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ppmuse
03-03-2004, 07:03 AM
With all the monorails going down and the fact they need to be worked on, why don't they just close the ride down and add some more track? I know it would cost a lot of cash, but make a stop in DCA. Also, get ride of the one park pass, and only have a two park pass. That way, maybe both parks will start filling up, especially is people don't have to put extra money in to going to DCA. While the track is being worked on, they can get all the monorail trains working, so when the ride reopens, all trains would be running. Could be a stupid idea, just thought I'd throw it out there.

3894
03-03-2004, 07:12 AM
Wouldn't it be great to see more Monorail instead of less?

CoasterMatt
03-03-2004, 07:49 AM
If only it was that easy to get new monorail trains. The beams themselves are probably not in the best of physical shape at this time either. Would any manufacturer WANT to build to the smaller scale that the Disneyland monorail beams require? Upgrading to a larger dual beam like Floridas would be great, but that would require ALOT of redesigning of the layout itself (clearances, angles, and such). Maybe some of the more educated Monorail fans around here can chime in... :)

Forbin
03-03-2004, 08:00 AM
A stop in DCA would be nice. Have it drop off near the Back side like near the Carousel and maybe DCA numbers will go up.

PapiBear
03-03-2004, 05:37 PM
I think that a refurbishment and expansion of the entire Disneyland Monorail line, partly as a Park-only feature and partly as an actual public transportation solution for Anaheim/Orange County, is at least 15-20 years overdue.

I mean, really, given that the primary reason for Orange County's population explosion was in large part due to the very fact that Walt chose Anaheim as the site for his dream to take root, it isn't too much to have expected that Monorails would be criss-crossing throughout OC and Anaheim already. Example routes: Anaheim Stadium (none of this "Edison Field" nonsense - it's "Anaheim Stadium", goshdarnit) to Anaheim Convention Center/Anaheim Marriott/Disneyland Hotel, John Wayne Airport and/or LAX to ACC/AM/DH, a full line down Harbor Blvd. to the 405, turning to South Coast Plaza, heck, even a Monorail between D-land and Huntington or Newport Beach! They could have truly expanded the Disneyland monorail into the biggest monorail system in the world, partly or even fully owned by Disney (nothing wrong with a private rail line - they can actually be profitable), providing jobs, helping to cut down on air & noise pollution and easing traffic congestion, paying millions of dollars annually in taxes, enhancing real estate values even more than they've been enhanced - they could have done that by now, but I guess that requires having a person of vision at the helm of Disney rather than an exalted bean-counter intent on rewarding himself for making others miserable.

Anyway, wouldn't you rather take the monorail to work than sit in stop-and-go traffic every day for hours and hours? I know I would if I still lived in OC.

Forbin
03-03-2004, 05:51 PM
That's looking a little too far.

Monorails have one main problem, when they break down the ENTIRE line is f'd. And no one in the Monorail can get out of the train. Remember, you are 40 feet in the air.

PapiBear
03-03-2004, 06:13 PM
Originally posted by Forbin
That's looking a little too far.

Monorails have one main problem, when they break down the ENTIRE line is f'd. And no one in the Monorail can get out of the train. Remember, you are 40 feet in the air.

Not true. There are breakdown and emergency evacuation solutions which have been around a long time.

I do my research here. (http://www.monorails.org/)

Besides, that's like saying that since buses occasionally breakdown, that nobody should use buses.

By the way, it's unfortunate that you would consider such far-reaching vision "looking too far". Some people once thought the notion of going to the moon was far-fetched and impossible, if not pointless. By the way, why are we planning on going to Mars? Gee, why did we ever bother to look on the other side of the mountain or travel across oceans? "A man's reach should extend his grasp, else what's a heaven for?" - Robert Browning

Orange County could be a truly shining example to the world if only there had been men of true vision in charge. Ever since Walt died and Nixon scuttled the Apollo program, people have been routinely naysaying epic efforts of advancement. This is a societal malaise that infects us all, while the rest of the world looks at us and wonders what the heck happened.

