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Ghoulish Delight
05-09-2002, 11:43 AM
Or, maybe I should say let's NOT put our money where our mouths are.

It is a pretty undisputed view that things at DLR are in bad shape right now. Even people like me, who enjoy DCA for what it is, recognize that it is a far cry from the quality we expect and, at the prices they charge, deserve. Add to that the decline in maintanance and guest satisfaction at Disneyland and the uninspired 'creative' decissions that have been made recently, and I really begin to wonder why the heck I should continue to hand my money to them.

I love Disney and Disneyland. It has always been linked with good times, happiness, family, etc. It is hard for me to say that, given the opportunity, I would not go to Disneyland. But I can't shake this feeling that every dollar I spend at DLR is a vote in support of the current Disney corporate philosophy. I can't help but feel that I've been contributing to it's slow and painful death.

I have come to decide that when my AP expires in August, I will NOT be renewing. Because I have already paid for it, it would be silly of me to stop visiting the resort between now and then (besides, Mad Scramble is coming up). But I vow to not spend a dime on DLR property between now and then. On top of that, I will be writing and sending letters to anyone at Disney I can. I want them to know WHY I've made this decission.

My hope is that I will not be the only one. I see people on these boards complain daily about the decline in quality of service and park standards. And yet, we have all been willingly contributing to it. With AP sales on the rise, the only message the suits receive is that they are doing something right. And the only way to tell them otherwise is to stop handing your money over, and let them know why.

Here is a good list of addresses, originally posted by Lacrosse Boy. I urge everyone to start doing something to send the message that we will not accept substandard management. Even if you continue to visit, and pay, at least write to them. Let them know your concerns. They can't ignore all of us.

Michael D. Eisner
Chairman and CEO,
The Walt Disney Company
500 South Buena Vista Street
Burbank, CA 91521
(818) 560-1000 - Main
(818) 560-1930 - Fax

Roy E. Disney
Director, Chairman of the Board
President, Disney Feature Animation
The Walt Disney Company
500 South Buena Vista Street
Burbank, CA 91521
(818) 560-1000 - Main
(818) 560-1930 - Fax

Mr. Paul Pressler
Chairman & President
Walt Disney Parks & Resorts
500 South Buena Vista Street
Burbank, CA 91521-4873

Cynthia Harriss
President,
The Disneyland Resort
Post Office Box 3232
Anaheim, CA 92803

Michael P. Berry
Senior Vice President,
Disneyland Attractions/Operations/Foods
Post Office Box 3232
Anaheim, CA 92803

Mr. Marty Sklar
Vice Chairman & Principal Creative Executive
Walt Disney Imagineering
1401 Flower Street
Glendale, CA 91221

Disneyland Guest Relations
1313 Harbor Boulevard
Post Office Box 3232
Anaheim, CA 92803

Morrigoon
05-09-2002, 11:46 AM
My visits have already gone down, as more and more of my friends drop their passes (not so much to make a statement, as it just isn't worth the money to them anymore)

I don't need an agenda to cause me to stop buying things: the prices and lack of quality in the merchandise has done it for me.

cstephens
05-09-2002, 12:12 PM
We just renewed our passes in March, and I still feel that I get great value out of them. There are things I'm not pleased about when it comes to the resort, but overall, I still have a wonderful time there. At such time that I feel otherwise, we wouldn't be renewing, but at the moment, it's not even close.

I do agree, though, that people should be making their statements with their spending power rather than just with words.

Jason Reynolds
05-09-2002, 12:46 PM
Let me ask this....

When you see that there are more than enough rides down for repair, do you feel this is taking your money in the wrong direction?

I see it as my money being spent to make things safer and more enjoyable. Do you pick a different basketball team if the one you currently like has lost a few games? I think many of you MPer's take all this a little too serioulsy and should sit back and give things a chance, you all expect the world.

I do agree that certain things need help, some items must be neglected to improve on others, that's just the way things happen in life. If I wanted to paint my house but I really had to spend the money on new tires for my car, the choice is obvious.

Let's list all of the items that are being improved:

1. Splash
2. Flick's Fair
3. Tower of Terror
4. Space Mtn. (new rockets)
5. Fantasmic
6. Big Thunder
7. King's Carrousel

Do I need to continue with this list? Why don't you people just enjoy and quit complaining, how do make the place fun for others to visit when you constantly moan and groan over every little thing.

Ghoulish Delight
05-09-2002, 01:13 PM
Follow this analogy:

Let's say you by a brand new, high end car from a car company. It is an excellent car that does everything you want. You get good customer service and the car serves you well. You pay a premium for it, but find it well worth that premium. Now, a few years down the line, you're ready to buy another new car. So, being satisfied with your prior experience, you go back to the same company. You find the same model, but this time, the quality has dropped. The service is not quite as good. And the price is HIGHER. Sure, maybe it is still a good car, but is that something you want to support? Do you want, by handing them your money, to give the company the message that this is a sound way to do business, lower the quality and raise the price?

