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randomwasjr
05-23-2004, 08:04 PM
It's rather a fine point to get upset on, I know, but when I went to Disneyland after three years of absence (I used to go once or twice a year), I was shock at the new airgates.

My first experience with them was on Big Thunder. I looked down on the metal gates which, to me, seemed unecessary and detracting to the overall experience and though: "Why God, why?" True, i've somewhat gotten over them now, but I still think they take you out of the moment a little and detract from the atmosphere. The only thing I object to now is their use on rides which don't really seem to need them. For example, are they really needed on Pirates? Are people really stupid enough to walk off the loading platform into the water? In all the years I've been going to Disneyland, I've never seen anyone try to walk out onto the tracks of the rides.

My point is, isn't this just another thing lawers have cooked up, like the addition of the (REALLY pointless) "hands, arms, feet, and legs" spiel? And is there anyone else who thinks that they take away from the otherwise great Disney atmosphere?

I think Disney does a great job with their parks (except for DCA of course), and I don't want to seem like a big nitpick or Disney-basher. I''m just not sure that these gates are exactly a great thing.

MonorailMan
05-23-2004, 08:10 PM
Lawers. Plus, not all little children are that well managed. :)

randomwasjr
05-23-2004, 08:30 PM
Sadly, some parents shouldn't BE parents. If you can't instill within your child the common sense not to jump out onto the track...but then I don't have anything nice to say, so I'll be quiet.

SCUBAbe
05-23-2004, 10:07 PM
They have air gates at other parks also. It may be an osha thing...

PhilMP
05-23-2004, 10:34 PM
No no, it's because the CMs are too busy talking about the cute new hire to watch whether guests are standing over the 2-inch wide bright yellow line. :)

Now now, I'm only kidding...kinda sorta.

Phil

tahnok100
05-23-2004, 11:02 PM
I think the gates are a good idea. They not only help prevent an accident (car pulls up, slows down to an almost stop and is then suddenly jogged forward a bit more. If someone thought that the car had stopped and began to approach it...) but also seems to help in the loading process.

disneydreams
05-24-2004, 12:46 AM
I like the air gates. If I'm not mistaken, the gates kind of correspond with the attraction. With PotC, it's "wooden" (like docks), BTMRR (westerny rusty pipes), Pooh (tree trunks), Splash (logs)...:D


does Indy have air gates? I keep thinking they do with bamboo trunks, but I keep forgetting


Heck, if waiting for the next boat to come, and without the air gates, and how some people are just plain crazy, they could be horseplaying and then one would push the other into water...JUST as the boat comes up to the dock. THEN, you'd wish you had the air gates. ;) Hey, it could happen. :|


Also, the spiel's with "hands, arms, feet, and legs..." is just a simple, harmless reminder. :)

tink1234
05-24-2004, 07:07 AM
I agree that the safety features sometimes take away from the overall atmosphere, but I am glad they are there. I have 4 children under 8. My dc KNOW where to stand in line, NOT to run into the rides before permission, etc., but they, as well as, adults can get swept up into the excitement and wonder of DL. (I am glad they are in awe of Disney Magic, thats why we take them on a 20 hour road trip to DL year after year.) They will occasionally forget to check to see if their feet are well behind the yellow line or that their little bodies must wait just one more minute for the ride to stop. Now I doubt my little ones would be the ones to fall into the POTC water, and I agree that it is MY responsibility to make sure they don't; but I still appreciate DL doing it's best to keep them safe.

That said...Can we reduce the NEON GREENNESS of the EXIT SIGNS on HM?

Disneylanding
05-24-2004, 07:22 AM
I remember one time I was in line at Pirates and this really OBNOXIOUS teenager was rough housing with his group of 3 guy friends and they were pushing each other back and fourth. Noone complained. One of the boys pushed his friends soo rough that he bumped into my boyfriend who bumped into me sending me crashing into the guard rails. The impact hurt and it had bruised my side but I could only imagine the impact if those rails HADEN'T been there. AND these were teens 18-19 years old.. I could only imagine what the UNsoupervised KIDS do......
I think DisneyDreamsbrought up an extreamly good point. The bars do match with the theme of the ride, so for me atleast it dosent take the feeling of the ride away.

redrhino
05-24-2004, 07:23 AM
Sadly, some parents shouldn't BE parents. If you can't instill within your child the common sense not to jump out onto the track...but then I don't have anything nice to say, so I'll be quiet.

