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80S ERA
10-16-2001, 12:32 PM
After reading Al's update yesterday, I'm faced with a dillema. Now that there are several cuts planned for the upcoming months, will it be worth having an AP anymore for $200? I mean - most of the times I visit are after work (which means after 6pm) when my girlfriend and I could have the park to ourselves. If it were to close at 6pm, that would reduce my visits to weekends only, which would translate into 2-3 x per year.

Are any of you AP-ers reconsidering after yesterday's update? At first I thought it was a no-brainer with the rumored return of CircleVision, until now...

cstephens
10-16-2001, 12:44 PM
My AP isn't up until next March, but it would take a lot for me not to renew.

Ralph Wiggum
10-16-2001, 01:10 PM
It makes me consider not renewing...at least not right away..

Napsto
10-16-2001, 01:18 PM
igo to keep it because i love it too much

Nigel2
10-16-2001, 02:08 PM
Heck I am keeping mine because when I usually go there is hardly anyone there (weekdays during the off season) so it's a whole lot more fun to not have to wait. And I am usually there for only a few hours since I have seen all the night shows at some time. Even if they don't bring back a movie in circle vision I wouldn't care. But you have to look at it this way, (this has probably been said too many times though) look at how many times a year you go, what hours you usually go between and so on, but most of all do you still like disneyland(and dca if applicaple) to spend X amount of money on it in a lump sum.

violetdaisies
10-16-2001, 03:19 PM
Maybe you should consider getting a so-cal ap? if you go afterwork for dinner during the week, or off-peak...$89 isn't a bad thing at all! I just got mine! Wahoo!!!

Of course...if you wanna go on Saturdays, or at peak season...then you should get it anyway! ;o)

**Monica

Ralph Wiggum
10-16-2001, 03:43 PM
But here's the problem. The So-cal pass won't be as good because if you go after work you only have til 6pm, which isnt enough time for most of us. Many weekends and alomst all saturdays are blocked so you really dont get a chance to use it much except for a few fridays and sundays. It almost makes the so-cal pass worthless for many people. That might just be their plan.

EandCDad
10-16-2001, 08:06 PM
Originally posted by Ralph Wiggum
But here's the problem. The So-cal pass won't be as good because if you go after work you only have til 6pm, which isnt enough time for most of us. Many weekends and alomst all saturdays are blocked so you really dont get a chance to use it much except for a few fridays and sundays. It almost makes the so-cal pass worthless for many people. That might just be their plan.

Remember, to be "worth it" with a So. Cal pass, you only have to go 3 times in a year. So even if the park does close at 6pm, could use it like 36 Sundays about 30 Fridays, and any days you play "hookey" from work or school. You don't have to go that many times. I would wait for official announcements on any of this. The last AP rumor I got was that the So. Cal 1 park pass was going to be cancelled like 3 or 4 months ago. Nothing has happened so far.

Ralph Wiggum
10-16-2001, 09:00 PM
Actually even the end of october..early december disneyland is closing at 6pm according to the www.disneyland.com website. but thats a very very good point

HBTiggerFan
10-16-2001, 09:42 PM
my friend and I discussed it, and we are going to renew what we have (2 park delux) but we are only getting the 1 park. For us its worth it, cause we get parking and use it if we go to DTD etc, and will be going enough for it to pay for itself. But unless they make serious improvements on DCA we will not be renewing for the 2 park. And since our pass is up in January, it is looking like the 1park delux.

If you don't want to spend $200, or $300, go for a 1 park. If you don't care about going on the holidays or don't have a prob spending $20 for a blockout ticket then go for the delux

My .02

Marla

80S ERA
10-17-2001, 06:56 AM
Thanks for your input, guys (and gals).

Ever since I've been a passholder, I've ALWAYS bought the premium pass because of the discounts and parking. Now, if I were to buy a deluxe or So-Cal pass, I would have a harder time "making back" my money since I would have to pay for parking and pay full price for all my meals and merchandise.

That's the way I look at it.


and any days you play "hookey" from work or school. You don't have to go that many times.

Good point. I will have to make it a must to play hookey now!!:D

Still kinda undecided. My girlfriend and I even discussed the possibility of not renewing for 1 year. We could save all the money that we usually pour into the park we know like the back of our hand and go to something we haven't seen before: ORLANDO! Our $$$ could go toward a Disney World trip!!

Not that easy, though.....we not married and our parents are old fashioned.... :rolleyes:

EandCDad
10-17-2001, 07:10 AM
80's, as far as parking goes, you can put a parking pass on a So. Cal. for $35. You only need it on one of the passes so it pays for itself in 5 trips. We have 4 So. Cal APs with one parking attached. We get discounts at a couple of restaurants so we just eat there and we play hookey alot.