Forbin
03-03-2004, 08:22 PM
Lol how can you equate my statement of using a Monorail and Going to the moon as the same thing? Where did I say that the monorail is too far fetch to use? I never said that. I said you are looking a bit too far in today's current California society when they aren't quite ready for that form of transportation on a regular basis.

Monorails are clean, efficient ways of transportation.

I agree. Are we ready for that in Anaheim? No.

Look at WDW, the ENTIRE park is Monorail Connected. WDW is basically a bunch of islands that need to be hopped everywhere you go. Some kind of in air system was definitely needed. Disney owned the land so they can do ANYTHING they want.

Why aren't we ready? Why do I think you look to far? Look at the Green Line. It stops just SHORT of the Airport. Why? Because it would put a bunch of taxi drivers and bus drivers out of business. If that kind of politics is currently going on, do you really think we are ready for a full scale monorail system?

No.

Is bus riders (I'm asumming that's who would use it the most) ready for a bus that may stop at any time (Like a bus) but you will be UNABLE to leave it because you are 40 feet in the air? Probably not at this time.

In the future? Who knows? I'm more in favor of a Japanese Bullet train from here to Vegas before putting a Monorail in Anaheim.

ppmuse
03-04-2004, 06:51 AM
First, I understand what both of you are trying to say. Second, I can't believe how a simple topic can go hostile in just a couple of postings. I had a big problem with the monorails in disneyworld. While I loved them, used them as much as I possibly can, when they broke down, everything was screwed. A couple of times, we took the monorail from Epcot to the transportation center. At the transportation center, we were notified that the monorail on the Magic Kingdom loop had broken down and everything was stopped on that track for an unestimated amount of time. So we had to take the fairy. If I had to rely on the Monorail for work, they better have an extremely good bus system that would pick me up and take me to work so I wouldn't be too late. I like the idea of it being stretched around the disneyland park, and possibly to other hotels, but relying on it for work, your pushing it. Now the people mover around the city, now we're talking.

sleepyjeff
03-04-2004, 08:12 AM
Kind of reminds me of this Winters Ice storm up here in Oregon. On the first day of the storm, traffic was really bad but the Light Rail lines were running quite well. ----a little history here; the light rail lines in Portland are extremely unpopular with the voters in that despite being voted down a half a dozen times the local transit authority still managed to ignore the will of the people and force it upon the community anyway------

The spokespersons for the transit authority(tri-met) were quite giddy( as were their pets in the media ). We were treated to round the clock media coverage of how well the light rail was doing and how awful surface streets were.

Day 2: More people than ever before decided to use the light rail lines because it seemed to be the way to get to work with the least amount of fuss. Wrong. The surface sreets were much better than the day before due to a great sanding effort by city and county workers sanding thru the night. But tri-mets light rail broke down...and those record number of would be riders were stranded for up to 4 hours waiting for buses to take them around the breakdowns. The apologist in the media were trying to put a good spin on things( saying how well the bus system was working to get around the problem ) but they were not out in it and waiting in the freezing cold for 2 - 4 hours.

In short. I think the Anaheim Resort area should use an extended version of the monorial....but to extend that out for commuters may not be all that wise.

Ferris
03-05-2004, 11:29 AM
I love the monorails and I wish they would at least get them working consistently, let alone expanding their use at DLR. But I think the sad reality check is that it is too costly to do. I remember hearing somewhere that the cost of a monorail line averages out to something like $1,000/foot of track built (but not sure on that). Look at WDW. That would be a great place to expand the monorail system, but instead, they decided to use a fleet of busses as their primary form of transportation. From a business persective, it just makes more sense. Cheaper to buy, cheaper to repair, and no need to build more infrastructure because the streets are already there. Plus, you make a small initial investment, then buy more as you need them rather than spending a ton of money on the track up front. I hate to say it, but monorails just don't make economic sense.

ppmuse
03-05-2004, 12:55 PM
Actually, that is exactly what the Captain/pilot said to us on one of our many trips at DisneyWorld, the cost was just too high. But, apparently, because the guests like using the Monorail so much, and it's faster to get around in, the Captain/pilot told us that there were plans to add another track connecting the Animal Kingdom and the water parks and Downtown Disney. He said something about the project starting up sometime around 2006. Due to the fact that I still haven't heard anything about it other than from the pilot, I think it's just another silly rumor. But, man, wouldn't that be nice.

