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Ace
03-29-2002, 10:23 PM
Last time I was at DL, the 26th of March, I realized that Tommorowland is REALLY that bad. TO see ANYTHING at Disneyland in as bad a shape as this land is is depressing...


Cosmic Waves is peeled and destroyed
The Rocket Rod track (which you can see everywhere in Tommorowland) is empty, as is the loading station.
The Submarine Lagoon is intact....sans the submarines. I mean, they left the track in...geez.
Space Mountain music doesn't work, and the queue is in terrible shape.
The Autopia isn't futuristic. They're go-karts with shiny bodies.
Innoventions... shudder. It's just videogames! Why would I do that at Disneyland when I can do that at home?
The sidewalk is dirty (space mountain, right before entering the queue)... I mean, come on.



It's sad, really. I'd love (and I'm sure I'm not alone) to see them do Tommorowland right... It wouldn't be that hard. It would cost, yes... but it would be worth it. I think it's so far gone they should bulldoze everything from Mainstreet to the trainstation and to the Matterhorn... They could start over, with a whole new decor and, with the money, it could return to its future glory.

Nigel2
03-29-2002, 10:41 PM
Originally posted by Squinky
The Submarine Lagoon is intact....sans the submarines. I mean, they left the track in...geez.
Space Mountain music doesn't work.
Innoventions... shudder. It's just videogames! Why would I do that at Disneyland when I can do that at home?
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It's sad, really. I'd love (and I'm sure I'm not alone) to see them do Tommorowland right... It wouldn't be that hard. It would cost, yes... but it would be worth it. I think it's so far gone they should bulldoze everything from Mainstreet to the trainstation and to the Matterhorn... They could start over, with a whole new decor and, with the money, it could return to its future glory.

I don't know if the lagoon is "intact" since it is an underwater attraction and things like that break/wear out very eaisly even when they aren't in use.

Odds are the suits felt that it would be a waste of resources to fix something that is going to be removed anyway.

It is sad that innoventions pales in comparison to the one at EPCOT. Heck basically the only video games they have are in 2 pavilions.:rolleyes:

Well odds are any major changes wont come arround soon since the suits believe that the total costs will outweigh what they can make off of an even newer tomorrowland.:(

MonorailMan
03-30-2002, 06:01 AM
Also, they need to tear out the CW foam, and just leave the ball, because when you look at the ground It looks awful! :(

Nigel2
03-30-2002, 09:12 PM
I think that is what they are planing to do. It would be a larger version of the one MK has (minus the "celestial map" painted on it.)

HondaBoy
03-30-2002, 10:07 PM
Well as Tokyo Disney Sea shows, pouring tons of money into your park brings back the orginal cost 100 fold! The park their is packed all throughout the year, with tickets selling out at 9:30 am. Once the American Execs realize that, than once again, the original Disneyland Resort will be the best.

Nigel2
03-30-2002, 10:13 PM
But don't foget that the Oriental Land Company paid for a good portion of TDS (there is also a discussion on how much of TDS the OLC owns.)

HondaBoy
03-30-2002, 10:19 PM
Oh I see, so basically if the Disneyland Resort had another sponsor that "chipped in" to build a fantastic park they would receive part of the profits. If it's like that I don't think any of the American Execs would approve of that since they like to reap in all the profits themselves. The could have a great deal with a company such as I don't know, maybe Lucas Films and spruce up both parks (not just new rides , the ENTIRE park itself) with Lucas paying for most of the work only to gain back it's money through how well the park does.

Nigel2
03-30-2002, 10:26 PM
I think Japan can be as cut throat as us but odds are the OLC made a much more compelling offer with how disney would "pay them back", it could be a percentage of the profits for a period of time or a perminant stake in the park.

HondaBoy
03-30-2002, 10:30 PM
Now if only if the American branch of Disney could offer a company such a deal, we could expect DCA and Disneyland to surpass all of our dreams. With profits for both sides soaring through the roof! This may sound very far fetched but why doesn't Disney make a deal with OLC to come fix up our parks? I'm pretty da$n sure they wouldn't let us down, Disney could be expecting maximum capacity at both parks every day during the summer with satisfaction being at the highest. There pretty much would never be a slow season ever again which means far less lay offs in the coporate offices and at the parks. Wouldn't they make more money anyways by doing this?

Nigel2
03-30-2002, 10:40 PM
Odds are any company would want to have their name on everything, kind of like a ride sponsorship. Also it would show that disney is weak and wants help as well.

HondaBoy
03-30-2002, 10:42 PM
With OLC's sponsorship it would make Disney only more powerful as they could promote the Tokyo parks here in America and just by the locals/tourists seeing the work they'll soon realize that Disney is stronger than ever with such a partner. With the way the parks are now it already shows that the company is not performing ( equals weak and needs help) at what it could be, with a good partner. For example if OLC were to fund the Splash Mountin redo I'd imagine new restraint systems plus whatever renovations needed to be finished within 3 months ( money = being able to do work quicker and better).

Nigel2
03-30-2002, 10:47 PM
True, but OLC is only has a say in one park and that is it. They may not even have any say on merchandise or consessions.

HondaBoy
03-30-2002, 10:49 PM
:) Now if only there were an ALC.....

HondaBoy
03-30-2002, 10:52 PM
Wow I just went to the OLC Japanese website and found out that OLC owns & operates pretty much the entire Tokyo Disney Resort (Including the hotels which are owned by it's subsidaries (sp?). If that were true than that means they just paid Disney a big sum back in 1983 for licensing it's copyrighted materials (which the previous CEO approved of). If they were to help our parks it would be perfectly legal if Eisner approves (since they are only here to improve our parks not create an entirely new one, now that probably wouldn't happen). OLC may have shown an interest but Eisner may have disapproved because once they have a stake in our parks they may in turn buy out the company, that wouldn't be a bad thing though.

