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Loric
01-02-2004, 10:35 PM
Alright, I watched the documentary on Adventure Through Inner Space, and while I know I couldn't ee much because of the low quality video.... This ride was, to me, really deserving of the ax it got.

Sometimes things jsut have to go, and that one had really reached its stale point. For the most part, the music was dreary in the ride - not the optimistic futurism I was expecting, but rather more a war of the world type dismal. The narration was - abstract,and disjoined. Fitting of the overall idea of the attraction, but really strange in and of itself - alienating to guests.

And what is up with your People Mover on that coast? That thing moves so incredibly slow... Was the WDW version just made several speeds faster? The pace of yours doesn't give Tomorrowland an alive feel (in the images I saw) but rather a sort of lull.. like the music from InnerSpace.

Strangely enough, lots of it reminds me of Pre-Horizons Epcot. The music was dark - ever hear the original Journey into Imagination area music?

Okay, rant over, what's everyone else's opinion?

CoasterMatt
01-03-2004, 05:46 AM
So wait a minute, you never actually experienced that attraction?
You're judging from one less than stellar video.
That's like looking at a photograph of a flower, and saying that you don't like the way it smells.

Loric
01-03-2004, 06:35 AM
Originally posted by CoasterMatt
So wait a minute, you never actually experienced that attraction?
You're judging from one less than stellar video.
That's like looking at a photograph of a flower, and saying that you don't like the way it smells.

Considering that's all that's left of it, that's the best I can do..

And, i'm evoking artistic right, as a freelance show writer, to say it was abysmal.

There, I said it.. I think it stunk. *wait to be shot*

stitchlvr
01-03-2004, 08:50 AM
I can understand why watching a video of it now, you might feel that way. However, when that attraction came out, I can assure you, it was great! I can remember going on it as a kid wondering how they shrunk me. It felt so real then. I'm sure by today's standards the effects and technology would not be impressive, but it was then, and the original concept is still a great one.

merlinjones
01-03-2004, 09:23 AM
I LOVED Adventure Thru Inner Space and dearly miss it every time I walk through Tomorrowland. What a trippy, fantastic, escapist experience it was. Something that could only happen at Disneyland!

Not Afraid
01-03-2004, 10:37 AM
hehehehehe I suppose you think Tomorrowland is great now based on crappy film of the past?

I'm so sorry you never got to experience ATIS. It was truely one of the great rides of the past.

adriennek
01-03-2004, 10:52 AM
I'm shrinking! I'm shrinking!

It wasn't a thrill ride, for sure, but it had omnimovers! It had little people in little omnimovers, too! It was a fun little ride. I don't think a video could capture it if you hadn't been on it yourself. It was one of the Must-Rides for my family when I was a kid! My dad loved it and he's THE biggest Muggle I know. I can't imagine a Muggle worse than my dad. Tiki Room, AiIS, Small World, Space Mountain. They were the must do's.

Adrienne

efoxx
01-03-2004, 03:13 PM
let me strike a position right in the middle. when ATIS debuted with the first remake of tommorow land I thought it was great. I was 7 when I first saw it, and I was convinced that I really shrank. but by the late 70's it had grown a bit tame and a bit lame. lets face it there really was no SFX in the ride. just styrofoam cut outs of giant snow flakes. and a few funny looking hidden Mickey/h2o mol.
by this time Disney was spending as much labor keeping the ride out of the R-X rating it was becoming famous for as it was keeping the ride open.
because it didn't have the high end fx and animation like POC I am glad it went. oh I miss it, I have some fond memories of it (grad night ;) ). but some things need to change with the times.

BTW Loric if you are judging the Peoplemover by what you saw on the ATIS video then you have the wrong opinion. DL's peoplemover was built a long time before WDW. it uses a different tech. but it has quit a few speed changes. and some cool hills that don't exist at WDW. plus because quite frankly there is a lot more to see on the old DL system the ride goes slower in those parts. most of the WDW ride is a rush to get to the few scenic parts.

Loric
01-03-2004, 03:39 PM
Originally posted by efoxx
l
BTW Loric if you are judging the Peoplemover by what you saw on the ATIS video then you have the wrong opinion. DL's peoplemover was built a long time before WDW. it uses a different tech. but it has quit a few speed changes. and some cool hills that don't exist at WDW. plus because quite frankly there is a lot more to see on the old DL system the ride goes slower in those parts. most of the WDW ride is a rush to get to the few scenic parts.