Tigertail777
03-05-2004, 08:42 PM
hmmm lots of things to reply to here...


OK first off, the full transportation route via monorail to the cities was something Walt actually proposed to either Anaheim, or L.A. or both (cant remember right now) and the city decided against the idea... probably because of the very same reasons pointed out: when it breaks down it really breaks down the whole system for a while. But the original monorail line Walt envisioned was far more than just for Disneyland.

On the plus side for monorails: they ARE elevated so it makes traffic easier, and all but eliminates things like children or animals getting run down by the trains. Some of the larger monorail systems actually used more for transportation, as I understand it (such as vegas) have a walkway alongside the track in case of break downs, and every so many feet have stairways down. From the pictures I have seen (and based on nothing more) it looks almost as if Japans bullet train uses a elevated system simular to the monorails (lifting the track above the streets on elevated tramways) but it may perhaps only be in certain parts they do this.

Now as for our local (Portland Oregon) tri-met MAX transporation, I think its great personally, its clean and decently effecient ONLY when its not overloaded (during bad weather and rush hour). I dont know if its possible, but I think they really need to add more cars onto the train during certain times... it gets way way crowded standing room only. And during some big concerts or sports games... FORGET IT you are not going to get on... I have had to wait for 3-4 cars to go by in that instance because they were so crowded people were literally almost falling out the doors at each stop. I think light rail is a great way to go for transportation, but it could use some improvement. I am glad they are trying to look a little into the future with public transportation here, because as more people move here at the steady trickle thats been happening you will find the freeways/highways more crowded. And unfortunately THOSE were not built for the kind of congestion we are beginning to get around here, they should have all been updated years ago.. and now there really isnt much money (so they say) in the budget for it, and at THIS point its going to take a heck of a lot of money to fix it.
Now, I dont fully agree with how our light rail gets so much state funding... so I think in the case of Disney making its own full monorail system, this could possibly be a better thing because they would in theory need less funding. And they would probably ask for less funding so they could take a bigger share of profits which would only be fair.

lazyboy97O
03-05-2004, 10:00 PM
I think in order to get a fulling running fleet of monorails Disneyland is going to have to dish out cash. Replacement cars and such for the WDW monorails probablly aren't hard to come by since they are standard transportation monorails and Bombadier also makes the publicly available M-VI which is based on WDW's Mark VI. As for Disneyland's, they are a small scale monorail and I belive the only in the world at such a scale. A large company has the means of producing the standards in a cost effect manner. Disney would need to pay for custom built monorails and that is what will cost money. Laying monorail track isn't as expensive as rail track and Disneyland having a smaller scale would probably make the track cost less since less concrete is being used. The problem is that Disney needs to be willing to find and then pay a company that is willing to build such a monorail.

Or we could just throw some blue prints at the Imagineers and tell them to start building. ;)

Forbin
03-08-2004, 09:28 AM
FYI :

Monorail red Broke down about 2pm Sun.

At 3pm Sun I saw a dude in a red train looking thing Pulling red along the lines to take it into service.

(No idea if anyone was stranded)

Blue was operational by 4pm.

2 Hours of nonoperation on something that may become a critical part of a urban atmosphere? Think about it.

Also, I wasn't aware Vegas's 2 hotel monorail system was 'Vegas has proof of a working monorail system'. I always assumed that since the 2 hotels were owned by the same chain they wanted to get more of people's money.

ppmuse
03-08-2004, 09:32 AM
Over the summer, I went to Vegas twice. There is a monorail system between two hotels. But there is a HUGE monorail system being built behind the casinos, apparently to link multiple parts of the strip, as well as other locations in Las Vegas. Not sure what the system will actually look like, but they are calling it a "Monorail" system, even though the track is looking more like a people mover idea.

