a million to the nth other parents, some of
our deepest and best memories of what Walt
said Disneyland is all about, are rooted on the
simple adventures on Tom Sawyer Island. Scaling the
tree house, daring the pontoon bridge, exploring
the caves, climbing the rocks - skinned knees and all.

How could anyone even consider such a total loon &
bobo move? My guess is somebody paid way too much
and completely devoid of the magic of Walt's dream.
Very very sad. Wasn't the Pixar visit enough too rattle
their corporate cage ?:mad:

Ghoulish Delight
06-07-2002, 07:30 AM
Originally posted by skeleton@thewheel

removing the cap gun from the Jungle Cruise
Just to be nit-picky, it wasn't a cap gun. It was a real gun firing blanks, which is what Cal OSHA (I think that was the agency that gave the decree) gave as the reason to pull the plug. Disney COULD have replaced it with a cap gun, but they knew that would sound like crap. The only other option was to design some sort of fake gun that could emulate the sound of a real gun, but that would have cost money, and lord knows they wouldn't dare spend a dime!

ldsguy
06-07-2002, 07:43 AM
Sorry, I will be a little nitpicky myself, there was one point where they DID replace the real guns firing blanks with Cap Guns, but that only lasted for something like 3 or 4 months.

kennyhues
06-07-2002, 09:13 AM
As much as our adult memories may be near and dear to us, we can't force kids today to be interested in "simple" pleasures. There isn't much on TSI that can't be found in a community park playground - with the obvious exception of the lavish (by comparison) theming. Disneyland should be a place where you get to see and do what you can't see and do just anywhere. Do kids still play cowboys and indians anyway?

I'm more sentimental than most, but I see this differently - I'm sentimental for the days when people who knew Walt were in charge, and cared deeply about carrying the torch after his passing.

As for the comments about losing "Walt's" Disneyland, Didn't Walt himself say he hoped it would never be finished - always new and changing? I would never argue the fact that current management is using those words in a pathetically transparent attempt to justify giving us ever-cheapening downgrades, but to try to preseve DL just like it was (like a historical park?!) would be killing it. I'd rather see a TSI re-do with a totally different theme than a warmed-over rehab of what exists or a closure. Let loose the few bright young Imagineers they still have to pitch new ideas and then pick one, go heck-for-leather, and have it ready for the 50th.

hbquikcomjamesl
06-07-2002, 09:41 AM
Of course, there are also a few unpleasant memories connected with Tom Sawyer's Island. Like the smell of some of the dead-end passages in the caves.:eek:

iAmJacksDLand
06-07-2002, 09:42 AM
Ok - first of all... I love that "Pressler-B-Gone"!!!

Second... I have to aggree that TSI is definetly a special place. It is an attraction without a lap bar, where you can roam, explore, let your imagination go, (and poke around the Fantasmic stage!)

I think TSI's style has to be preserved... not neccescarily with the current theming... because things do and will eventually change.

Don't detroy the one attraction that you don't need a seat belt for! I vote yes!

mad4mky
06-07-2002, 09:52 AM
When my husband (well, 1st husband) was a kid...he and his brother would spend the whole day out on TSI...to them, it was the best thing about going to DL. They loved it...and to this day, he talks about it.

My kids hate it. All three of them (is it because they are girls?). Not one has ever wanted to go out there more than once...and only for a small amount of time at that.

Are we keeping TSI for us...the adults who have wonderful memories? (I personally would like it to stay). Or for the future of DL and what will continue to bring in the crowds...

If we keep the older attractions around, I vote to get back the Indian Village...my husband (#2 hubby) and I both loved the Indian dance circle as kids! Our families have photos and movies of us doing the dance. Will they bring it back? Of course not.
Walt said that the Magic Kingdom was ever changing...growing.

If we kept nostalgic for everything...we'd still have the InnerSpace Attraction and the House of Tomorrow :rolleyes: Oh, and don't forget that Indian Village with the great dance circle!;).
But, I still vote to keep TSI.

moxie
06-07-2002, 10:14 AM
If they take away TSI where will you go ditch unwanted members of your group? Not that, you know, I would ever do such a thing...

Can't they just post big old signs saying WE ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE or PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK with a bunch of disclaimers so that parents can't sue them if their not-so-bright children get bumped on the head?

Ghoulish Delight
06-07-2002, 10:27 AM
I would hope that if they do a re-design of TSI, they talk to whoever put together the Redwood Challenge Trail in DCA. That, to me, is the new TSI of DLR already. A great place for kids to run around, be active, and climb things. It's an updated version, and safety conscious without being safety crazy. As long as they also put some theming effort into it (and it doesn't have to be Tom Sawyer, it could be something new), I would be very happy and excited if the island ended up with something of similar quality.

justagrrl
06-07-2002, 11:05 AM
I liked the fact that they have an area for the little ones at redwood creek too. I liked that it was somewhat seperate from the other areas so that the little ones weren't trampled.

Oddly enough, the one day we've gone and played there was the day it was really windy and there were 2 or 3 fires in So. Cal...we were in the fire tower area and were literally being rained down on with ashes.

