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jiminycesq
06-28-2004, 11:33 AM
Perhaps it's obvious but I thought it worth stating that the 50th year of operations for Disneyland begins this July 17th. If you stop to think about it, a first birthday comes at the end of the first year, so the 50th birthday will be at the end of the 50th year - 7/17/05 - and therefore the upcoming 49th birthday actually begins the "golden year" of celebration (rather than May 05 05 as established by the administrators).

So, this will actually be the 50th July 17 that Disneyland has been open to the public; I believe Walt's invited guest party was a day or two before. Yes, I know, the public wasnt supposed to really be there on opening day either, but wouldnt you have loved to be someone who climbed over the fence or had an illicit ticket that day? One thing I have never read about is if the park was open the next day, July 18th 1955 (a Monday) to the public; considering all the stories of malfunctions and unreadiness on the media opening day (the 17th) I have always just been curious.

Anyway, after this July 17, we have the 50th Halloween, the 50th Christmas, and the 50th New Years to look forward to! I will plan to spend the Saturday there along with many of you, and Governor Arnold as well .. I think it would be fun to be in line when his party gets the ultimate fastpass treatment ahead of you? It should be a wonderful way to kick off the beginning of the 50th year of THPOE!

Lani
06-28-2004, 11:52 AM
Actually, I don't think that's right. A child born in July 1995 would not be turning 10 years old next month; she would be turning *9*. Same reason a lot of folks made a fuss when we went from year 1999 to 2000 -- that was the big celebration, but the TRUE start of the millenium was on the eve of December 31, 2000 to January 1, 2001.

Since the child would not be celebrating her 10th birthday until the actual 10th birthday and NOT "the day after she turns 9," I don't think your calculations work in this case. All you would be doing would be "celebrrating the fact that the park is older than 49" -- NOT that the park has turned 50.

karl
06-28-2004, 12:35 PM
While July 17, 2004 may be the 50th time the park was open that date, the park hasnt completed a 50 full years until opening time on July 17, 2005.

BTW, what time did Disneyland "open" on July 17th, 1955 ?

-- Karl

jiminycesq
06-28-2004, 01:36 PM
Well, I have erred before and will err again, but I think I am right when I say ...

1) Your first year ends on your first birthday;

2) Therefore, your 50th year ends on your 50th birthday;

3) Therefore, your 50th year begins on the 49th anniversary of your birth.

You are correct, in our culture, you "turn 50" on your 50th birthday, but, there is no disputing that "event" occurs at the end of the 50th year, not the beginning of it. Disneyland's 50th year begins, in theory, at the time of day on July 17th, 2004 which corresponds with park opening in 1955; good question as to what time that was, anyone know?

In any case, I stand by my conclusion - the 50th year begins in about 3 weeks. I never said it turned 50, or completed its 50th year then, or that it was the 50th birthday (technically 50th anniversary of birth) - you are both correct that such statements would be erroneous. But it will be the start of year 50 for THPOE. It enters its 50th year of welcoming guests this July, and I look forward to being there!

PS I cant address the millenial issue, but I am pretty sure on this one!

PPS Ok, call it semantics, or the mathematical equivalent - I am just looking forward to celebrating all year long!

Dani24
06-28-2004, 01:59 PM
Jiminy, I understand what you're trying to say. :) You're not saying that DL is going to be 50 in a few weeks, but that it will be in its 50th year of existence.

In order to understand this, you'll have to look at time in units of one year, instead of smaller units (days, hours,etc) like we typically do.

So if each block of time was one year, then DL was in that first block from July 17, 1955 through July 16, 1956. That was the first year of its existence. From July 17, 1956 through July 16, 1957 was its 2nd year of existence...and from July 17, 2004 through July 16, 2005 it will be in its 50th year of existence. July 17, 2005 will mark the start of DL's 51st year, and the completion of the 50th. When we say something is "50 years old" what we really mean is that it has existed for a full 50 years.

And what I belive Jiminy means by saying the celebration should begin on July 17, 2004, is that It's basically like a year long countdown to the 50th anniversary. You are celebrating the full 50th year of existence.

Make any sense? :D

TP2000
06-29-2004, 12:11 AM
Disneyland's first Halloween was October 31st, 1955. It's first Christmas was December 25th, 1955. It's first Easter was April, 1956.

Therefore..... Disneyland's 50th Halloween will be October 31, 2005. The 50th Christmas will be December 25th, 2005. And Disneyland's 50th Easter and Memorial Day won't occur until 2006.

Halloween and Christmas of 2004 will be Disneyland's 49th consecutive celebration of those holidays.

The 50th year doesn't begin until July 17th, 2005. But the 49th year begins in a couple of weeks.

TP2000
06-29-2004, 12:14 AM
I will plan to spend the Saturday there along with many of you, and Governor Arnold as well .. I think it would be fun to be in line when his party gets the ultimate fastpass treatment ahead of you?