Nigel2
03-30-2002, 10:56 PM
So Coronamouseman was right, they did sell their perverbial soul.:rolleyes: Then again I am not surprised since they sold their name in the computer industry many years ago to Sierra.

HondaBoy
03-30-2002, 11:11 PM
Which means that OLC actually paid ( or maybe they volunteered to give the illusion to Japanese guests they had something to do with the parks) Eisner and other exects to come down for the TDS Opening Ceremony. Nothing wrong with that either, it just goes to show that Eisner actually has class since he DID go down to Tokyo and promote a park that we do not directly own. Time to give Eisner props though even though the theme park division and merchandise division have not done well he did make the Disney company a lot larger/ more successful than it was. The point I'm getting at is that there is SO MUCH more potential for us.

Nigel2
03-30-2002, 11:15 PM
So I guess technically disney hasn't built a good park right off the bat in deccades.:rolleyes: Oh does anyone know if IOA (I asked on another thread) is in profit yet? I know it was still in debt after 1 1/2 years, but it's been a while so...

Brown Monkey
03-31-2002, 12:44 AM
You know, getting back to the topic of Tomorrowland and the very bad state it is in, I was thinking that maybe it was intended to be that way! LOL. Maybe this is actually Disney's vision of the future?? With vast wastelands and everything rotting away. This could actually be the way things end up in the world of tomorrow. Hehehe... :D

MonorailMan
03-31-2002, 01:22 AM
Also, One TL thing that looks awful, is the fence in front of the old Esclators for Space Mountain, they need to put a wall over them or something. :)

innerSpaceman
03-31-2002, 05:33 AM
Isn't it a bit ironic that before the so-called New Tomorrowland, there were just as many legitimate complaints about how bad a shape the land was in? The absolute shame of so many closed attractions was not a factor, but the run-down, dilapidated, paint-peeling, creepy, dirty, empty wasteland issues were all there. It was a depressing perversion of its former greatness and that is where we are again today. The lame efforts to improve Tomorrowland were simply a case of out of the frying pan and into the fire.

Is the concept simply doomed? I won't hold my breath waiting for some white knight Land Company to rescue Tomorrowland out from under Eisner's nose. And I personally am not even interested in a backwards-looking "Discoveryland" sort of Tomorrowland that is in current Disney vogue as a way to hedge off obsolescence. Is the future too hard a trick to pull off in 2002? It seems that way for the Disney Co. at least. Look at the current state of Epcot. Look at the current state of Tomorrowlands around the world, not just ours.

If it were easy to be Walt Disney, then Tomorrowland could remain vital and keep ahead of the times. Think it's a coincidence that things ran on riffing off his ideas for a couple of decades and then faded out forever? The real New Tomorrowland of '67, Space Mountain a decade later, Epcot Center in '82. If not straight from the hands of Walt, then based on his ideas and concepts. Since then? Zip. So until they work out that cryogenic defrost process, I don't hold out much hope for Tomorrowland.

Ace
03-31-2002, 11:05 AM
I guess the Imagineers are just better at fantasy thatn at future...

Simba
04-01-2002, 08:21 AM
Originally posted by Squinky
Last time I was at DL, the 26th of March, I realized that Tommorowland is REALLY that bad. TO see ANYTHING at Disneyland in as bad a shape as this land is is depressing...


Cosmic Waves is peeled and destroyed



I was at DL on Friday March 29 and took some pictures so you all who haven't been there can see what we're talking about. Here (http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraida/pf0de9f25c0f5edbf7aa5eb07131dd84d/fdd5fb13.jpg) is a picture of the truly sad state of Cosmic Waves.

Also... I noiced that Tomorrowland Terrace is now Club Buzz (haven't been to DLR in a year, this may not be big news...) and it saddened me. I remember when great bands would play there throughout the summer and you could dance into the night (sort of). And now it's another kiddie attraction. And what's more, did I detect a grammatical TYPO in Disneyland? Check out this (http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraida/pce2a1299e4e469d6b24afce6ce90d42f/fdd5fe7e.jpg) picture and tell me if that apostrophe is incorrect in "Lightyear's Above The Rest".

Simba

Ghoulish Delight
04-01-2002, 08:45 AM
Originally posted by Simba

And what's more, did I detect a grammatical TYPO in Disneyland? Check out this (http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraida/pce2a1299e4e469d6b24afce6ce90d42f/fdd5fe7e.jpg) picture and tell me if that apostrophe is incorrect in "Lightyear's Above The Rest".

Simba Uggh! That's HORRIBLE! I can't believe I've never caught it. Oh, wait, yes I can. I avoid TL like the plague these days, and certainly never spend enough time near that stage to actually read what it says.

LightGuy20
04-01-2002, 09:34 AM
Originally posted by Simba


And what's more, did I detect a grammatical TYPO in Disneyland? Check out this (http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraida/pce2a1299e4e469d6b24afce6ce90d42f/fdd5fe7e.jpg) picture and tell me if that apostrophe is incorrect in "Lightyear's Above The Rest".

Simba

I think it's meant to be read: Lightyear is above the rest, which makes that use of the apostrophe correct while making a statement about the character. Though, for a place named after Buzz, it really should be Lightyear's is above the rest, if they're referring to the location and not the character.

Uncle Dick
04-01-2002, 04:25 PM
Originally posted by LightGuy20


I think it's meant to be read: Lightyear is above the rest, which makes that use of the apostrophe correct while making a statement about the character. Though, for a place named after Buzz, it really should be Lightyear's is above the rest, if they're referring to the location and not the character.
It's supposed to be a pun. It can be read either way. The one good thing about the Club Buzz makeover is the new soundtrack that plays between shows. Stop by and listen to it some time.