It was still great fun though!

kennyhues
06-07-2002, 11:45 AM
I'm so surprised and pleased not to have been flamed (yet) for my differing opinion. I've actually been rather coldly ridiculed in other threads for having a different view.

And I mean it - Anyone GOT a can of Pressler-B-Gone? Dang, Michael! What's it gonna take? We understand the board of directors has lit a fire under your behind to "fix things." Start by sacking Paul, before he dumbs down and ruins Disneyland's one-and-only 50th anniversary.

Mad Madam Mim
06-07-2002, 11:58 AM
I think removing TSI would change DL in a very disheartning way.... Some attraktions are staples in the diffrent "lands"! This is one of them.

Ghoulish Delight
06-07-2002, 12:28 PM
Originally posted by Mad Madam Mim
I think removing TSI would change DL in a very disheartning way.... Some attraktions are staples in the diffrent "lands"! This is one of them. Yeah, but it's a staple past its prime. I would much rather see something with the same spirit, but with more updated appeal. I agree with kennyhues that, as long as what goes in is of the same high quality as the original, replacing stuff that is no longer right for the times keeps Disneyland a living park, not a Walter Disney museum.

Mad Madam Mim
06-07-2002, 12:35 PM
Originally posted by Ghoulish Delight
Yeah, but it's a staple past its prime. I would much rather see something with the same spirit, but with more updated appeal. I agree with kennyhues that, as long as what goes in is of the same high quality as the original, replacing stuff that is no longer right for the times keeps Disneyland a living park, not a Walter Disney museum.


your right, I really cant argue that point..... i guess i just fear that today's lawyers and executives won't let the imaginears dream up anthing of the same quality :(, we haven't seen the best track record lately.

cemeinke
06-07-2002, 12:41 PM
The neat thing about TSI is that it's a themed area you can play in. After going on all these attractions that "show" you all this cool stuff, it's nice to actually be somewhere where you can touch, feel, and climb on.

I wouldn't mind an updated version. Adventure Isle in Disneyland Paris has all kinds of cool tunnels, a shipwreck, Captain Hook's ship, and skull rock to play in (not to mention Swiss Family Treehouse). The scales a bit larger but the spirit is the same, a cool environment to discover and explore.

Perhaps they could add a few thing on the otherside of the island, or add another raft leaving from Critter Country? The place is still full of potential.

Ghoulish Delight
06-07-2002, 12:56 PM
Originally posted by Mad Madam Mim



your right, I really cant argue that point..... i guess i just fear that today's lawyers and executives won't let the imaginears dream up anthing of the same quality :(, we haven't seen the best track record lately. I have this same fear. Unfortunately, as a guests and fans, we're stuck between a fiberglass rock and hard water, so to speak. Currently, TSI is in terrible condition. The fake rocks are worn down to the fiberglass mesh, what little color there was in the way of paint to begin with is nearly gone, and there just isn't a whole lot to do there. They could simply refurb what's there, but you and I know that's not going to happen. As a play area for children, it is so far from code it's ridiculous. But, like you mentioned, there is the danger that something substandard will replace it.

Personally, while most of the restrictions take things WAAAY to the extreme, I don't disagree with some ammount of consideration for safety when building an area that encourages children to run, jump, and climb. I'm definitely not in league with those that feel that it's Disney's responsibility to be absolutely sure there is exactly 0% chance of anyone ever getting hurt, but I do think it IS their responsibility to keep it as safe as possible without going overboard (of course, everyone's definition of where that line is drawn is different, so problems always will arise).

I am encouraged, though, by DCA in this matter. The Challenege Trail is great, and elements like the SS Rustworthy are good too. Something to climb, see, and touch, and it's built with safety concerns and fits in with the theming. So if they can combine those kinds of elements into a new and improved TSI, I'd be delighted (Ghoulish Delighted??).

MonorailMan
06-07-2002, 01:28 PM
And the one thing that sucks is on our next trip, I was going to explore TSI. I have never been there before. :(

Mad Madam Mim
06-07-2002, 02:01 PM
Originally posted by Ghoulish Delight
So if they can combine those kinds of elements into a new and improved TSI, I'd be delighted (Ghoulish Delighted??).


It's the IF, that we just have to wait and see on..... But the new improved TSI would still be a TSI. And I feel that it is a big part of.... ohhhh crap.......


Ya know.... it's pretty darn difficult to make a valid point when you can't remember if it's adventure or frontier.... i'm going to go hang my head in total shame now, i am having the BIGIST mind melt down of my life.....ahhhhhhhhh

coronamouseman
06-07-2002, 03:27 PM
GD -

I think you have a valid and optimistic point of view on this situation.

On the one hand, it's sad that the old TSI would be gone - on the other hand, what if they replaced it with something better?

Maybe better special effects in the cave of Injun Joe? How about something like the tower at Legoland where kids pull themselves up themed like a big tree in the middle of the Island? Like others have pointed out, the CT in DCA has some interesting stuff so why can't TSI in DL?

No reason why things can't get better with a little imagination, right?