The info about Arnold coming to Disneyland on July 17th, 2004 is just a rumor from Miceage from a few weeks ago. It has not been mentioned by any official Disneyland outlet, and it is not confirmed in any way.

jiminycesq
06-29-2004, 03:40 AM
With the exception of Dani24's comments, I beg to differ.

Your first year begins when you are born; you "turn one" at the END of year one.

When you "turn 49", your 49th year ends.

And, therefore, indisputably, your 50th year of existence - your 50th trip around the star we call the Sun .. begins on your 49th "birthday" - again, really, the 49th anniversary of your birth.

Your misconception is very common in our society, and understandable. But, to use your illustration -

If your first Christmas occurs BEFORE your first "birthday" (ie, in your first year), then - while you "are one", you have your second Christmas (or, one plus one, not one plus two). While you "are two", you have your third Christmas (or, two- your age - plus one - for the year you are living in now, your third). You don't "add 50" to your age to determine when your 50th Christmas or Halloween or whatever is - (unless you happen to be born on the date of the holiday) - you will "be 49" during your 50th year of existence, when the holiday or other event would occur.

I really dont want to make a 50 line list of dates, but the reasoning offered by Dani24 is correct. Disneyland's 1st Christmas was in 1955; the second Christmas was in 1956 (1955 plus ONE, not 1955 plus TWO);

Disneylands 3rd Christmas was in 1957 (1955 plus TWO, not 1955 plus THREE);

And, as I stated in my first message, the 50th Christmas is this year - 1955 plus 49, not 1955 plus 50.

Try pencilling it on on paper if you like, or a spreadsheet. Trust me, I am right. Not trying to be a pest on this, but, to help everyone realize that the title I gave the thread is correct - not the misinterpretations that subsequent messages infer I stated. I appreciate polite reasoned discussion, but, ....

Disneylands 50th year begins July 17th 2004 at the anniversary of its opening hour!

PS - As far as Arnold, it doesnt surprise me there has been no announcement, due to security concerns in public places - but I have faith in Mouseplanet's efforts to use reliable sources. Perhaps someone at Disneyland realizes that my thread title is the truth as well!

jiminycesq
06-29-2004, 03:42 AM
I see now that the news item in this weeks update is from a reader message post, so, that does limit its credibility. Ah well, if Arnold isnt there, I still will be!

imperpay
06-29-2004, 07:14 AM
Yes yes, the fiftieth year begins this summer!
(I have the same problem when they talk about
the XXth occurrence of something being it's XXth
anniversary. Watch for this problem again when
SuperBowl XL happens in a couple of years. They
will no doubt call it the 40th anniversary of the
SuperBowl, even though quick math could tell
them that it's only been 39 years since the first
one.)

Say, didn't Disneyland take "a year and a day" for
initial construction? That makes July 16, 2004 kind
of a special day.... Anybody wanna bring in shovels
to commemorate the groundbreaking??

-Imp
-------------
I wish I never had to leave this magical place.

sediment
06-29-2004, 07:38 AM
Say, didn't Disneyland take "a year and a day" for
initial construction? That makes July 16, 2004 kind
of a special day.... Anybody wanna bring in shovels
to commemorate the groundbreaking??
I know a great place for a parking lot.

Dani24
06-29-2004, 08:46 AM
Anybody wanna bring in shovels
to commemorate the groundbreaking??


A shovel with mouse ears? :p

I bet DL wouldn't let anyone in the park with a shovel, though. :(

Lani
06-29-2004, 09:40 AM
A shovel with mouse ears? :p

I bet DL wouldn't let anyone in the park with a shovel, though. :(How about stapling a couple of ears off a Mickey Mouse ear hat and putting them on a construction helmet?

Dani24
06-29-2004, 09:56 AM
How about stapling a couple of ears off a Mickey Mouse ear hat and putting them on a construction helmet?

Now that would be cute!

Wesley815
06-29-2004, 04:28 PM
The 50th starts next year and that's the way it should be. I'm thankful and glad Disney doesn't have people like you running things.

RagtimePrince
06-29-2004, 04:39 PM
Oh no, it's just like the millenium thing again...

It will be the 50th year of operation, but if we celebrated things that way, it wouldn't make any sense.

Actually, if this were like the millenium thing again, I guess it would be the arguement that the 50th year actually is in 2006, so I guess that's not the perfect analogy.

Wesley815
06-29-2004, 04:44 PM
lol, yep I agree with you RagtimePrince... I bet jiminycesq was probably one of the freaks over the whole stupid "Millennium" 00/01 thing to.

