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View Full Version : Big Thunder BBQ & Other Dumb Decisions



JEFFJAGUAR
07-11-2004, 01:22 AM
During a recent visit, we got to talking about some recent (or not so recent) dumb dumb decisions the geniuses who run Disneyland have made. Many of them, at least to me, are totally incomprehensible. Perhaps somebody who is smarter than I am can shed some light on then.

1. Why was Big Thunder BBQ closed several years ago? It always seemed fairly busy, it had really good food and the overhead could not have been very high. It's not as if some other great attraction was put in there.

2. Why have they replaced some of the classic rides? The closing of Country Bear Jamboree was an absolute disgrace; this was a traditionally funny different show that almost everybody who saw it loved. And again, it's not as if they had something really great to replace it with.

3. I miss the circlevision 360 movies. Even in Florida, I can't believe they are still showing a movie on Canada that is over 20 years old which features the skyline of Toronto and no Sky Dome...or the movie on China. These were certainly different things that were enjoyed by all.

It's almost as if the people running Disney today have no sense of tradition; of the importance of handing down tradition from grandfather to father to son. It's almost as if these are just becoming another theme park.

What's next, the dismantling of Small World?

Forbin
07-11-2004, 02:30 AM
Well I dunno about Big Thunder BBQ...never ate there..but then I've never ate at the Mexican restaurant in Frontier land either.

Country Bears and Circle Vision were closed because there wasn't enough people inside of it. Maintenance and visitation were not in sync. Heck in the 1980s when I went to circle vision there were only 20 or so people in the room. If they were lucky.
Country Bears always had about 20 people...for a room of 200. Reminds me of Muppetvision 3d or Circle vision...always underused.

But dismantling Small world? Nah..it's always busy...if they follow form (And we have new management..things might be different) I bet Tiki Tiki room is targeted next. Hell the next SHOULD be innoventions...but then Tommorrowland WILL be a ghost town until Buzz and Space Open.

rentayenta
07-11-2004, 08:19 AM
I think they are sprucing up the Tiki Room. I love those clicky little birds.


Dumb to me was closing the subs and letting the lagoon turn into an science experiment.

GreenDragon
07-11-2004, 11:40 AM
Country Bears always had about 20 people...for a room of 200. Reminds me of Muppetvision 3d or Circle vision...always underused.


Wow, every time I went to see Country Bears, I had to wait in line at least one and usually two shows to get in, and there were people waiting after me. And I always tried to schedule my trips for less crowded times of year.

Mark099
07-11-2004, 12:21 PM
1. Why was Big Thunder BBQ closed several years ago? It always seemed fairly busy, it had really good food and the overhead could not have been very high. It's not as if some other great attraction was put in there.

3. I miss the circlevision 360 movies. Even in Florida, I can't believe they are still showing a movie on Canada that is over 20 years old which features the skyline of Toronto and no Sky Dome...or the movie on China. These were certainly different things that were enjoyed by all.

BT BBQ is still available for private functions, isn't it? But I agree, and wish it was still there. It had some of the best food in any disney theme park.

Being Canadian, I wish disney would update the circlevision movie. As for China... we were at WDW in June and the movie has been updated! There are still parts of the original, but there are enough changes to make it seem new.

rentayenta
07-11-2004, 04:30 PM
I remember the Country Bear Jamboree as crowded too.

I really used to enjoy America sings. It was patriotic and fun. At least I can visit the hen can-can dancers at Splash Mountain.

3894
07-11-2004, 05:31 PM
Interesting about the Country Bears audiences. I personally never saw Country Bears crowded, not even when it first opened.

Disney Vault
07-11-2004, 05:54 PM
People will hate me for this but i saw the show once and never again because i hated it. Its just like in a goofy movie when they go to that place and see the show. And that movie hurt the ride even more.

Lani
07-11-2004, 07:34 PM
BT BBQ is still available for private functions, isn't it? But I agree, and wish it was still there. It had some of the best food in any disney theme park.They reopened it VERY recently, and are now offering "picnic" options, including cold fried chicken and PB&J for kids. We've got a menu listed in our Disneyland Park Update (http://www.mouseplanet.com/parkupdates/dlr/).