This is exactly what I see at DLR. You're right. Maybe after all of the improvements are done, it will again be back to full par. But to me, having the audacity to charge people full price when half of the park is under a tarp is something worth putting my foot down for.

As for your list, I agree with about 50% of it.

The things I have issue with

1. Flick's Fair. Stock carnival rides. Little to no imagineering involved, and a large segment of customers (not having children) may not even be allowed to ride them.

2. Tower of Terror. A scaled down version of an already existing attraction. Much of Disney's appeal to me historically has been their innovation and imagination. This is neither.

3. Splash Mountain. An upgrade that is questionable whether it's actually needed or not, and one that is going to seriously hurt the ride. Longer lines, more restrictive limitations on who can ride, and parents who will NOT feel their children are safe.

4. Space Mountain. With an entire land that has been shuttered due to cost cutting and poor planning, new rockets is hardly something to jump up and down and celebrate about.

And, for the record, I do NOT moan and groan about EVERY little thing. I go to Disneyland, and I enjoy myself. I go with people who are not as fanatical about it as I am, and I do not go around telling them how terrible the place is. But at the same time, what, in the past, has made Disney a great theme park company IS the little things. The attention to detail, the insistance on treating every guest with respect. I have witnessed a decline in their ability to deliver that product, and therefore do not want to pay for it. And if others agree with me, the only way to exact a change in that trend is to stop paying for it. Because as long as their profits increase, no matter how many letters are written, or how much people complain on boards, they will not change a thing.

Uncle Dick
05-09-2002, 01:14 PM
I don't think I'm going to be renewing my AP in August either. Of course, if I wasn't getting in free already, I probably would. Sure Disneyland may be on a bit of a downturn right now, but it's still Disneyland for goodness sake, and it's going to get better (I hope). And with the number of APs increasing every day (according to Al), I don't know how much difference one AP is going to make. :( That's why I'm infiltrating. ;) But, hey, I admire anyone who takes a stand for the 'Land.

Ghoulish Delight
05-09-2002, 01:21 PM
Originally posted by cstephens
We just renewed our passes in March, and I still feel that I get great value out of them. There are things I'm not pleased about when it comes to the resort, but overall, I still have a wonderful time there. At such time that I feel otherwise, we wouldn't be renewing, but at the moment, it's not even close.

I do agree, though, that people should be making their statements with their spending power rather than just with words. I also feel I've gotten a good value for my money. But it's still less value than in the past. And I'm not willing to wait until things hit rock bottom before I say and do something.

Gemini Cricket
05-09-2002, 01:51 PM
I'm happy that GD had expressed his opinions in this thread. I think it's an effective way of expression. Many people feel this way about DL's decline.

After reading Ted's Tokyo Disneyland article today, I could not agree with GD more. They have E ticket "Journey to the Center of the Earth" we get B ticket "Flik's Carnival Ride Fair".

People @ Disney feel people will always come to the original Disneyland no matter what kind of quality they offer. But maybe they feel they need to entice people to come to their other parks with quality rides. I honestly feel that Disney thinks they can make more money off of their guests @, say, WDW because there are more people and more park space there. That's why newer concepts go there and not to Anaheim. When you go to WDW, you're basically trapped. You need to go very far to spend your money at a non-Disney store. In Anaheim, you just cross the street and spend a buck at 7-11.

I'm rambling, I'm not as eloquent as Goulish Delight, but I do feel we ALL can make a difference by writing Disney and their stockholders. I wish there was a listing of their stockholders so we could write them personally. Maybe then, the Mouse will use its ears to listen.

:)

Ghoulish Delight
05-09-2002, 02:08 PM
*raises his hand* I'm a stockholder! Although, I don't suppose my 60 shares has much pull :( But I send in every proxy I get, so I'm doing my part. And that's yet another reason I'm doing what I'm doing and saying what I'm saying. I have an investment in Disney. I want it to be the best it can be. For me and for everyone.

Gemini Cricket
05-09-2002, 02:14 PM
Originally posted by Ghoulish Delight
*raises his hand* I'm a stockholder! Although, I don't suppose my 60 shares has much pull :( But I send in every proxy I get, so I'm doing my part.
*pointing repeatedly with index finger* A ha! Okay, that's one. You'll be getting a firm but compassionate letter from me about the state of DL. :D

Is there a list of stockholders somewhere?
:confused:

innerSpaceman
05-09-2002, 03:34 PM
I hate to say it, but I'm going to be doing the exact opposite of what Ghoulish Delight suggests. That is, I am going to be buying an AP next week for the first time in about five years.

