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mrfantasmic
10-29-2001, 07:29 PM
I sent the Disneyland Resort the following message:

I'd just like to compliment the Disney Entertainment division for an excellent production in Fantasmic! I was disappointed that it will be in hiatus at my next visit, and that worries me...
In 2000, you announced that Rocket Rods would be closed until Spring 2001, it NEVER REOPENED.
In 1998, Light Magic was put on "hiatus" until 2000. It never returned.
AT ALL COSTS, DO NOT ALLOW FANTASMIC! TO BECOME ONE OF THE FAMILY THAT JUST...
DISSAPPEARED!!!
Show this who whomever you must, show it to Pressler, show it to Eisner, just
HEAR OUR PLEA!
Please keep Fantasmic! going.

Well, you never know when they might be listening for real, but I was relieved to see this piece of obviously customized mail from guest services CM Ryan Whitman (who, by the way, has contacted me regarding several issues):

Dear Mr [Fantasmic]: (wow! They never used my real name before now)

Thank you for your correspondence with the Disneyland Resort. We are
very
appreciative of feedback from our Guests, as it assists us in our
ongoing
attempts to maintain our high standards and fine reputation.

We wish to assure you that Fantasmic! is scheduled to return in June 2002.
However, please be assured that we have shared your comments with the managers you requested - Mr. Eisner and Mr. Pressler - so they are aware of your concerns.

Once again, thank you for taking the time to write. We hope that you
will have
the opportunity to visit the Disneyland Resort soon and that our
attractions and
entertainment will delight you in every way.

Sincerely,

Ryan Whitman
Guest Communications
Disneyland Resort


Whew! I hope that reassures some fans.

Andrew
10-29-2001, 08:05 PM
They said Light Magic would be back.

They said Star Tours would get a new ride film.

Moral: Nothing is "confirmed" until it opens... or maybe a month or so after that.

They said there were no plans to close the Country Bears.

They said there were no plans to put a McDonalds location in place of the Harbor Galley.

Moral: Even though they may mean well, Guest Relations' job is to tell you the company line, not the truth.

bluepearl
10-29-2001, 09:09 PM
I hope that they do plan on bringing Fantastic back next summer. I remember the first time I saw it - it was completely magical, and it still puts a smile on my face everytime I see it (seeing Mickey at the top of the hill at the end makes me feel like a little kid again).

I was talking to a friend today who's a CM at Disneyland, and he said that it would be back next summer as well. I told him all about how I heard the hiatus would essentially stamp out Fantasmic, he seemed confident about its return. I'm crossing my fingers that it does...

Nigel2
10-29-2001, 10:22 PM
Hmmm as said above I too belive in the theory "I'll belive it when I see it." But on a side note who wants get in on a pool to see if/when fantasmic will return officially?

Morrigoon
10-29-2001, 10:28 PM
I don't think Guest Relations is lying, per se. Just giving us the truth as it's told to them (from less than credible sources ;) )

Anyway, that's been my experience - cast are told the same company line that guests are, until the "facts" change.

zapppop
10-29-2001, 10:42 PM
They also said the Rocket Rods will be returning spring 2001.


Until it happens, don't believe it.

Sorry to sound negative.

tabacco
10-29-2001, 11:24 PM
I suspect it will return. they know it's a major crowd-pleaser and that it does wonders for 2nd shift ODV :)

Ralph Wiggum
10-29-2001, 11:45 PM
It better or else they will have to answer to me....as soon as i get this paste out of my mouth!

Maleficent0
10-30-2001, 06:18 AM
Well, Fantasmic! is a huge crowd pleaser as Tabacco mentioned. If anything, they'll do a farewell next summer like they did for the Main Street Electrical Parade. Then when DCA needs to draw more attendence, they'll just move Fantasmic over to DCA.

You know what?! I really was kidding, but after reading that, and knowing the current management, I wouldn't put it past them. :(

zapppop
10-30-2001, 06:29 AM
So true.

They'll just bring it back whenever they need to boost ticket sales.

innerSpaceman
10-30-2001, 06:51 AM
Oh please! A statement by the Disney Co. that Fantasmic will return is tantamount to saying it's all over. Guest Relations not knowing that it's lying? Get over it. Unless you were born yesterday, I believe a hard look at statements made by the company's PR outlets will reveal that most of what they say is simply not true. Lies are the normal statements from Disney. Throughout the 25 years I have followed the Disney Co. and communicated with the Disney Co., most of the statements issued either pubicly or to me personally have been outright lies. Whether it's cast members towing the company line, guest relations contributing willfully to misinformation, PR dept. making outrageous statements that have no relation to the truth - I even had the pleasure of having Michael Eisner lie to me personally on one occassion - best not to believe it till you see it, and worse - if it's said by Disney, it's that much more likely not to be true.

