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srfantasmic
08-15-2005, 02:22 PM
Do they do fingerscans at the gates of Disneyland?

Osky
08-15-2005, 02:30 PM
Nope.

Darkbeer
08-15-2005, 02:34 PM
Not at the current time...

A all new set of turnstyles would have to be installed.

The current system has a CM at each turnstyle, which checks for tickets, AP (and compares the photo on the AP), and handstamps (you must also have your ticket to re-enter).

WDW just finished converting their system, I presume that the folks at TDA will wait until they gather enough information about how the conversion of the WDW system is working out, and how mmuch "ticket abuse" (such as reselling of partially used tickets) it has saved the company in regards to financial savings. (Actually additional tickets sold).

If it works at WDW and is doing a good job in eliminating the reselling on E-Bay, then I wouldn't be surprised to see new turnstyles installed during a slow off-season period.

cosmicjive
08-15-2005, 02:53 PM
Could someone explain how this system works? I've never heard of it before.

-Jeff "etumor"

Darkbeer
08-15-2005, 04:03 PM
http://www.mouseplanet.com/dtp/wdwguide/6_Parks/general/admission_media_AtoZ.htm

>>If you buy and use an Annual Passport, you will be required to have your finger scanned every time you enter the parks. The scanners take a digital photograph of your finger's bone structure and compares it to a copy in the computer. The idea is to make sure that the same person is using the Annual Passport each time.
The key to using the finger scanner is "repeatability." You want the scanner to see your fingers the same way each time, so make sure that you put your fingers against the three posts in the same location each time, make sure that you push in against the center post with about the same amount of pressure each time, and make sure that you squeeze your fingers against the outer posts about the same each time.

If all goes well, you will be allowed to pass into the park without further ado. If not, you'll be delayed as the cast member at the turnstile decides what to do. Sometimes they'll just pass you through. Sometimes they'll require you to try to re-scan. Sometimes they'll "re-flash" the image so next time it should work properly. In some rare cases, the cast member may ask you for photo identification to prove you are who you say you are. No matter what, such a problem will cause a delay which is an irritation all by itself.<<

FYI, this system is now used for ALL admission media at the WDW parks.

Klutch
08-15-2005, 06:33 PM
I hope this technology proves reliable and durable. Working for DoD, I've had experience with multiple palm scanners, finger scanners, and retina scanners. The story is always the same. They work for awhile, then conk out and sit as expensive reminders that the technology isn't ready for prime time.

The finger scanner was the most amusing. It would almost never work the first time. Security recommended making sure there was enough oil on our fingers and suggested rubbing our fingers on our noses if it didn't work. You guessed it. Time and time again there were a number of people waiting in line as the person at the front repeatedly rubbed her finger on her nose and tried the scanner, rubbed her finger on her nose and tried the scanner, rubbed her finger on her nose and tried the scanner... It was pretty bizzare and very funny. Eventually, the finger scanner was ripped out. However, this particular scanner was checking a fingerprint and not finger structure like the WDW scanners.

Opus1guy
08-15-2005, 06:38 PM
...this particular scanner was checking a fingerprint and not finger structure like the WDW scanners.

We were joking that if you wore a prosthetic hand (and a long sleeved shirt) when you bought the Annual Pass...then you could pass around the hand along with the AP for others to use. :)

Klutch
08-15-2005, 06:47 PM
Actually, you would need only a prosthetic finger. You know, there just might be a market for such a novelty... :D

Osky
08-15-2005, 07:25 PM
I hope this technology proves reliable and durable. Working for DoD, I've had experience with multiple palm scanners, finger scanners, and retina scanners. The story is always the same. They work for awhile, then conk out and sit as expensive reminders that the technology isn't ready for prime time.

No offense, but it might just be the equipment the DoD buys, or the way they use it. I have used quite a bit of biometric stuff in the private sector, and it works very well.

Doug
08-15-2005, 09:34 PM
Well, this is absolute BS! Why the HELL aren't being yelling at Disney about this? What next, DNA samples?! If this happens at DLR, I will make it dificult for the CM each time, in other words, I won't do it... they can see my ID, the old fashioned way....

I do not get it... what is this about setting passes? How in the world could you use someone elses pass? Unless you look just like them, or are the CMs that lax about checking?

Darkbeer
08-15-2005, 09:42 PM
The big problem is not from other people using AP's (The WDW AP's do not have your photo on them, and are cardboard), but the reselling of Multi-Day ParkHoppers. One of the big reasons Disney dropped the "2 days free" promotion was the reselling on EBay and other places. Disney liked the 2 extra days to stimulate additional hotel stays and in-park spending, but saw the massive abuse on EBay and decided they had to end the practice.

Other parks use similar technology, for example here is a photo of the device they use in SeaWorld San Diego for Annual and Season Pass Holders....

http://darkbeer.smugmug.com/gallery/236626/3/9201185/Large

This device, just like the device used at WDW, only looks at the TOP of your hand, and does not use fingerprints as part of the scan.

Doug
08-15-2005, 09:46 PM
Ok, I have to admit that, that scanner I kind of like.... would like to get one for the secret, er, home, yeah... home... and it's a ooold scanner too.... tech wise.... ok, no finger prints, that's better.... but, it's still lame... DUH, look at me, and look at my pic!