Some people's minds work in strange ways. Oh well, I'll just enjoy the park and let him go worry about the whole 50th thing.

jiminycesq
06-30-2004, 04:27 AM
Actually, Wesley, no, I wasnt "one of the freaks" who obsessed over when the millennium occured. But, it's interesting to know you reacted to that issue, and this, by pigeonholing individuals who have a different perspective as "freaks". And, I'm not "worried", I was just sharing my excitement over anticipating a joyful event. Isn't that what the board ideally supports?

And, I'd have to conclude you did not take the time to read through or consider the facts shared above. I see at least some, including Ragtime Prince, took time to understand my reasoning. It would be wonderful to have a board, and a world, where tolerance and considered discussion were the common standard, and names like "freak" and other labels were never used.

But, as will all facts, ignoring them doesnt change them! That's why we still have folks believing the earth is flat, man didn't walk on the moon, etc. The difference between opinion, such as classifying people as freaks, and facts, such as the measurement of the passage of time, is that opinions can easily be formed and reconsidered; but facts remain true even if we just plain choose to be ignorant. I believe Alan Alda was credited with saying "Listening is giving you the opportunity to change my mind". Hopefully some here have taken a moment to think about and listen to what I shared - out of eager anticipation, not some bizarre desire - and perhaps you will too. That's the wonderful thing about choice, it's up to you.

So, to you and all who join you in your opinion, I wish you a happy 50th year at the happiest place on earth, from a tolerant freak! :D

disney_j
06-30-2004, 09:44 AM
But, as will all facts, ignoring them doesnt change them!

Well, i think that's what were questioning jiminycesq, if this really is a fact. Just cause you believe it (or anyone else believes anything else) doesn't make it the truth :rolleyes:

Merm8fan
06-30-2004, 09:53 AM
Just what is Disney saying it is celebrating? The 50th year or the 50th birthday?

I think the points made above are all good, in their context. But it really comes down to what the intent of the celebration is. Think of Disneyland as a person... when you celebrate your 50th birthday, you don't say you are now 51. You are celebrating the completion of 50 years on this earth. As that year progresses, and you respond to queries regarding your age, you say "50." True, you are MORE than 50 years old, but you have not yet actually lived (or existed) for 51 years.

Kids know all about this... they will say "8 and a half" or "10 and three quarters" to try and accurately describe their age.

All the explanations in the previous posts are valid, if you pay attention to the phrasing. While in the process of completing something, you haven't actually yet achieved it. Yes, Disneyland will be "starting" it's 50th year this year. During the upcoming year, it will not actually BE 50, but will be completing that year of existence. Next year, on it's "birthday," Disneyland will be 50.

Kudos to all of you for being so jazzed about the park's upcoming celebration. I know I can hardly wait, but I will, because it does appear that Disney will be celebrating Disneyland's Birthday... next year, of course. :)

jiminycesq
06-30-2004, 09:57 AM
Quite right Jared! That's why, if my reasoning is incorrect, I would be happy to have someone - through more accurate reasoning, rather than mere reaction - explain exactly where my error is (so far, the focus has been on "when the birthday is" rather than when the 50th year begins). My topic title was only a statement, which I thought - and still think - was pretty simple: The 50th year begins this summer.

So ... after all the reasoning, and facts, presented, please do enlighten me on my error. Your first year, and mine, began when we were born, and ends on our first birthday; our 50th year begins when we complete our 49th year, on our "49th birthday". Those are facts, I think, not my interpretation, but again I would be happy to see reasoned refute. Without name calling, preferably!

On the other hand, if anyone feels convinced, or supports my interpretation/reasoning (and some at least have indicated so), I would welcome their comments as well. I'm starting to feel a little under attack for just sharing my anticipation of celebrating. And, I do try to be a fact based person, and hope I am being so here. Thanks!

sediment
06-30-2004, 10:06 AM
jiminy is correct in everything he says. But, that doesn't make his facts important. "Trivial" is the word that comes to mind. Ignoring these facts will do no harm to the ignorant.

imperpay
06-30-2004, 10:11 AM
...I'm thankful and glad Disney doesn't have people like you running things.
And I'm just thankful that people like
you are bad at math so we have somebody
to take advantage of. Plastic please.

-Imp (steamed)

Merm8fan
06-30-2004, 10:23 AM
And I'm just thankful that people like
you are bad at math so we have somebody
to take advantage of. Plastic please.

LOL, as in "Plastic Pocket Protector?" Thank goodness for all of you who ARE good at math! (Gives me someone to bat my eyes and look confused at, so that you can do all that difficult number-crunching.) ;)

sediment
06-30-2004, 10:26 AM
LOL, as in "Plastic Pocket Protector?" Thank goodness for all of you who ARE good at math! (Gives me someone to bat my eyes and look confused at, so that you can do all that difficult number-crunching.) ;)
That won't work anymore.
[pause]

Oh all right: 16 + 25, carry the 1, ... plus tax,...and you had the more expensive drink, and tip -- whaddyathink: 15%?