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HorizonsA
05-27-2004, 01:25 PM
DCA, as we all know, is not that big. I think they should tear out of what's left of the old parking lot and make a new theme area, like how about land based on California's deserts, or something? I hear people all the time saying DCA needs more, well, they have a lot of space left.

Ghoulish Delight
05-27-2004, 01:33 PM
DCA, as we all know, is not that big. I think they should tear out of what's left of the old parking lot and make a new theme area, like how about land based on California's deserts, or something? I hear people all the time saying DCA needs more, well, they have a lot of space left.That's the long term plan...but what's the point of adding more space now when they can't even fill the space they have?

HorizonsA
05-27-2004, 01:36 PM
That's the long term plan...but what's the point of adding more space now when they can't even fill the space they have?

True, very true.

iwannabeanimagineer
05-27-2004, 03:12 PM
That's the long term plan...but what's the point of adding more space now when they can't even fill the space they have?
One point of adding more space might be to include attractions in the new space that bring in more guests, ideally raising attendance by more than the percentage of the park's total operating cost the new area consumes.

My ideas: Zorro's Village or Old California Town or some such place, (maybe with a touch of desert) themed after the Zorro shows, Olvera Street, California's missions, San Diego's Old Town, etc. Attraction: thrill/dark ride (a la Indiana Jones meets Nature's Wonderland) following Zorro through his adventures, maybe freeing slaves from a mine (as in The Mask of Zorro, if Disney can get the rights, especially since an audioanimatronic Antonio Banderas and Catherine Zeta Jones would draw quite a crowd).

Or how about a Channel Islands adventure with a simulated kelp forest and diving bells, scuba gear or mini-subs? Maybe throw in some Finding Nemo stuff in for fun? (Then again, I might prefer just to re-open the subs in tomorrowland.)

CarlieB
05-27-2004, 03:17 PM
I'd love to see more San Francisco theming in DCA:)

Tigertail777
05-27-2004, 03:49 PM
I would love to see more california history theme rides/attractions, but presented in a fun way. California has such a rich history its a shame they dont use that. A San Francisco earthquake attraction would be pretty fun I think if done correctly.

I can easily easily picture a entire new mexico/california land with a Zorro ride. I would love to see a Blue Bayou style mexican restaurant where you have a show of people dancing in authentic mexican costumes from around the early 1800's. There is a lot you could do with this kind of restaurant, in fact it would be way cool if it was right next to the zorro ride and they made it as if you were attending a big party at Don Pedro's (I think thats Zorros fathers name) at his house. And you could even have some of the secret passages in the house like in the tv show, that you could "find" sort of a hidden little show simular to how the sleeping beauty castle walk through was. You could really do a fully immersive show/eating entertainment place... starting out with all the dancing and everything of Don Pedro's party (forgive me if that isnt the name), and then being interupted with zorro suddenly swinging over the outdoor courtyard where the party is held, followed by the troops trying to capture him.

The Hacienda would be the kitchen and a little more serving area for more intimate parties, but also would have a nice little walk through show with a live costumed CM doing a tour of the place, and "accidentally discovering the hidden secret passage, and asking you to come along. Inside the passage you can look through peepholes and things in the wall to see where zorro stores his costume etc. The tour continues with you ending up in the cave where zorro rides his horse out (the cave would a small themed area set a little ways away from the hacienda, so that you exit into a kind of desert area).

So the area would consist of: a nice well detailed Zorro ride of some sort, with the zorro story spilling over into the eating area (he escapes the troops in the ride, and as usual is making his way back home. The story continues if you dine at the Hacienda where zorro is trying to make his way home amid the big party being held). A very nice restaurant with a dinner show of dancing and zorro excitement. A little walk through tour of the Hacienda, and of course themed shops with zorro merchandise. It might also be nice to have a "legend of zorro" immersive story attraction in which the peasants tell you all the exaggerated stories they have heard of Zorro, and then do something like project outragous imagery they are talking about as a movie onto a fog screen with effects going on. Sort of in the vein of a updated but much much smaller american adventure at wdw: AA figures telling the stories with interesting visuals happening at the same time.

Of course the entry way to all of this area would be the town from the tv show, with zorro "wanted" posters all over the place, and a few well placed slashed "Z's". This would also be a small shopping area offering mexican themed merchandise. And if you look really closely you just might occassionally see zorro in a window menacing a dishonest shop-keeper. Plus there would be little bits from the tv show: like eagle feathers with mysterious notches placed here and there, along with ominous notes. The entire land would tell the story of Zorro in all its details.

DCAWhites
05-27-2004, 06:16 PM
Only thing wrong with zorro is people being born today will have no idea what it is by the time they grow up 20 years from now (Indiana Jones isn't nearly as old as Zorro and is more widely known, even with foreigners). I think Disney would be better fitted with something with a more generic theme and develop their own story. Big Thunder Mountain Railroad, Pirates, Hauntd Mansion, and Splash Mountain all do this.