And no, they don't serve those traditional yummy BBQ dishes anymore. Well, technically they DO, over at Rancho del Zocalo, but the BBQ isn't very good, in my opinion. They don't actually grill it with plenty of sauce; they just slather it on at the last moment before serving, so there's no seasoning in the meat. :(

Duane
07-11-2004, 07:35 PM
Unfortunately, the "suits" have figured out that the guests at Disneyland will settle for less and continue to visit the park. Examples are: a scaled down version of Pooh, scaled down version of TOT, reduction from two to one autopias, a petting zoo, return of Big Thunder Barbecue which now sells cold food from another location in the park instead of hot cooked to order menu items, extended closure of Space Mountain with no attraction to compensate until it reopens in late 2005, closure of the fort on Tom Sawyer's Island, elimination of the fire burning cabin on Tom Sawyer's Island, etc. Need any more proof?

Dani24
07-12-2004, 09:02 AM
a petting zoo

Hey! I liked the petting zoo. Actually, I was surprised at how soft and clean all of the animals were. I love going to petting zoos, but find that at most the animals feel dirty and their fur is coarse.

Tigertail777
07-12-2004, 10:58 AM
Getting rid of CBJ was indeed a momentously stupid decision. Why? CBJ had two theaters, it would have been relatively simple to put the pooh ride into one theater side only and still run CBJ on the other side. The main problem CBJ had (and I have said this on other threads) is that it was basically hidden in a corner with hardly any advertising to let people know what exactly was in that building. If, for example they had put out a line of large wood carved bear statues leading from the entrance to bear country to the theater, and some of them had audio telling about the show triggered by sensors as you passed, I am betting nearly every single show would have been packed. And it was doubly dumb to gut the entire bear hall for pooh, because had they kept one theater going, the close proximity of pooh would have generated hight crowds for CBJ. You could in fact slightly change the show to have a "guest star performance" of pooh and friends, and perhaps even have had the pooh ride car glide past on the CBJ theater stage, so the people in the pooh cars would be looking out into the audience as "stars". That would have been some real synergy for both attractions and pulled crowds for both as well. And there was room to do this, currently there is a fairly large room below pooh just sitting mostly empty, and partially used for storage. Its just a plain big waste of space. CBJ had two levels to the theater that could have been utilized for one side, heck they could have even built a third floor on one side and disguised as something pooh themed: mr sanders tree, a giant beehive etc. This would have made it the only other two story childrens dark ride in the park (Alice being the first).

With technology today, circle vision 360 could have been remade to be seamless: you remember how each individual screen that made up the circle around you had divider lines? There is no need for that kind of thing now, and in fact you could have screens all the way around you that go from the floor to the ceiling. You could even conceivably make the ceiling itself a screen (would have to be more of a dome shape).

It just all comes down to the fact that they dont want to spend the money, and THINK they are doing things cheaper, when in fact if they stopped to think about it, in the long run they are doing things more expensive (the CBJ building gutting for example, it would have really been almost cheaper to build a all new building rather than retrofit one that was never intended for the kind of attraction they wanted to put in.)

RagtimePrince
07-12-2004, 11:23 AM
I for one, am glad that Country Bears moved on (although its replacement certainly could've been better), that Tomorrowland is a ghost town now so that it can open two new major attractions next year, that there is one big autopia, and that the Big Thunder BBQ wasn't opened again until it was really ready and after the ride accident fiasco was over.

Ok, Pooh is pretty lame as far as dark rides go, but you can't have everything stay in a park forever. Would you really want to still see Monsanto's plastic house of the future?

merlinjones
07-12-2004, 01:09 PM
>>Unfortunately, the "suits" have figured out that the guests at Disneyland will settle for less and continue to visit the park. <<

Now that they have stopped coming, how they recover the guests and their trust? :confused:

IcePrincess
07-12-2004, 01:20 PM
Actually The House of the Future is something I would really enjoy seeing in my life. Only pictures and audio seem to be as close as I will get :(

2002 TC eL
07-12-2004, 01:23 PM
.....Country Bears and Circle Vision were closed because there wasn't enough people inside of it. Maintenance and visitation were not in sync. Heck in the 1980s when I went to circle vision there were only 20 or so people in the room. If they were lucky. Country Bears always had about 20 people...for a room of 200.