I know that I should not take the bait but ...

It takes some time and a few experiences to instill anything within a child. Infants don't pop out with the ability to comprehend and understand every one of life's situations.

I am sure you realize this, but please understand that your statement seems pretty graceless. :(

Redrhino

ps - if you want to talk about something really stupid ... how about people who jump in front of moving strollers, only to be surprised when the stroller hits them on the ankle. ;)

Pat-n-Eil
05-24-2004, 07:25 AM
Unfortunately, there have been incidents - particularly at GTMRR in the past where injuries have occurred because a young guest tried to enter the ride before it was time and the train moved causing an injury to his foot. I seem to recall something about Pirates too.. so DL is erring on the side of safety. It doesn't really bother me at all. Most rides at most parks have gates. I actually think it adds to the excitement.. when the gate opens, it is your turn! :)

Pat-n-Eil
05-24-2004, 07:32 AM
ps - if you want to talk about something really stupid ... how about people who jump in front of moving strollers, only to be surprised when the stroller hits them on the ankle. ;)
Oh! Stroller city areas and people with strollers is definitely an issue. You don't have to "jump in front" of them to get hit in the ankle. You can just be standing there, blocked by someone else who has stopped in the middle of the walkway to plan their next move with total disregard for all others... It's a vicious cycle! :)

redrhino
05-24-2004, 08:12 AM
Oh! Stroller city areas and people with strollers is definitely an issue. You don't have to "jump in front" of them to get hit in the ankle. You can just be standing there, blocked by someone else who has stopped in the middle of the walkway to plan their next move with total disregard for all others... It's a vicious cycle! :)

Certainly true. When I am pushing a stroller or wheelchair or any such cart in a crowd, I tend to leave a bit of room between me and the person directly in front of me just in case of such a problem. What this sometimes does, though, is tempt someone to think "oh, there's a space, I should insert my body in that space", so for me, I tend to notice those problems.

But really, I was just trying to turn the "boy aren't some parents lousy" debate into something just as over-discussed. I guess I should just be quite now.

Redrhino

mrs_toad
05-24-2004, 08:38 AM
Out of all the crazy things that the Disney lawyers come up with, the airgates bother me the least. Not only children, but any person of any age could lose their balance on the platform. Children (and some adults) tend to be excited and anxious to board an attraction so I believe they are necessary. Plus the fact that the imagineers have done a great job in theming the gates to each attraction so they tend to blend right in. :) Unlike yellow tape, yellow paint, and obnoxious EXIT signs! :mad:

Cadaverous Pallor
05-24-2004, 09:14 AM
I have heard many stories of people stepping into Pirates' boats too early or too soon, as well as people falling by accident.

Yes, Indy has airgates. In fact, we just noticed yesterday that they are among the best theme-wise. At least a couple use what looks like big gas cans to seperate guests. Very cool.

I have no problem with the gates, as long as they are properly themed, which they all are. They don't detract from the show, same as a well-themed queue. I think Matterhorn is the last that doesn't have gates, which is kind of surprising. We'll see what the Space ones look like.

sediment
05-24-2004, 09:19 AM
Not all people are that stupid. It only takes a few stupid ones, or perhaps a few who are stupid only at the wrong place and the wrong time.
It only takes one incident for someone to lose a foot, and for DIS to lose a million dollars.

Forbin
05-24-2004, 09:46 AM
My answer is easy YES

Some people are that stupid. All it takes is one for a lawsuit. Hence you have the air gates.

In fact the Air gates are MINOR. I can live with Air Gates. I didn't like how Tea Cups and Roger Rabbit were dumbed down because of these same people who stick their arms out and they get caught in the ride.

Look at Knotts, after many accidents (Last one was a overweight person sitting on a ride and flying out because she couldn't close the lap bar), they just had another accident. A CM was walking on the rails of a coaster and the coaster came down and hit her.

Now you understand why they have air gates? Because no matter HOW many times you tell someone stay behind the yellow line, they don't do it.