The decline in DLR quality and service has already prompted me to curtail my visits drastically (ok, that and the fact that I've visited thousands of times by now) and I dropped my AP some years ago. I find, however, that even with reduced visits, I still go to the Park about 4 times a year. Even at that snail's rate, I'm losing money by not buying an AP. And what with MouseAdventure being at DCA next week, well I simply refuse to purchase admission to California Adventure and an AP is the only logical way to pay for the remnant of my Disneyland habbit, which includes an addiction to MouseAdventure.

As for letter writing, I am sick of it. I have written dozens and dozens of letters to various high and low ranking Disneyland personnel, and can't see keeping at it.

Sorry to be so resigned to the poor DLR situation, but I spend the least money I can during my four annual visits. I heartily support, however, people voicing their concerns in letters of protest and voting with their wallets by not renewing their passes if that is how they choose to register their disappointment.

MickeyD
05-09-2002, 03:35 PM
Originally posted by Jason Reynolds
If I wanted to paint my house but I really had to spend the money on new tires for my car, the choice is obvious.

<snip>

Do I need to continue with this list? Why don't you people just enjoy and quit complaining, how do make the place fun for others to visit when you constantly moan and groan over every little thing.

First of all, Disney has enough money to buy the new tires and paint the house. If they honestly don't have enough money for both, maybe certain executives need to take home a little less money.


Also, I think it is a misconception that people on MousePad "moan and groan" over every little thing, and I certainly wouldn't say that anyone in this thread especially GD, is "moaning and groaning". He is simply telling us of an action that he plans to take and encouraging those who are willing to join him.

Alex S.
05-09-2002, 03:49 PM
Originally posted by Gemini Cricket
Is there a list of stockholders somewhere?
:confused:

Yes there is. But not one that is publicly available. Corporations are only required to report on certain corporate members and anybody who holds at least 5% of outstanding stock.

According to the last proxy statment (http://disney.go.com/corporate/investors/financials/pdfs/proxy_2002.pdf) there are no such stockholders (see Page 3). The top executives and board members combined only hold 2.2% of Disney stock.

There may be independent resources that compile lists of major stockholders, though.

Morrigoon
05-09-2002, 04:18 PM
One of my friends put it best when they said it is like watching an old friend die.

But yes, I still visit the friend while she's healthy enough to be visited.

MonorailMan
05-09-2002, 04:51 PM
We bought APs this year, this will prob. be our last year. Not because we hate DL, it's just we are going to explore other places. :)
(But then by then, I may have a car, and be driving, if so, I may renew.)
Also, I think (if AL is true), that ROA being closed from New Years to memorial day, really kiils our favorite part of the park. :( Also, we like DCA, but it dosen't hold a candle compared to ROA.

:)

gn2dlnd
05-09-2002, 06:03 PM
Ok, this is totally off-topic, but, it is so cool that I've become part of someone's signature! I'm blushing.

Tigertail777
05-09-2002, 06:51 PM
Well we are going to Disneyland in July for the first time in about 10 years. I am already preparing myself for dissappointment...especially with tomorrowland --I mean can you even call it a land??? I am hoping I can see tiki room, but I hear it only plays something like 3 times a day now: not every 15 minutes or so like it used to. This is why I finally decided to start my fanzine to try and preserve what is left before Disneyland burns down from neglect. The Disney company has tried to portray that everything they do has "a happy ending" to the point that that is the only thing that fans of them see, but there comes a time when a line must be drawn: you really have take a look at where they have been and where they are currently headed --take a good hard look at the many many accomplishments NEW things that Walt and his crew did in the whole time they worked: every single year something new and dazzling. Can you REALLY say that about the new company can you say that Michael invests his own money and time they way Walt did? Sure the rides had problems when Walt was alive, but how long did it take before those problems were adressed? I almost feel like the new Disney co. is the new version of Rome and will soon be taken over and or burned down. I personally will not be spending much when we go I cannot support the way things are going... I also havn't bought much other Disney merchandise because of this. I feel they could be on top again but they just keep screwing things up because of their greed, and oversight they could use far less suits than they have, and more creative people. The balance between the two is way way off. OK nuff said.

tikiboy
05-09-2002, 08:55 PM
Originally posted by Ghoulish Delight
[
Michael P. Berry
Senior Vice President,
Disneyland Attractions/Operations/Foods
Post Office Box 3232
Anaheim, CA 92803

[/B]

I thought he quit a couple of years ago to be CEO of Barnes & Noble?????

Or am I just imagining things again?

Iceman
05-09-2002, 09:48 PM
Don't get so negative before you even take your trip, Tigertail! If you adopt a pessimistic attitude, you will find fault with everything and indeed, you will not enjoy your visit. When I first went to California Adventure it was with caution from the things I'd heard, but an open mind. I ended up loving it for what it is!