I'm different than some people in that we live far enough away from the park so as not to go just at night after work and I don't want to go on "busy" days (Saturday, summer, holidays) so the So. Cal. AP works great for us. But everyone is different.

violetdaisies
10-17-2001, 09:12 AM
I'm in the same boat as EandCDad. We live in So-Cal...but far enough away to make our disneyland trips special Day trips. Sundays, Middle of the week etc. And it's true...if you think about it this way...it costs about $215 for 2 So-Cal passes with parking attached to one of them. As EandCDad said...you will only need 5 trips a year to make it worth your money.

As for discounts...the disneyland website, and the cm's at mainstreet said there is a 10% discount to eat at Plaza Inn or Red Rockets! I think that's pretty good. As far as I remember...there were NO discounts for the less expensive passes before.

But...if you're thinking of taking a year off the AP...and saving that money for DisneyWorld...well that's another story!! ) That's awesome...we went to DIsneyWorld for our honeymoon and I absolutely LOVED it. we were there for 7 days...and STILL weren't able to see/do everything. I say...go for WDW! The "specialness" of Disneyland isn't really there (IMHO), but there's ALOT more to do and see!

Plus...who says you can't visit Disneyland once during that year...w/o a pass? ;o)

Good luck choosing!

**Monica

innerSpaceman
10-17-2001, 12:10 PM
Advise from a former APer. I haven't renewed my pass in 2 years! Went to Disneyland so much that, after 30 years of visits I was, gasp, getting bored.

However, I now find myself going to the park at least quarterly, that's 4 times a year and paying for parking each time I pull into that ugly structure. ouch.

So I admit I have made a financial blunder and will probably hop back on the passwagon next time I'm at the park. Don't give up your pass, it's not worth it.

Trip to WDW, however, is definetely worth it. Like Disneyland, it's either past its heyday or just in a little slump (mostly due to the decline in Epcot), but still a week's worth of total fun and excitement. I cannot recommend it enough.

mad4mky
10-17-2001, 12:43 PM
I have to get my .02 in now.

Try to save and get to WDW. It is worth a trip to see. You just cannot imagine how huge the whole place is until you have been there. And if you stay on property, you are totally immersed in a Disney Experience. I have gone twice now (1999 and 2000), and I just can't wait to get back. But, everyone is right...it just dosn't have that special feel that DL has. In fact, as much as my kids liked Epcot...they don't want to go back. They'd rather be at DL.

And regarding AP's. I've said this on another thread...but here goes again. After coming down this December, (I live in the SF Bay Area), it will have been my third time this year. I wish I had know back in Feb. that I would be coming down so often...(we usually average twice a year...but opted for WDW for the past two)...having AP's would have saved my family a bundle. So, to be on the safe side, we are buying them when we come down in December. Like everyone says, even if you only go 4 or 5 times a year...you still save...even if the park closes at 6:00pm on a weekday. But if you go 5 Sundays in one year...an AP is worth it.

Morrigoon
10-17-2001, 05:10 PM
Here's my suggestion: It's October. The terrific airfares for winter trips to Europe are coming out about now thru November. Look on the web and find yourself a Europe sale (my suggestion is get an extra hotmail account, and sign up for EVERY major airline's frequent flyer program, and have them send sale notices to that address. Get yourself tix for a week in Paris. Buy a Rick Steves guide to Paris, stay at his favorite little hotel on Rue Cler, and once or twice on that trip hop the RER out to DLP. THAT'S memorable! It's also DARN cold, so bring a warm jacket, but you'll find the reduction in crowds makes up for the weather (we only waited 45 min to see Versailles, instead of the usual summer 3 hours, and you could actually get within 10 feet of the Mona Lisa at the Louvre)

But seriously, winter airfare is cheap, and a 2-day pass to DLP costs the monetary equivalent of a 1-day at DL (or at least it did last February!)

mad4mky
10-17-2001, 05:55 PM
Morrigoon...I like your ideas there.
My oldest daughter is going to Paris for a semester come February. I told her...yeahh, you can go to DLP! Then I got to thinking...maybe I could go over for a week and go too!!

It's a grand idea...but I'll have to see.

Morrigoon
10-17-2001, 06:14 PM
I'm serious about the guidebook.... every time we followed his suggestions, it was terrific!

Lost Boy
10-17-2001, 07:14 PM
Before you all panic about Al's column you better go to

www.mouseinfo.com

and read there comments on what was said. I think you will find it quite enlightening.

innerSpaceman
10-17-2001, 07:27 PM
Ok, Lost Boy. At your advice, I just read Marcie's column where she totes the Disney line and bashes Al as a scaremonger. Well, I don't necessarily believe anything Al might write over the internet (that bastion of absolute truth), but I'll be damned if I'll believe anything that smacks as much of Disney public relations pablum as did Marcie's column. I have learned through years and years of experience never, and that means never, to believe anything that emanates as the official word from the Disney Co. Not that everything they say is a lie, but they have absolutely no credibility, having lied so constantly and consistently through the years that it's a complete toss-up as to what's true and what's false in official Disney statements.