Actually the ONLY ride that doesn't have air gates and is an accident waiting for happen? The tram from the parking lot to the gate. No Air gates, Yellow line, people pushing and shoving or just being plain stupid = Lawsuit $$

Grumpy4
05-24-2004, 09:48 AM
Although we may not ever have SEEN someone wald onto the tracks early, but if they're there, they are there for some reason. You know that the idea stemmed from somewhere and somebody has walked through one too many times. I once saw a huge glass window next to a glass door. On the window there was a big sign saying "This is not the door!" so you know one too many people walked right into that window even though there was no doorhandle, a widow pane with no break that ran about knee-high! It was CLEARLY not a door. You just have to compensate for those that don't quite get it! And believe me, there are A LOT of those people out there.

As for the kids....well, lets just say that some parents don't care what their kids do as long as they're happy and not crying. I saw a couple that let their son walk on the handrail all the way up the ramp of POTC. And we're talking from where the ramp starts! They finally made him get down where the stair leading up to the gallery started. Oh, and they weren't holding him. He just held up the line and as he walked up the rail and held on at the same time.

danyoung
05-24-2004, 10:03 AM
I'm not nearly as bothered by well themed air gates as I am by the intrusive safety spiels that cut into the ride. Two that come to mind are the Haunted Mansion, as your omnimover is going up the staircase, and the stupid intrusive announcement and video at the start of Spaceship Earth. They're actually taking parts of the attraction out, and putting legal mumbo jumbo in, just so they can state in court that they've done everything possible to keep the stupid guests safe. Bad show!!!

CoasterMatt
05-24-2004, 10:47 AM
Why don't they just bubble wrap everybody coming into the park?

Sheila
05-24-2004, 01:08 PM
Unfortunately, there have been incidents - particularly at GTMRR in the past where injuries have occurred because a young guest tried to enter the ride before it was time and the train moved causing an injury to his foot. I seem to recall something about Pirates too.. so DL is erring on the side of safety. It doesn't really bother me at all. Most rides at most parks have gates. I actually think it adds to the excitement.. when the gate opens, it is your turn! :)

If you are referring to the big accident at Big Thunder for the little boy who lost his foot... he was already on the ride, and had his foot dangling outside the train. When the train pulled into the station, his foot was caught.

That's why they then installed the higher sides on the trains, so no one could stick their foot out.

Sheila

Ghoulish Delight
05-24-2004, 01:31 PM
Gates, especially well themed ones, don't bother me.

The overly detailed safety spiels do. As well as over-signage. If these policies are an attempt to reduce the parks liability, I think they are sadly mistaken. The more speicifc you get with your safety warnings, the more you are opening yourself up for trouble. "Hands, arms, feet, and legs?...well, they didn't say anything about my head, or my fingers." It seems ridiculous to say this, but by enumarating anything like that, you are practically requiring yourself to enumerate EVERYTHING. If you start explicitly stating things, than anything not explicitly forbidden is implicitly allowed.

It's changing the responsibility from, "as a guest, it is your job to pay attention to your own safety," to, "As the operator, if you didn't warn me not to do it, then you implicitly gave me permission to." So if it's not warned against, they are going to get sued. Whereas, if they had general safety instructions such as, "Keep all body parts inside the vehicle, and fasten all safety restraints as instructed," they have covered their bases. More general encompasses more. Less general leaves major loopholes.

danyoung
05-24-2004, 01:36 PM
If you start explicitly stating things, than anything not explicitly forbidden is implicitly allowed.

Well, that argument always worked for me as a kid! (Mooommmm, you said to stay off the roof - you didn't say to stay off the neighbor's roof!!!).

DefyingGravity
05-24-2004, 02:50 PM
I'm not nearly as bothered by well themed air gates as I am by the intrusive safety spiels that cut into the ride. Two that come to mind are the Haunted Mansion, as your omnimover is going up the staircase,

Those never really bother me. As long as they're themed, I think they're fine. Like in HM, when he says, "Don't lower the bar, I will do it for you," in a menacing voice. Or in BTMRR, the announcement by the guy with a western accent- as long as they fit, they're fine with me.

disneydreams
05-24-2004, 03:40 PM
Yes, Indy has airgates. In fact, we just noticed yesterday that they are among the best theme-wise. At least a couple use what looks like big gas cans to seperate guests. Very cool.
Yay, so I'm not hallucinating. :)


Or in BTMRR, the announcement by the guy with a western accent- as long as they fit, they're fine with me.

And I'm still annoyed with their new spiel. :rolleyes:


I'm also surprised that Matterhorn doesn't have air gates.:eek: