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johnnyrad
12-13-2001, 10:26 AM
They are so against society but hang out at Disneyland... smart group of teens. Anyone else just wanna kick em in their Mickey Mouses?

Maleficent0
12-13-2001, 10:32 AM
Before you go stereotyping, I hired a "goth" person who was arguably one of the best web developers I've ever worked with. He was super smart, got paid by the truckload, but just dressed differently. He actually helped us looked at things from a unique angle, which is always a good thing.

HBTiggerFan
12-13-2001, 10:48 AM
Those "goth" groups can be the nicest group of people you ever ran across at disneyland. I had a friend who introduced me. Next time I went alone I went over there and was greeted with hugs and lots of "hi's" They behaved better than alot of people I have seen at the park. They smoked in the smoking areas, didn't harrass people, were polite to CMs, didn't cut off strollers or wheelchairs. Waited patiently in line etc...

SO before you go form stereotypes and negative associations, go say hi.

Ghoulish Delight
12-13-2001, 10:55 AM
Remember, those "loser goth kids" aren't against society as a whole, in general (okay, they may think they are, but they aren't). But what they definitely ARE against is trandiness and coolness. And lord knows that in jr. high and highschool these days, it is decidedly UNcool to like Disneyland. So not all that surprising really.

And, go back and follow some other threads. Be careful who you call a loser as many of the people on these boards were and are those 'losers.'

EandCDad
12-13-2001, 11:04 AM
In order to help someone not make the same mistakes I have made, a short piece of advice. The originator of this thread also made an inflammatory statement in the Parenting in the Parks thread. I responded to that one before reading this one. After reading both I went back and read all of his twelve posts (you can do this by clicking on his name and clicking on "Search all posts by this user" in the right corner.)

I'm not gonna tell anyone to not post what they feel, but after reading most of his posts, ask yourself if this person is attempting to engage in legitimate debate or discussion or has another agenda. I made a couple of mistakes in this area earlier in this board's history, some of the moderators gave me excellent advice in this area, and I try not to fall into the same traps again.

Again, anyone can post about anything they want and the moderators should moderate, not me. Just a free piece of advice that is probably worth what you pay for it.;)


Back on topic:
The goths never bothered me. I'm basically a loner at heart, I prefer people stay away from me in public places. Goths seem to be like that also (generalization), they stay in their groups and away from me. If the whole park were goths and my family, I'd be a happy camper.

Gandalf
12-13-2001, 11:09 AM
Originally posted by EandCDad
Back on topic:
The goths never bothered me. I'm basically a loner at heart, I prefer people stay away from me in public places. Goths seem to be like that also (generalization), they stay in their groups and away from me. If the whole park were goths and my family, I'd be a happy camper.
WOW!

EmmaPeel007
12-13-2001, 11:22 AM
Originally posted by johnnyrad
They are so against society but hang out at Disneyland... smart group of teens. Anyone else just wanna kick em in their Mickey Mouses?

Where exactly are their "Mickey Mouses" located? Is it like all of those hidden Mickeys at Disneyland?

And it's just such a pity because all of the Goths speak very highly of Johnnyrad :crying:

mad4mky
12-13-2001, 01:07 PM
I have no problem with the goths...I have no problem with the candy ravers. Everyone is there to have a good time...and not to hassle anyone.
If they start bugging me and my family, I'd simply move on, or notify a CM.

I'm sure people think we are pretty odd at times too.
Live and Let Live.

And I ditto what EandCDad said.

innerSpaceman
12-13-2001, 01:34 PM
Guess they'll have to get rid of Haunted Mansion, or whatever it is that they figure attracts Goths to the Park. They sure got rid of Videopolis in a hurry when all those undesirable neo-punks were all over the Park like crows at a Disneyland sunset.

Well, I got news for ya, johnnyrad, Disneyland is for everybody. Kids of a certain age, in every era, like to adopt a certain style of dress and attitude. That doesn't mean that they shouldn't go to Disneyland. The ones who shouldn't go are the ones who have problems with other people based on what they wear. Last time I looked, shoes and shirts were the only requirements.

It was cowardly to eliminate Videopolis (now there's no good place to dance - bah!).

oohykitten
12-13-2001, 01:36 PM
Originally posted by johnnyrad
They are so against society but hang out at Disneyland... smart group of teens. Anyone else just wanna kick em in their Mickey Mouses?

Personally I could give two ****'s if it looks like Hot Topic Employee Appreciation Day. I like it!!! They love the mansion, and our just great. I talked to many of "them" well waiting in line and enjoyed it. Maybe you should just attend Knott's and Magic Mountain, since we all know that is where you find those well behaved preppy kids.

Gemini Cricket
12-13-2001, 02:40 PM
In high school, I was a goth. I wore a black trenchcoat, black combat boots and a black sweatshirt over my school uniform. It was just a matter of not feeling that one needs to "fit in" in order to validate being and liking yourself. The music of "The Smiths", "The Cure", "U2", "Depeche Mode" etc spoke to me. I was a rather depressed person but with other "goths" I really felt like they understood who I was and how I felt. It actually helped me come out of my shell and my closet!:)
And the connection to Disneyland? Hey, it's just a great place to be yourself. That's what Disney is usually all about! :)

PS: The adversity we discovered was by those people who weren't as confident about being themselves as we were...

Mad Madam Mim
12-13-2001, 02:43 PM
Posted by EandCDad

I'm not gonna tell anyone to not post what they feel, but after reading most of his posts, ask yourself if this person is attempting to engage in legitimate debate or discussion or has another agenda. I made a couple of mistakes in this area earlier in this board's history, some of the moderators gave me excellent advice in this area, and I try not to fall into the same traps again.

Thank you for the heads up.... I use to be one of those loser goths back in the day... and I was about to fall into this "debate trap"... Now I'll just go about my marry way....

in confession.... I still wish I could get away with it... lord knows I try in suttle ways. I didn't get my nose pierced utill Sept of this year. :D

LIMANDL4EVA
12-13-2001, 03:38 PM
Originally posted by mad4mky
I have no problem with the goths...I have no problem with the candy ravers.
what exactly are cany ravers?:confused:

Cadaverous Pallor
12-13-2001, 04:12 PM
Originally posted by LIMANDL4EVA

what exactly are cany ravers?:confused:
I think I fielded this one before in another thread, but I guess it bears repeating. ;)

A candy raver is, first of all, a raver. A raver is someone that attends raves. A rave is an all night dance party, where the entertainment is a DJ spinning records (yup, good old vinyl, for scratch- and mixability). Candy ravers are kids that wear huge pants, as well as the following, including but not limited to:
Bright plastic beaded neclaces and bracelets
fuzzy clothing
children's backpacks (especially the stuffed animal ones)
visors
things with flashy lights
glitter and other bright makeup
etc.

Needless to say, public candy ravers are pretty easy to spot, like their goth alter-egos. But believe me, candy ravers are the NICEST people in the world and wish nothing but love on everyone.

Hmm, how come I know all this? ;)

MammaSilva
12-13-2001, 04:23 PM
I have only had one experience at Disneyland where teenagers/young adults were rude/disruptive and actually "ruined" the evening and that was several years ago, they were dressed "goth like" but there were so many of them it was almost like there had been a concert or something near by and they decided as a group .. I'm talking a couple hundred of these kids .....to come to disneyland and harass the guests. However, I have had a LOT of experiences with very polite young people who were dressed "differently" I've had them hold bathroom doors open, make a path for the wheelchairs, once a group helped push one of the evc's up out of Indy because the battery was slowly dying....so I really don't look at what they are wearing....I'm sure my parents hated tie dyed stuff and the other 'fashion statements' of my youth...and most of us turned out "ok"

Morrigoon
12-13-2001, 04:37 PM
There seems to be a new type of punk out there, whose clothing bears a strong resemblance to the goths. These kids are the ones you see who cut a logo off one shirt, then safety pin it to the next one with several large pins (etc). I would be hard pressed to call those kids goths, as they don't seem to carry themselves with the same kind of dignity most goths I know do.

The disruptive kids in Matterhorn way (note that I did NOT say the Matterhorn way kids in general), generally fall more along the lines of those I would define as modern punks than goths.

(That's not to say there aren't nice punks too, I'm just saying I don't think they're goths)

MammaSilva
12-13-2001, 04:50 PM
which is why I said they were dressed "goth like" I haven't ever had a problem with those young people who like to hang out around the HM....and it was over in Tommorowland where the problems occured long ago, they were jumping lines, getting in peoples faces making verbal remarks to innocent guests....being openly sexual in inappropriate places, I quickly rounded up my group and we left the park.. security was doing their best but I don't think they are trained for that type of disruption/near riot activity.....

Nigel2
12-13-2001, 09:29 PM
I have seen skin heads that dress like goths, I could never do the goth think, I like black but in the summer I would probably boil to death. :D Also for being known as "loners" they are suprisingly sociable, they are always in large groups (when I see them) and they also like to chat with the CMs.

USofA
12-13-2001, 09:48 PM
hey, be nice to the goths. I was goth before it was trendy (that goes back quite a few years, even before Mr/Miss M. Manson. As for the candy ravers, go kids. I am probably the world's oldest raver. I can definately understand the draw to DL for a raver. bight lights, plush everywhere, good feelings, love and peace flowing freely, and did i mention all the spinning lights. :-)

DL is the perfect place for the perfect rave

peace

FEJ
12-13-2001, 09:48 PM
Originally posted by Morrigoon
There seems to be a new type of punk out there, whose clothing bears a strong resemblance to the goths. These kids are the ones you see who cut a logo off one shirt, then safety pin it to the next one with several large pins (etc). I would be hard pressed to call those kids goths, as they don't seem to carry themselves with the same kind of dignity most goths I know do.

The disruptive kids in Matterhorn way (note that I did NOT say the Matterhorn way kids in general), generally fall more along the lines of those I would define as modern punks than goths.

(That's not to say there aren't nice punks too, I'm just saying I don't think they're goths)


Patch Punks!!!

stinkerbell
12-13-2001, 11:21 PM
Originally posted by DisneyLad
. The music of "The Smiths", "The Cure", "U2", "Depeche Mode" etc spoke to me.

Oh, so simpatico!!! I, too, fell into this group on the inside, yet held it together on the outside! In 91ish, I did the whole flannel/Singles/Seattle/grunge thing, then the hippy thing, started the goth thing (Well, I bought Doc Martens and went to many raves--it was a start and pretty weirdo for our area in 92!), then moved to a tiny college town and had to "conform" on the outside to be happy. (sadly--though I still wore those Docs!) When I was going to raves, etc, I met the best, happiest, sweetest people, who dressed Goth-like, yet had all the same traits and attitudes I look for in my closest friends. This summer at a Depeche Mode concert (oh, what a semi-religious experience this is for me......), the mix of people was incredible. Yes, I wore black. And I went with a friend who is "goth" and two other friends who are fans from way back--one guy wore black fingernail polish and the other one is a straight arrow firefighting member of the LDS faith.... Stereotypes just don't do it for me.......

Bill Catherall
12-14-2001, 07:23 AM
Hmmm... I guess I'm a goth at heart then. I've always liked the goth kids. Never found them particularly disturbing or weird. I was a loner in school and had a hard time fitting in. The few friends I did have were just like me...liked you for who you were and not how you dressed. I think that's what I like most about the goths. They have always been friendly and non-judgmental to me. I too also loved (and still do) The Cure, U2, Depeche Mode. I just never became an "outward" goth. I do have a pair of Doc Martins at home, but never thought of them as goth...hmm. I have a great family...so it was never family problems I had to deal with in school. I was just a social misfit nerd. Also, I chose to live a drug-free lifestyle, and at the time that also made it more difficult to fit in (wouldn't go to the wild parties). But all the "goths" (inward and outward) were ok with that. I owe my attitude and outlook on life to a few goths that taught me what true acceptance means and how to be yourself and not worry about what other people think.

What I do hate though are all the preppy little brats that think they're better than everybody else or think they're so "rad" because they drive a Suzuki motorcycle. Get over your high and mighty haughtiness and give people a chance.

hbquikcomjamesl
12-14-2001, 08:05 AM
Personally, I'd say there's any number of ways people dress (or otherwise alter their appearance) that leave me scratching my head. The "Goth" look. The "Hippie" look. The "Punk" look. The "Candy Raver" look. The "Urban Cowpie" look. Piercings and tattoos seem like nothing but self-mutilation to me. For that matter, I've never understood why anybody would want to pad about in thongs.

Then again, I've primarily worn short-sleeved dress shirts, almost always in solid pastel colors, either slacks or work khakis in shades of brown, blue, gray, black, or occasionally forest green, and black lace-up dress shoes, since elementary school. I still wear a suit and tie to church. I don't own a single "slogan" T-shirt, but I do own several bowties, one of which I wore to have my Visa card picture taken (and I'll do the same the next time I have a driver's license or DL pass picture taken). In 39 years, my hair has never been "buzzed," spiked, or allowed to grow more than a little bit over my ears. I consider the combination of argyle socks (the louder the better) with Birkenstock sandals to be a fashion statement (one that grabs people by the collar and screams in their face, "you bet your sweet @$$ I'm wearing socks!").

But so long as nobody objects to my appearance, I try not to object to theirs.

stinkerbell
12-14-2001, 03:39 PM
Originally posted by hbquikcomjamesl
But so long as nobody objects to my appearance, I try not to object to theirs.

:D :D :D Your description of yourself is so right on! That's how I picture you in my head, based on your posts.........:D :D :D

Bill, all the "goths" I was friends with in 91-92ish had Doc Martens and most had the black and white striped tights, etc. A little bit of a stereotype, but true for this group in Portland at the time. The military brat inside me had a hard time dressing too "goth," so I didn't. But the Docs were pretty edgy for my small-town college when I moved to go to school. I got teased for a few years, before they became a little more mainstream and diverse in styles......

Even though this thread was started to get some contoversy started, etc., I am enjoying it anyway.:) It's good to know who my fellow closet goths are.

DisneyDenise28
12-14-2001, 05:35 PM
I don't mind the goths in the park, I figure if they don't bug me, I won't bug them. In fact in high school, I noticed that many of the brightest kids where goths. I think during this time of turmoil in this country we should all bond as one, instead of stereotyping people. If they happy being goth, let em' be!:)