:rolleyes: We NEVER saw that few people in either Circle Vision or Country Bears. We went to see both Circle Vision movies every time we went to Disneyland. :rolleyes:

Tigertail777
07-12-2004, 02:21 PM
actually I wouldnt mind seeing the plastic house of the future, since it still IS the future (see many all plastic houses around these days?). And house of the future actually took up very very little room, so its not like its wasted space, unlike pooh which as I said has a room down below the ride that sits pretty much unused and wasted. There are some things I dont like at Disneyland that I wouldnt cry too much to see gone, but I do realize there are other people that love those attractions still, and they do still draw in crowds so who am I to say they should be gone? If they serve their purpose of creating happiness for guests, and soaking up crowds then I would say they are still viable attractions that should stay.

Its not so much that pooh replaced the CBJ that sticks in my craw, its how cheap of a replacement it is for what was there before, and how badly space was used for it in a park that already cries for more space. Not to mention, as I already said they could have had two viable attractions still running to soak up crowds in a park that is dying for more attractions to do so. The synergy between CBJ and pooh could have worked greatly to their advantage and completely revitalized the whole "bear country" land concept. What they ended up doing is plain reckless and stupid thinking, and equally reckless and stupid spending. I am not sure they even put ANY thought into the idea other than "hey lets have a pooh ride, he's popular!" To see how a pooh ride SHOULD be done look at the one in tokyo, and if you havnt seen any footage then promptly head over to: www.barrybedford.com for some of the best tokyo park footage on the net.

The whole Disneyland pooh ride fiasco was stupid and reckless spending and thinking and thats all there is to it. I would have loved to see a wonderful pooh ride like tokyo's, heck I would even be willing to give up CBJ for that version, but it didnt happen and what we did get could have been far better thought out from all angles. Its more than just a "bear of very little thought" ride, its a ride that bear's very litttle thought.

Forbin
07-12-2004, 03:26 PM
I went on CBJ for at least 10 times during the last year and just before it fully closed it was fairly empty. I waited for the show but the room was quite empty.

Circlevision was soooooo long ago but I do remember that it was empty.

MrsG
07-13-2004, 06:29 PM
Tigertail: You have some great ideas! Have you submitted you application for imagineer yet?

TP2000
07-13-2004, 06:39 PM
During a recent visit, we got to talking about some recent (or not so recent) dumb dumb decisions the geniuses who run Disneyland have made...

3. I miss the circlevision 360 movies. Even in Florida, I can't believe they are still showing a movie on Canada that is over 20 years old which features the skyline of Toronto and no Sky Dome...or the movie on China. These were certainly different things that were enjoyed by all.

I also miss CircleVision 360 at Disneyland. You'll be happy to know however that the circa 1982 China pavilions CircleVision movie was just replaced last year. China is obviously a country that has seen quantum leaps of change in the last 20 years, and the new movie takes in all the 21st century marvels of China's new big cities. The new movie should last at least 10 years.

The Canada pavilion is also getting a new movie very soon. The funny thing about Canada's CircleVision 360 movie for me wasn't the missing buildings, but the incredible 1981 fashion parade that movie offered. You have never seen fluffier feathered hair or tighter jeans than the average Canadian citizen sported at the dawn of the 1980's. Great stuff!

Tigertail777
07-13-2004, 10:56 PM
Thanks Mrs G I appreciate that. :D I would love to do conceptual development in Imagineering, but I dont think I want to get in there while Michael "I can make a penny scream" Eisner is still at the company. Meanwhile I have school to finish (graphic design degree), and a fan magazine to publish.

Oh yes, and I remember the petting zoo as well. :D It was a nice little attraction for us young'uns. I think thats the kind of thing slowly dissappearing from Disneyland; the little side attractions that help make a more rounded enjoyable experience, and also help soak up the crowds making for a less hectic day.

MrsG
07-14-2004, 08:00 AM
Meanwhile I have school to finish (graphic design degree)

I'm a graphic designer too, guess that is why I was drawn to your ideas. While you are in school, take my advise and take some product design classes as well. The more you know, the more marketable you will be. Otherwise you'll be stuck in production (ie typesetting newspaper articles).

Alf
07-14-2004, 09:42 AM
Join the club.... I am a 3D modler/ Concept Artist, trying to get my foot in the imagineering door

Disneyfreak
07-14-2004, 04:58 PM
I say we get a petition to bring back the Big Thunder BBQ and the Tehitian Terrace while we still can.