Anybody out there got any plans to use your "authentic" Electrical Parade light for your Christmas tree?

hbquikcomjamesl
10-30-2001, 08:07 AM
Anybody out there got any plans to use your "authentic" Electrical Parade light for your Christmas tree?


So cynical, "innerSpaceman"!

With regard to the bulbs (of which I have two, which serve as bookends on a shelf in my room), nobody said that they were the same bulbs that had been in use since 1972 (Face it, less than half of the Parade itself survives from 1972, and none of it in totally unaltered condition!), nor did anybody say that it would be impossible to relamp the Parade and put it back into service.

Does anybody believe that any college or professional sports team goes into a game in a public venue, much less an entire season, with only one ball (or puck)? Of course not! Indeed, there are rules stipulating required minimums of these things for each game! When I worked at the Costa Mesa Ice Chalet, for a time I used to babysit youth hockey (they paid me enough to babysit the games, but they didn't pay me enough, though, to actually watch anything but the game clock that would tell me when I could kick them off and resurface the ice!), I saw youth league rules specifying the minimum number of pucks the home team had to provide, and stipulating that they must be kept chilled; sure enough, at every game, there would be a bucket of snow and chilled pucks.

Does the presence of perhaps dozens of baseballs on hand, and the use of a dozen or more in a game, make a game baseball that once bounced foul off the bat of your favorite player any less valuable? Then why should a bulb certified to have been used in the 1996 Disneyland season of The Parade be any less valuable because the Parade subsequently resurfaced in a movie premiere parade, then went to WDW-MK for a year or two, then showed up to serve as a "wiener" to draw people into DCA? It's almost certainly been at least partially relamped just since it returned from Florida, as many of the colors were slightly off during the Florida run (and of course, the Casey Jr/Bass Drum float carried different logos).

Some years ago, when Disneyland ran its experiment with backstage tours, then very abruptly cut that experiment short (before I had a chance to do both tours!), I wrote to Disney management, giving them a series of closely-reasoned arguments in favor of reinstating it, at least on a passholders-only basis, if nothing else. While the reply did contain a few slightly fishy-sounding statements (like that it was never intended to be an ongoing thing, despite some rather costly printed materials and some talk of special costumes), it also asserted that they were working on a few things based on it. The Walt's Footsteps tour followed in less than a year, and at least one, possibly two subsequent passholder parties included backstage activities.

In 1996, I wrote to Disney management, urging them to "keep their options open" regarding the Parade, and not to do anything they couldn't undo. While their reply didn't inspire optimism about a return of the Parade, it appears they did "keep their options open."

Light Magic quietly disappeared during its "hiatus" because it had been a logistical and technological nightmare that had gotten so much bad publicity that any attempt to fix its problems would have likely been pouring good money after bad. More than likely, the logicstical problems would have been far less in WDW-MK (or DCA), simply because they could have started all performances starting from WDW-Town Square (or Sunshine Plaza), and thus minimized the bottlenecking. Or in WDW, they could have given it a dedicated venue, rather than put it in the middle of a street, much the same as they built a dedicated Fantasmic ampitheatre in MGM, rather than running it on WDW-RoA.

The Rocket Rods quietly disappeared during their coma simply because they were a troublesome, and not terribly effective, ride that had the worst queue-length-to-ride-length ratio in the park, and wasted the CircleVision theatre, and its lobby, on that queue.

But to get back on topic, I have never had any doubt of Fantasmic's eventual return, simply because even last year, extra performances were still being added to accommodate the crowds, and because WDW went to the expense of building a dedicated ampitheatre for its own version of the show, but especially because it's gone on hiatus several times before, always returning.

JRob2k1
10-30-2001, 11:33 AM
Originally posted by innerSpaceman
I even had the pleasure of having Michael Eisner lie to me personally on one occassion

I wanna hear the Michael Eisner lying story!!

-JRob

innerSpaceman
10-30-2001, 11:47 AM
Ok, JRob2k1, here goes.