But I agree, something themed to a gold strike/old mexican/californian west would be really nice. To bad there isn't any space to expand over where the lift hill of Grizzly River Run is. The back road over there (near the oar mining cart) could flow perfectly into any of the above themes, but there is no room at all because the winery is right on the other side of that little berm. BTW the condor flats area and Grizzly Peak area have a little berm on the eastern side, and the hotel on the western side, which is nice because it makes the area very secluded. Too bad areas like the Bountiful Valley Farm don't have this.

Tigertail777
05-27-2004, 06:23 PM
well thats why you would have to re-educate them through different means, thats one reason I included the "legend of Zorro" attraction. Zorro is actually fairly generic its basically an old west superhero with no super powers... an old west batman LOL. I frankly didnt know about zorro either until Vault Disney began showing it, then I was hooked. It would be pretty easy really to have subtle ways to educate people who he is, its not like its a major complicated story if I can sum it up in in 3 words "old west batman" then I think people could grasp it. It has the plus of being around a while, and has possible cross appeal to old and new audiences. I really think it could work wonders for DCA by appealing to the older Disney fan, and the newer one as well.

CarlieB
05-27-2004, 06:37 PM
There's a new Zorro film being made as well I believe. I guess the only problem would be if another non-Disney studio had rights to it (I've got no idea - anyone know?)

aztectodd
05-28-2004, 06:29 AM
While i agree that we need more theming, it doesn't necessarily need to be right now, AND, I think it should be something to do with San Diego. I cant think of anything in the park that really screams San Diego. It's a bummer too, because San Diego is the 2nd most populated part of the state behind Los Angeles and just ahead of San Fran.
Just my opinion though.

iwannabeanimagineer
05-28-2004, 07:09 AM
There's a new Zorro film being made as well I believe. I guess the only problem would be if another non-Disney studio had rights to it (I've got no idea - anyone know?)
I believe the name and character "Zorro" are in the public domain because he is a folk hero. The Mask of Zorro was made by Columbia/Tri-Star, but the TV series from the 1950's was made by Disney. So Disney has rights to the ancillary characters it developed, as well as the images and music that were created by Disney and Columbia/Tri-Star has rights to the ancillary characters, images and music it developed. I do wonder if Columbia/Tri-Star has any standing agreements with Six Flags or some other park that prohibit it from selling its rights to Disney, Universal or Paramount. Even without the ancillary characters, images and music developed by Columbia/Tri-Star, a Zorro attraction and themed area could be successful and tie-in to new DVD's and other merchandise based on the old Disney TV series. (Although I still love the idea of audioanimatronic Banderas, Zeta Jones and Hopkins. Maybe even an audioanimatronic pickled head in a jar, to get a little edgy.)

Tigertail777 and DCAWhites: If you know any good artists, market researchers and financiers, we could collaborate on a design, assemble a presentation and pitch this package to Imagineering!


... I think it should be something to do with San Diego. I cant think of anything in the park that really screams San Diego. It's a bummer too, because San Diego is the 2nd most populated part of the state behind Los Angeles and just ahead of San Fran.
Interesting you should mention this because my first reaction to this thread was identical to yours and my first thoughts on it evolved into the Zorro idea. I struggled to identify themes and images people would associate with San Diego and came up with: Old Town, the Mission, Sea World and La Jolla Cove (hence the undersea idea), the Zoo, Mission Bay and water sports, the beaches, Hotel Del Coronado (hey, now there's an idea for a new hotel) and the naval bases.

SCUBAbe
05-28-2004, 07:22 AM
Maybe soemthing based on the gold rush...a wild ride through a gold mine..maybe in mine carts...oh wait isn't that thunder mounatin...nevermind...

SCUBAbe
05-28-2004, 07:24 AM
Maybe soemthing based on the gold rush...a wild ride through a gold mine..maybe in mine carts...oh wait isn't that thunder mounatin...nevermind...

maybe if they did it as a dark ride.....it could have soem interesting possibilites....

Photographer
05-28-2004, 07:30 AM
How about a ride that goes very slowly and causes headaches and anger. They can call it TRAFFIC.

scaeagles
05-28-2004, 07:44 AM
How about a ride that goes very slowly and causes headaches and anger. They can call it TRAFFIC.

LOL! Really, though, I thought they had called it SuperStar Limo.

I'm all for an expansion of the Mission Tortilla Factory. ;)

aztectodd
05-28-2004, 08:19 AM
It is hard to come up with theming from San Diego, I will give you that. But thats why they're imagineers and we're (most of us) not. I would like to see something about San Diego because the only thing that really strikes me is the San Diego part of Soarin.