I respect everyone's right to have an opinion, and I even admire GhoulishDelight for taking principled action to stand up for something he believes in. Although I don't agree with his premise, I at least salute his approach of doing SOMETHING other than simply whining on the internet.

By the way, I'm a stockholder too (with a bit more than 60 shares ;) ), but don't write to me because it won't do any good! :D

coronamouseman
05-09-2002, 10:30 PM
Article in LA Times today announced happily that DLR did far better than the 5% loss in business that was expected this past year due to 9/11 travel issues and the recession - it was reported that Disney was upbeat as they felt they were poised to be successful in the coming summer months ..............

I offer this only as a warning that those of you who are attempting a "grass roots" kind of boycott of Disney may find such a statement drowned out by a thundering herd of summer visitors arriving by car to DLR ..............

oregonzooron
05-09-2002, 11:25 PM
I feel your pain, Tigertail! Keep your chin up!

I too am hoping to get to Disneyland this summer, after an absence of some seven years. I have had to approach my reading of MousePlanet and the postings here very cautiously. Remember that the pessimism and "negativity" that you sometimes see here is often (I'm trying to tread lightly here) the result of a curious mix of love, passion and concern with a touch of overexposure. The experiences that have been shared with me by people in our situation, even very knowledgeable people, usually don't correspond to those of the average pass-holding MousePadder.

Trust me, the magic is still there. I can see it in my friends' eyes and smell it in their clothes when they get back from a visit. It clings to them like an aura, glows more than the California tan they all sport.

Ghoulish Delight, keep the flags flying, kid! I love your passion for the park and always enjoy your posts. Do what you feel you have to, but bear in mind that the economic impact of your annual pass pales before the onslaught of those of us who will be laying down our $45 on our pilgrimages.

See you at the zoo,

ron

Tigertail777
05-10-2002, 05:56 AM
Thanks Iceman, and Oregonzooron,
I am going to try my darndest to have fun on whatever is there, and I am sure I will have a great time, but I know in my heart that it will not be anything remotely like the Disneyland I grew up with and went to every couple of months and got to know like an old friend. I can see it in all of my friends vacation photos when they come back from there... the magic is fading...it is still there and far more magical than most places on earth, but it pains me deeply to even see it fade a little. OH well, I am sure I will have fun as I have not yet seen Indy, or Toontown, and cannot wait to see them also the tarzan tree I loved swiss family, and am sad to see it go, but this change I can understand and accept. Incidentally, Oregonzooron, I too am from the portland Oregon area up by Mt. Hood--small world!:D

PS: I realize that in many of my postings I have been overly pessimistic lately...bear with me, it is a bad habit I am trying to quit.

Ghoulish Delight
05-10-2002, 08:22 AM
Originally posted by a whole lot of people in some form or another
One vote doesn't make a difference. Why should I do anything?Sigh. It's depressing to see that kind of response. Among other things, do you realize that if every person who posted that my little action of not renewing was meaningless also didn't renew (or didn't go, if they're not APers), plus all the people who thought the same but didn't post, that'd be a pretty good start. How many APers read this board? Probably at least a couple hundred. And how many of those are active in other Disney boards where there are even more? Quite a few. If I convince some of them, who then go to other boards and convince more people, etc. etc. That's all I can hope for. But who am I kidding. I'm living in a country where a 25% voter turn out is considered a victory for the democratic process.

As for the negativity often seen here, you do have to take it with a grain of salt. Remember, "I'm happy, everything's great, what a wonderous time I had," doesn't make good conversation. Good, happy times are the baseline at Disneyland, so when those of us who go often have something to say, it's usually negative simply because that's what sticks out in our mind as out of the ordinary. I mean, if all these people were really that angry and hated being there so much, why the heck are they still going (unless they are masochists)? So if you're going to go, don't let the pessimism get you down.

And tikiboy is probably right about Michael Berry. This is a relatively old list that I just cut and pasted from another thread. If anyone has more up-to-date info, it'd be appreciated.

Gemini Cricket
05-10-2002, 08:28 AM
GD-
"One vote doesn't make a difference..." is an odd quote. Everyone counts. Remember, a few votes gave us Dubya. :eek:

Ghoulish Delight
05-10-2002, 08:36 AM
Originally posted by Gemini Cricket
GD-
"One vote doesn't make a difference..." is an odd quote. Everyone counts. Remember, a few votes gave us Dubya. :eek: I agree with you. But most people wouldn't (again, I point to the standard <20% voter turnout in this country). And look at what people have written.


Uncle Dick
And with the number of APs increasing every day (according to Al), I don't know how much difference one AP is going to make.



Caronomouseman
I offer this only as a warning that those of you who are attempting a "grass roots" kind of boycott of Disney may find such a statement drowned out by a thundering herd of summer visitors arriving by car to DLR ..............

And while others may not have specifically said it, that's what a lot of people think.