I ran into Michael Eisner and his entourage at, of all places, the Hilton hotel in Anaheim. This was several years ago, at the time when extensively detailed plans had been announced and publicized about an updated Tomorrowland for Disneyland - - you know, the one that was supposed to include Alien Encounter. Well, the project had apparently been delayed as the time for construction to begin (if the land was to premier when announced) had come and gone. Worse, there was a rumour just started that DisneyWorld was going to get OUR Tomorrowland instead. Well, being that this was heavily on my mind when I happened to see Mr. Eisner sitting in this hotel lobby, I got up the nerve to approach him. This was easier than you might have imagined and he was actually very polite to me. But I asked him straight out about the fate of our Tomorrowland and the rumour of it's being done in Florida instead. And he flat out told me that the rumour was baseless, and that Disneyland would get it's Alien Encounter New Tomorrowland just as announced.

Well, we all know what really happened. DisneyWorld got OUR fabulous New Tomorrowland, and we got a new tomorrowland that was a shameful disappointment.

Is it possible that plans were still in flux at that time and Eisner was merely walking a fine line instead of outright lying? I'll never know for sure, but I'm sure of what I believe.

Liar.

innerSpaceman
10-30-2001, 01:18 PM
Oh, and one more thing ...

I may be cynical, but -- raise your (virtual) hand if you now believe, in light of the parade that was "glowing away forever" returning last summer, that the tiny lightbulb you may have purchased is really one of the "thousands of sparkling lights" from an actual Electrical Parade float as opposed to being cut from a string of holiday lights bought in bulk from K-Mart.

hbquikcomjamesl
10-30-2001, 01:37 PM
What reason would Disneyland's management have to substitute large numbers of never-used bulbs, purchased new, for actual used Parade bulbs, that would have otherwise ended up in a landfill? I know for a fact that the Parade was re-lamped sometime between October of 1996 and my visit to WDW, and sometime between my visit there and the Parade's return to Anaheim, because several colors were slightly (but very visibly) off in Florida.

zapppop
10-30-2001, 03:00 PM
The people running Disney change their minds every day.
So who knows.
Fantasmic will stay if Disneyland is losing more money by not having it. Show Disney what you think by not opening your wallet. That'll get their attention. Disney is the greediest, most money hungry company in the world.
Now: Main Street Electrical Parade; who cares whether or not the light bulb is authentic ?! What would you want with such a silly thing anyway ? You know if it's not burned out yet, it will be one day and then what are you gonna do with it ; throw it away ?! That, to me is a crazy thing to buy because I don't see what pleasure you can possibly get out of it.
If you want something to return to Disneyland, the best way to make it happen is to complain about it's absence, do it frequently, and do it in numbers.

bluepearl
10-30-2001, 03:27 PM
I hate to comment here since I'm obviously inexperienced in this subject. But I think that with the lightbulbs, it's all simply sentimental. I love the Electrical Parade, and if I had the collecting spirit in me (and was financially capable of participating - I believe I was barely 15 when they did this), I would've bought a light. If the Electrical Parade were never to run again, I could tell my kids that that particular bulb came from a really cool parade at a magical place. My kids would probably laugh in my face and wonder why the heck I would buy something that seemed worthless, but if it brought back memories, it's priceless. :shrug:

Despite my natural cynicism, I do hope that Fantasmic comes back - whether or not GR are twisting the truth, the CMs are passing on what they think is truth, or whatever.

I just recently immersed myself into Disney (been a fan of the movies for years, just now am I getting into the company's details, etc.), and after reading innerSpaceman's story, I'm quite disappointed. I can only imagine what that new Tomorrowland could've been like here.

innerSpaceman
10-30-2001, 04:46 PM
One person's collectible is another man's junk, Zappop. Now let me just say at the outset that I did not buy the little trinket that was the "authentic Main Street Electrical Parade lightbulb," but I know people who did. And I know that those people (the ones I know personally, not all people who bought bulbs) felt doubly double-crossed when "glowing away forever" turned out to mean "lying to you again." The tiny lightbulbs clearly have sentimental value and were purchased for that reason based solely on the claim that the venerable and beloved parade was closing for good.

Sorry, hbquikcomjamesl, but I don't think anyone would have purchased an Electrical Parade lightbulb that was offered for sale on the basis of the floats being refurbished. Where is the sentimental value in that? No, this particular lie about the Electrical Parade, while just one in a long list of PR lies, is particularly egregious because the Disney Co. had the nerve to actually sell (supposed) pieces of the floats with the claim that those floats were being dismantled for eternity. They must have sold every one of the "thousands of sparkling lights," but tell me if you think they would have sold five of them if the truth were told. Even if the bulbs are authentic (which I now doubt very much), who would have purchased one if the truth were told?
Disney not only lied, they cashed in on that lie.

I don't mean to be totally grrrrrr here. I love most Disney creations. I just hate the Disney company with an equal passion.