My original comments on the PM were based on the ATIS footage, but I have since also watched the full PM video. I can see why it lost popularity - when it was slow, it was too slow for a modern audience. It's pacing wasn't timed right.

danyoung
01-03-2004, 06:30 PM
Originally posted by Loric
Considering that's all that's left of it, that's the best I can do..
And, i'm evoking artistic right, as a freelance show writer, to say it was abysmal. There, I said it.. I think it stunk. *wait to be shot*

And since your opinion is based on the viewing of a poor quality video, and not on actually experiencing the attraction, your opinion is duly weighted in a negative direction (flowery speech for "thbthbtbhtbhhhhh to you!":p). ATIS was always one of my favorite attractions as a teen. In fact, I could never understand why it wasn't a ticketed attraction (it was a sponsorship thing), but I made the best of it and rode multiple times every visit. And how can you diss on my man Paul Frees, one of the greatest voice talents ever? About a year ago they were playing his sound track up in the Disney Gallery, and I just stood there, mesmerized, with people flowing around me. It was so cool to hear him again, his tortured whisper of "dare I go on???" Magical!

sleepyjeff
01-03-2004, 08:13 PM
Originally posted by danyoung
In fact, I could never understand why it wasn't a ticketed attraction (it was a sponsorship thing), but I made the best of it and rode multiple times every visit.

It was. It was a C-ticket attraction( at least it was in the summer of 79').

screamin4ever
01-03-2004, 10:45 PM
Originally posted by Loric
Alright, I watched the documentary on Adventure Through Inner Space, and while I know I couldn't see much because of the low quality video.... This ride was, to me, really deserving of the axe it got. Sometimes things just have to go, and that one had really reached its stale point....

I'd say you got it right. It's your opinion and I agree. And I lost count of the number of times I rode it. Why folks insist on sanctifying this ride is beyond me. Past it. Outlived its time. Great ride for doing all sorts of non-Disney things on in the end, but as EVERYONE likes to point out, Disneyland is about 60% locals and they quit riding it. We thought that ride would never die. It was NOT on par with POTC or HM. People just don't attach to a melting snowflake storyline.

Perhaps updated tech and a new storyline could have saved it but I think the world had moved past the "science will save us" mentality and the message of the ride was lost on the younger generation. Unless you count the spitting contests on the back of the car in front of you as a liquid state of matter tie in?

It was GREAT for the time it opened but change happens and it didn't. The best part of the ride was the world's fair kind of feeling it had. That optimistic vision of the future I do miss. But as you see, no more world's fairs like 1967. People just aren't enamoured with chemistry. Can't think why?

<<Yes I know the World's Fair has Morphed into the EXPO thing and Shanghai is next, but thanks in advance for correcting me.>>

sambo
01-03-2004, 10:45 PM
Let's make a comparable analogy...

I have not seen or read but a few of loric's posts. But from what I've read, I will base an opinion on all of his writing and call it "informed". My informed opinion and "i'm evoking artistic right, as a freelance show writer, to say it was abysmal" and that your work is the epitome of what is wrong with what passes for journalism today.

Rather than write about something I know through firsthand experience - I will pick something that I can only get a modicum of information at best, and state strong opinions based on my lack of knowledge.

It was a good ride loric, and you are just jealous that you never got to experience it. Give up trying to be a serious writer and shoot for political talk show host, you have a feel for it already...


But it is a sad fact of life that ATIS would not withstand the test of time like some other "timeless" rides. It became dated, and needed to be replaced.

screamin4ever
01-03-2004, 10:52 PM
Originally posted by sambo

But it is a sad fact of life that ATIS would not withstand the test of time like some other "timeless" rides. It became dated, and needed to be replaced.

I think that was loric's point based on the video "experience."

sambo
01-03-2004, 10:55 PM
...so you are saying that it is impossible to agree with a point but think the route used to get to the point is wrongheaded?

Loric
01-03-2004, 11:19 PM
I am by no means jealous...

I examined the attraction thoroughly, or atleast as best as can be done considering it doesn't actually exist anymore. I've read the script, examed the scene chronology, listened to the audio tracks, looked over the schematics and images from the actual attraction... there's not much more I could do - besides watch a video of it.

Which I did. I formed my opinion, and thought to bring up the topic since I've seen it so widely adored here.

I'm not a journalist... where does that come from? I feel you pulled that from some strange crevice of your rear and it really has nothing to do with what I am capable of. Considering the origins, perhaps you just enjoy creating a stink?

Obviously you've missed the bits of play and humor mixed into my discussion of the piece. I comment that I'm wating to be shot for my opinion and you read that as though I take this seriously or meant it with malice...?

Pardon my perplexion, but where did I warrant a personal attack of my skills?

blusilva
01-03-2004, 11:37 PM
I suppose this is a classic case of "you just had to be there".

Times were different. Entertainment was different. Knowledge was different. Expectations were different.

No, today's audiences would never buy it. Audiences by the time it closed were no longer buying it. But that's a reflection of the audience, not of the attraction itself in the context of its day and age.