Mythgard
03-08-2004, 11:30 AM
I always thought that a good thing that Disney could do with the Monorail system, is expand it so that it ran to the various local hotels, and if the hotels wanted to be on the line, they would pay Disney to have a station on the line, like at WDW. This would help to offset the cost to Disney, and keep pressure on Disney to keep the Monorail system well maintained, hence not having them break down.

Pirate Girl
03-08-2004, 11:40 AM
Originally posted by Forbin
A stop in DCA would be nice. Have it drop off near the Back side like near the Carousel and maybe DCA numbers will go up.

Here, here! Anyone have a clue why they didn't do that in the first place? They could easily build a platform where Superstar Lameo is. And then you could park hop much more easily.

lazyboy97O
03-08-2004, 12:15 PM
There is proof of working monorails for transit. The US has the Seattle monorail,a dn there are plenty of them in Japan. The Vegas monorail is a monorail. The trains it uses are Bombadier M-VIs which are based on the Disney-Bombadier Mark VI used at WDW. I suggest looking around at The Monorail Society's Website (http://www.monorails.org). Also they have an ALWEG Beam Comparison Chart (http://monorails.org/tMspages/TPBeams.html) which shows the sizes of the Disneyland and WDW monorail beams in comparison to other monorail beamways. As you can see Disneyland has the smallest of all Alweg style monorails.

MotorBoat Cruiser
03-08-2004, 10:04 PM
Originally posted by Pirate Girl
Here, here! Anyone have a clue why they didn't do that in the first place? They could easily build a platform where Superstar Lameo is. And then you could park hop much more easily.

Probably because of the logistics. Both parks have independent admission tickets. Some people are allowed to bounce back and forth and some aren't. You would have to be able to keep track of who could get off at both parks and who could only get off at the park that they paid admission for.



By the way, it didn't appear that any monorail trains were running today. That can't be a good sign.

Pirate Girl
03-08-2004, 10:58 PM
Originally posted by MotorBoat Cruiser
Probably because of the logistics. Both parks have independent admission tickets. Some people are allowed to bounce back and forth and some aren't. You would have to be able to keep track of who could get off at both parks and who could only get off at the park that they paid admission for.

Yeah, but they could do it the way they do in DD. I mean, is it really that hard to have one station to swipe tickets so that people can park hop without dealing with the gates of both parks?

MotorBoat Cruiser
03-08-2004, 11:08 PM
I understand what you are saying but having your ticket checked before getting on wouldn't be enough, you would also have to have it checked while getting off. For example, say you have only paid to enter Disneyland. You get on the monorail at DTD but instead of getting off at Disneyland, you get off at DCA. Now you are inside DCA. You can ride what you want, then exit the park and head over to Disneyland and use your ticket. Now, you have entered both parks for the price of one.

Hopefully that makes sense. I'm tired :)

The only way to make it work would be to no longer charge seperate admissions to both parks. Either that or a whole lot of checking.

Morrigoon
03-09-2004, 07:53 AM
Earlier in the thread though, was the suggestion of only park-hopper tickets, drop the 1-park admission.

Regarging the Vegas monorail system (methinks it should be up and running by this month), basically there is a grand plan, and they've got stage one just about done. It connects the hotels on the east side of the strip. The roundhouse is somewhere near/behind the Sahara, and it connects the convention center to hotels such as the MGM (and others). The next stage will connect the system to the west side, which is why Bellagio etc are closing their monorails, eventually the Vegas monorail will take their place. The only hotel of note being specifically avoided by the monorail is Wynn Resort, because Steve Wynn was so dead set against the monorail. The track takes an obvious long route around the outside of that particular hotel.

Eventual plans will connect downtown with the strip and run out to the airport and possibly the stadium.

Oh, and the bullet train is also in the works. Stage one will just be out to Primm, so Primm will become Las Vegas' parking lot. But that's a little further off. The monorail is happening NOW.

DivaPrincess
03-09-2004, 09:24 AM
Thanks, Morrigoon - I was just going to say that.

BULLET TRAIN TO ANAHEIM! BULLET TRAIN TO ANAHEIM!

Everytime we are driving to DL, we think about how nice it would be if there was a bullet train from LV to LA. We could go all the time!!!