Blaming me for my cynicism is like blaming American foreign policy for Islamic rage. The culprit here is the Disney Company. Don't blame me for pointing out their failures.

zapppop
10-30-2001, 05:50 PM
I just never understood the enjoyment of owning one of the bulbs from the floats.
I'd rather have a t-shirt or something else ( know what I mean ).

If Fantasmic is leaving, Disney should just not say anything. That way if it does or doesn't come back, no promises would be broken.

MammaSilva
10-30-2001, 06:42 PM
On the subject of the lights from the "original" parade... if anyone remembers part of the hype was that you got a unique keepsake and the "profit" went to Disney Charities....

Marko50
10-31-2001, 12:28 AM
Originally posted by mammasilva
On the subject of the lights from the "original" parade... if anyone remembers part of the hype was that you got a unique keepsake and the "profit" went to Disney Charities....

Geez, Mama, I'm going all the way through the thread to mention those exact things - especially the charity part - just to find out 25 min later that you'd done it. ::sigh:: Only about 7 hrs and one or two earthquakes later. Depending on your source.

So I'm a slow reader.

Back to Fantasmic, I don't think they're gonna move it to DCA. Much too expensive. What'll happen is they'll change the boundries of the parks and move NOS into DCA. Possibly Non-Bear Country, too.

hbquikcomjamesl
10-31-2001, 08:26 AM
"innerSpaceman" insists:


Sorry, hbquikcomjamesl, but I don't think anyone would have purchased an Electrical Parade lightbulb that was offered for sale on the basis of the floats being refurbished. Where is the sentimental value in that?


and "zappop" said (with a bit less hostility):


I'd rather have a t-shirt or something else ( know what I mean ).


Mr. Spaceman, you remind me very much of a piece from Steve Martin's classic book, "Cruel Shoes." Specifically, you remind me of the piece that concerned a day in the life of a building demolition contractor, who'd been hired to destroy some historic building. The punchline was that after he got home, he reminisced about how he'd gotten to see the building in question, before it was demolished.

While I suppose that quite a few people must have bought bulbs in the mistaken belief that they weren't buying something entirely expendable and easily replaced, out of some perverse desire to be the last to see the Parade (at least judging by the number of people who were disgruntled that the Parade would resurface less than a year later to hype a movie premiere), I have no doubt that most of the people who bought bulbs didn't really want the Parade to go, and were delighted to see it return, and some even did as I did, and lobbied for its non-destruction. The fact that there was a good chance that the Parade was truly gone for good might have made the bulbs sell better, but the hope that it would return in some form did not detract.


And for the record, I have:

Two Parade bulbs, still sealed in their display boxes

One copy of the official final season videotape

My ticket to the October 17th Passholder Party, matted in acid-free ragboard and framed

A souvenir card bearing a picture of Elliott, from the October 17th Passholder Party

At least a dozen pictures from the October 17th Passholder Party

My October 17th T-shirt, which I wear only for special occasions (such as the Light Magic Passholder Party, at least two of the five performances of the Parade I saw in Florida, and the second and third public performances in DCA), and consider to be more valuable than any other article of clothing I own

A Parade soundtrack 7" LP, from the late 1970s

A first-edition Fantasmic soundtrack CD, with a "compilation" version of the Parade soundtrack

Approximately 150 feet of standard 8mm film (edited, approximate running time 12 minutes at 16 frames per second) of the Parade, taken over several years from the late 1970s through the early 1980s

And one memory of what could have been, and could have been much better than it actually was: a pin from the Light Magic passholder party.

None of this is for sale at any price.

mspangler
11-01-2001, 07:25 PM
I didn't buy a bulb from the "final" performance, but, I have to wonder....

Isn't everyone glad the parade is back, whether they bought a bulb or not?

I sure am. I don't care if it's at DCA now. It's back.

When I first heard the music and the lights come back on at DCA (1st time since '96), I felt a weird sensation...like a part of me was "alive" again....when I saw the first float come out, I felt like crying.

Just my thoughts....do I sound crazy??? Did anyone else "feel" something the first time they saw it again???

Oh, and I sure hope Fantasmic will be back next year!

MammaSilva
11-01-2001, 07:37 PM
I have to say that sitting there at curbside this past summer when the lights went down and that first few "notes" started up I did get that little tingle....it felt strange....kind of like something had been "missing" on our visits and it was back... I have to say that going to the park in September and NOT having fantasmic felt weird... nice but weird... I had forgotten what it was like to stroll down the cobblestones along the RoA from Frontierland over to NoS without feeling clastrophobic.... but the feeling wasn't all that and a bag of chips when I got to NoS and almost everything except Pirates was closed UGH