Now I feel like trying to bring in a friend with another friends AP just to test them :>


The big problem is not from other people using AP's (The WDW AP's do not have your photo on them, and are cardboard), but the reselling of Multi-Day ParkHoppers. One of the big reasons Disney dropped the "2 days free" promotion was the reselling on EBay and other places. Disney liked the 2 extra days to stimulate additional hotel stays and in-park spending, but saw the massive abuse on EBay and decided they had to end the practice.

Other parks use similar technology, for example here is a photo of the device they use in SeaWorld San Diego for Annual and Season Pass Holders....

http://darkbeer.smugmug.com/gallery/236626/3/9201185/Large

This device, just like the device used at WDW, only looks at the TOP of your hand, and does not use fingerprints as part of the scan.

Emma
08-15-2005, 09:49 PM
Well, this is absolute BS! Why the HELL aren't being yelling at Disney about this? What next, DNA samples?!

I agree with you. I think that is a little nit drastic.

--Emma

Osky
08-15-2005, 11:05 PM
Well, this is absolute BS! Why the HELL aren't being yelling at Disney about this? What next, DNA samples?! If this happens at DLR, I will make it dificult for the CM each time, in other words, I won't do it... they can see my ID, the old fashioned way....

I do not get it... what is this about setting passes? How in the world could you use someone elses pass? Unless you look just like them, or are the CMs that lax about checking?

Doug, they are trying to cut down on fraud with park hoppers. There is no picture on a park hopper. People will use three days on a four day park hopper and then sell the ticket so someone else can use the last day.

I also don't see what the big fuss is. Who cares if they scan your finger? If you read more into the way the system works, they have no way to recreate a finger outline or fingerprint from the data. It is one way. They also do not keep the information past the expiration of the pass for which it is used. So, if you are using a parkhopper which expires 14 days after the first use, 14 days later the information is wiped from their system. For the people who are paranoid about them knowing when you are in the park, they already know that by virtue of you swiping your card. If I could do a retina scan or something like that to avoid having to have a pass alltogether, I would definitely do that.

TowerofTerror
08-15-2005, 11:10 PM
nope currently they dont but in due time I think we will see it here at disneyland for people that have annual passports. THat they is being done at disney world

AlohaJulie
08-16-2005, 10:29 AM
Very relieved that it does not take fingerprints, only the outline of the top of the hand. That makes a big difference to me. I get jittery at the very thought of handing out one of the very few things unique to only me at the gates of a theme park.

Besides, I really think the pictures on the AP's are enough proof. And the pictures usually don't hold up the already long lines at DLR. It might be useful for the multi-day parkhoppers, but on the AP's it would take up unecessary time.

Darkbeer
08-16-2005, 10:47 AM
But one of the benefits is eliminating the photos on AP's. That is what WDW has done, and also SeaWorld San Diego. By making this change, first, you get to eliminate the AP Processing center... Benefit for the guests, no need to go stand in another line, for the park, major reduction in costs in staffing and maintenance. Another benefit for the park, that you do not need a CM at every turnstyle, WDW already has multiple turnstyles supervised by one CM (similar to self checkouts at grocery stores, Home Depot, etc...)

Instead, they can either use current ticket stock, or place an AP printer in each of the ticket booths. The ticket booths can handle the entire AP process in one transaction. Then when you get to the turnstyle, the computer knows it is your first use of the AP, and stores the biometric information for return visits. And since the AP has your name on it, it can be used for discounts, etc... just show the AP and your ID (photo).

Osky
08-16-2005, 12:14 PM
For the people who are against this, can someone please explain why?

sambo
08-16-2005, 09:29 PM
Because of the Illuminati and black helicopters. You never know what the guv'mint will do with my finger data...

SCUBAbe
08-16-2005, 09:36 PM
But one of the benefits is eliminating the photos on AP's. That is what WDW has done, and also SeaWorld San Diego.

I get to do this at Sea World? fun...it will bring back memories of my last job. We had to do a hand scan to open the doors and to clock in and out....and cameras were everywhere...and when i was runnignlate I always got behinsd the person whoe couldn't get the scanner to work...it was so annoying!! they have worked there for years and never learned how to use the handscanner??!!??bad memories...go away....LOL

Opus1guy
08-16-2005, 09:36 PM
Just do what they say and give them the finger.

;)

The Lovely Mrs. tod
08-16-2005, 09:54 PM
I agree with you. I think that is a little nit drastic.

--Emma
They do it at Sea World.

Doug
08-17-2005, 06:35 AM
Your AP and your photo ID? I use my AP AS my photo ID at DLR.... which they accept...


But one of the benefits is eliminating the photos on AP's. That is what WDW has done, and also SeaWorld San Diego. By making this change, first, you get to eliminate the AP Processing center... Benefit for the guests, no need to go stand in another line, for the park, major reduction in costs in staffing and maintenance. Another benefit for the park, that you do not need a CM at every turnstyle, WDW already has multiple turnstyles supervised by one CM (similar to self checkouts at grocery stores, Home Depot, etc...)

Instead, they can either use current ticket stock, or place an AP printer in each of the ticket booths. The ticket booths can handle the entire AP process in one transaction. Then when you get to the turnstyle, the computer knows it is your first use of the AP, and stores the biometric information for return visits. And since the AP has your name on it, it can be used for discounts, etc... just show the AP and your ID (photo).

Doug
08-17-2005, 06:36 AM
Privacy, plain and simple... the less companys "have on us" the better...


For the people who are against this, can someone please explain why?

Doug
08-17-2005, 06:38 AM
lol


Just do what they say and give them the finger.

;)