Pat-n-Eil
05-28-2004, 08:34 AM
I'd love to see more San Francisco theming in DCA:)

They could just import a lot of crazy haired, highly tattooed people who listen to new age music and like public bath houses.. that and an eclectic group of homeless people looking for benefits. Then throw in some folks who want the city to pay for their sex change operations and you'd have your wish.

DisneylandForever
05-28-2004, 08:59 AM
They could just import a lot of crazy haired, highly tattooed people who listen to new age music and like public bath houses.. that and an eclectic group of homeless people looking for benefits. Then throw in some folks who want the city to pay for their sex change operations and you'd have your wish.

WOW - first you suggest a ride where wagon trains get attacked by them pesky ol' Native Americans, now you're bashin' SF? You're on a roll today, Pat&Eli.

I like the earthquake idea. I was here (SF, home of the sex-changing homeless, per P&E) for the "big" one in '89. It was pretty crazy. I remember the streets were rolling like waves! They could definitely make a cool ride out of that.

There was an earthquake ride in Pier 39 a few years back, but it sucked.

Pat-n-Eil
05-28-2004, 09:18 AM
WOW - first you suggest a ride where wagon trains get attacked by them pesky ol' Native Americans, now you're bashin' SF? You're on a roll today, Pat&Eli.


True.. The only difference is I never lived in Olden times when the Native Americans and the settlers faught.

I have been to and live near enough to San Francisco that news from the city is a regular part of our informational diet. My father and I have also worked for companies who deal with the governmental authorities in the Bay Area. So while my western "Cowboys & Indians" scenario for Frontierland was purely made up fictional views based on old movies (and don't include any revisionist history modifications) - I'll stick by the San Francisco comment! :)

Pat-n-Eil
05-28-2004, 09:25 AM
Maybe soemthing based on the gold rush...a wild ride through a gold mine..maybe in mine carts...oh wait isn't that thunder mounatin...nevermind...

No, don't dismiss this. I love the Gold Country idea. I also like the Earthquake idea. Why not combine them into the Gold Country Earthquake ride. A dark ride where you see someone placer mining and then when the earthquake hits the whole side of the hill falls on you while you narrowly escape through an underground mine shaft (or river). Theming could include the trading post and the Wells Fargo stage coach area.. It could be more of a story than Thunder Mountain.. and it wouldn't be a train, but ore cars or stage coaches or. Maybe takes you up in the Sierras where Snowshoe Thompson or Jeremiah Jones or the Donner Party are struggling to get over the hill.. Sloughs and panning and all kinds of theming is ripe for the picking..

DisneylandForever
05-28-2004, 09:32 AM
So while my western "Cowboys & Indians" scenario for Frontierland was purely made up fictional views based on old movies (and don't include any revisionist history modifications) - I'll stick by the San Francisco comment! :)

No prob! I didn't take offense to your opinion of SF, I just took notice that your attempt at humor failed so miserably. It was more of an FYI than anything.



"I believe Watley converted to Judaism merely for the jokes."

"And this offends you as a Jewish person?"

"No - it offends me as a comedian!" ~ Seinfeld

iwannabeanimagineer
05-28-2004, 09:40 AM
...or the Donner Party...
I feel an idea for a restaurant coming on.

iwannabeanimagineer
05-28-2004, 09:46 AM
I love the Gold Rush theme and I'm racking my brain to come up with something that's not:
-Panning for gold (Knott's)
-A log flume or slough ride (Splash and every other amusement park in the world)
-A trip through an old mining operation (Grizzly River and Big Thunder)
-A boom town (Frontierland and the Golden Horseshoe)
-A chuckwagon restaurant (now-closed Big Thunder Ranch)
-A haunted miner's cabin or some other haunted thingy of the 1800's (Haunted Mansion)

Just gimme a long weekend...I'll come up with something.

Hey, how about an 1849 gold country B&B?

SCUBAbe
05-28-2004, 09:49 AM
No, don't dismiss this. I love the Gold Country idea. I also like the Earthquake idea. Why not combine them into the Gold Country Earthquake ride. A dark ride where you see someone placer mining and then when the earthquake hits the whole side of the hill falls on you while you narrowly escape through an underground mine shaft (or river). Theming could include the trading post and the Wells Fargo stage coach area.. It could be more of a story than Thunder Mountain.. and it wouldn't be a train, but ore cars or stage coaches or. Maybe takes you up in the Sierras where Snowshoe Thompson or Jeremiah Jones or the Donner Party are struggling to get over the hill.. Sloughs and panning and all kinds of theming is ripe for the picking..

the more I think about it the more I realize that this has all been doen before ay Universal studios and knotts, but Disney could do it better, but it still would not be original, new or fresh.....

DJLCB
05-28-2004, 09:55 AM
I think it would be smart to build a thoroughly themed waterpark. The theme should be surfing and the California coastline. This would work best as a new "land". However, I would like to first see a WRE variation than a new land.