Maybe DCA isn't doing as bad as Al says. Would Disney ever say so, even if it were true? Maybe the execs are not freaked and scapegoating and nearing panic and calling off all plans for future expansion. But would Disney admit it if that were indeed the situation? Maybe the entire tourism industry is coming up short, but that doesn't mean that DCA doesn't suck.

EandCDad
10-18-2001, 09:54 AM
Since I have made my feelings about Marcie's columns known previously and Alex has asked anyone who has comments about any other websites columns to take it up on there discussion board, I will keep this a little more general and focused on the MP part of the discussion.

1. Al Lutz, despite claims to the contrary, clearly has some sources in DLR. He is right too often to just be guessing.
2. Al Lutz is also wrong sometimes and that should be kept in mind when reading his columns.
3. DLR changes their mind on things so it isn't always great to plan too far in advance based on things you read on the always reliable internet.
4. Al lets his feelings about Disney management color his columns, he emphasizes those things that support his position and discounts others.
5. Other web columnists let their feelings about Disney management color their columns, they emphasize things that support their position and discount others.

Overall, my point is that just because MI has a column that discounts what the MP column said is not enough of a reason to think that park cuts will not be happening.

JeffG
10-18-2001, 09:55 AM
That Mouseinfo column is no more official than Al's column. Both columns are presenting rumors along with a healthy dose of editorial slant.

With those two columnists generally taking such polar opposite positions, I sometimes suspect that you might be able to get close to reality by essentially averaging the two...

-Jeff

mspangler
10-18-2001, 06:19 PM
I don't care what the rumors are anyway. I'll still renew mine--that $299 pass is worth every penny to me.

I don't know how I feel about Al's updates anymore. I like the "information" (mostly rumors) he provides, but the tone seems more and more "Anti-Disney"....:(

Darkbeer
10-18-2001, 10:46 PM
Why does Al get quoted so much in the papers. Because the reporters understand that what comes out of Disney's PR people (and any other company or politician) is always spun to the most favorable light for the company the PR person is representing. A reporters job is to try and get both sides of the situation.

I find Al's article's enjoyable, and as anything else I read (I am an addict to newspapers...) Everything I read, I take with a grain of salt, but some more than others. Spin people are harder for me to believe, sometimes you need to learn to read between the lines.

Also, Al relies on "sources", sometimes those sources purposely leak information to see the public's response. If it is favorable, they do it, if they get a lot of negative feedback, they decide not to do it, and then say, we never said that, it was only a rumor.

Also, decisions are made, then overridden by someone or something else. Take for example, the new "X" ride at SFMM, it was supposed to be open the beginning of summer, and many internet sources reported that last year. So, are all those sites wrong????? Or need factors after the announcement make the statement untrue????

When I read Marcie (or whoever used that name), I feel I am reading someone from the Disney PR dept, who lately is taking some minor (but popular) positions in her posts to make it look like she is not really a Disney PR person. (I.E. They shouldn't have closed Fantasmic!, I personally think many Disney people think that, but the budget won over.) True, but the fact still is that Disney has mothballed Fantasmic! to at least Summer of 2002.

I love this line from her last post on MouseInfo. "All attraction development that was announced for the Disneyland Resort are moving forward as planned without any delays." Well, the only announcement I have seen released officially was the Lumin-Aria at DCA, and I have seen that last weekend in the DCA lagoon. I haven't seen any announcement from Disney on TOT, Bug's town, or Pooh.

Now Al might be wrong, or the information was correct when he received it, but heck, if TOT hasn't been announced, how can it be put on hold:rolleyes:

cstephens
10-19-2001, 07:07 AM
Originally posted by Darkbeer
Why does Al get quoted so much in the papers. Because the reporters understand that what comes out of Disney's PR people (and any other company or politician) is always spun to the most favorable light for the company the PR person is representing. A reporters job is to try and get both sides of the situation.

With all due respect to Al, he's not the "other side". Sure, some of the rumours are interesting to me, but they're still rumours, and really, there's no way to know how reliable Al's sources are either, just as there's no way to know how reliable anyone is who remains anonymous and untraceable. While it makes sense that official Disney-released information would probably lean more towards the positive (but then you'd expect that from any company), I also tend to think that the information Al chooses to share leans towards the negative. I know there's a lot of bad news coming out of Disney now anyway because they're in the same economic climate as any other company, but there are many times when Al bashes Disney simply for the sake of bashing them. Of course, he's entitled to do that, but I wouldn't say that what he puts in his columns is any more "truth" than the information Disney releases.