But way back in the olden days, in the early 70's, it was a totally immersive experience with narration that made you BELIEVE what was going on around you. Yeah, they were big styrofoam snowflakes. But riders were willing to buy into the fantasy because of that immersive element. There's no way one can experience that on a tiny computer screen in one's home.

Loric
01-03-2004, 11:40 PM
Originally posted by blusilva
There's no way one can experience that on a tiny computer screen in one's home.

For the record, I watched it on a big screen HDTV and through a dolby digital sound system. :D

blusilva
01-03-2004, 11:43 PM
Originally posted by Loric
For the record, I watched it on a big screen HDTV and through a dolby digital sound system.

For the record, I maintain that it isn't the same as experiencing the attraction first-hand. :D

For what its worth, I agree with you on the point that the attraction as it existed would be considered lame by today's standards.

Oh, and another point I meant to bring up: the narration was supposed to sound "disjointed" and "alienating". It was part of the immersion. You were supposed to feel in sympathy with the narrator - cut off from all humanity, all alone in the micro-world of the snowflake. It was very creepy, and worked extremely well within the context of the attraction.

Loric
01-03-2004, 11:49 PM
Originally posted by blusilva
For the record, I maintain that it isn't the same as experiencing the attraction first-hand.

For what its worth, I agree with you on the point that the attraction as it existed would be considered lame by today's standards.

For the record's record, record-record.. *thhbt* :p

But in actuality, I understand your point. Kind of like me spending a good hour trying to convince Morrigoon the other night that Magic Moment pins reactiving and lighting up inside attractions does not take away from the atmosphere or created a tiered guest experience since the pins must be purchased.

Something you have to experience for yourself.

blusilva
01-03-2004, 11:53 PM
Hee. We seem to be having a near-chat experience. Too bad we aren't experiencing it ourselves.
:~D

Loric, I really wish you could have experienced it. It was super-cool in the days of the covered wagons!

Loric
01-03-2004, 11:56 PM
Originally posted by blusilva
Hee. We seem to be having a near-chat experience. Too bad we aren't experiencing it ourselves.
:~D

Loric, I really wish you could have experienced it. It was super-cool in the days of the covered wagons!

Hmm,. now i'm tempted to grill you about the possbility of the destination disney system at DLand.

sambo
01-04-2004, 12:34 AM
Originally posted by Loric
I am by no means jealous...

And "Obviously you've missed the bits of play and humor" in my post. OK - I forgot the smiley's to indicate so...



I examined the attraction thoroughly, or atleast as best as can be done considering it doesn't actually exist anymore. I've read the script, examed the scene chronology, listened to the audio tracks, looked over the schematics and images from the actual attraction... there's not much more I could do - besides watch a video of it.

Which I did. I formed my opinion, and thought to bring up the topic since I've seen it so widely adored here.

Nowhere in your post do you say anything other than you watched a bad video of it. Now saying that you did other research would seemingly invalidate my "rant" on journalism. In fact it supports the sorry state of contemporary journalism by saying one thing, getting a response based on that one thing and then blasting the response with new information not used in the original writing. Shoddy journalistic ethics.


I'm not a journalist... where does that come from? I feel you pulled that from some strange crevice of your rear and it really has nothing to do with what I am capable of. Considering the origins, perhaps you just enjoy creating a stink?

Sorry - I thought when you said in your next post "i'm evoking artistic right, as a freelance show writer", you actually meant you were evoking artistic right, as a freelance show writer. It sounded real to me - I guess I missed your "play and humor" in it just as you missed mine...


Obviously you've missed the bits of play and humor mixed into my discussion of the piece. I comment that I'm wating to be shot for my opinion and you read that as though I take this seriously or meant it with malice...?

I think it is reasonable to assume if someone states they are waiting to be shot for stating their opinion, they're waiting for strong comeback. Otherwise the statement would be more like, hey it's just my opinion, let's not take this too seriously :D


Pardon my perplexion, but where did I warrant a personal attack of my skills?

Let's examine... The analogy stands, as is it is used to illustrate the point. The point is that watching one not so good video gives me all the information I need to make an informed and therefore accurate statement about an attraction. (that is what you said, there wasn't the additional information about other research given yet) The complement to that is I have read some of your posts and that gives me all the information I need to make an accurate statement about your writing. See - the point is that neither holds enough water to be true statements. I said that your work - in this case the logic of how your opinion that something was deserving of the ax because you saw a video - is the epitome of what's wrong with journalism today. I think that is a true reflection on the state of contemporary journalism. My opinion of journalism, and what I percieved as the logic I based the analogy on, was indicative of my opinion.

The next statement by me was not meant a personal attack. The "I"'s and "My"'s remove the event from you personally to the imaginary journalist I railed about that uses such logic.

I then said it was a good ride and you were jealous... more "play and humor". You have never told anyone in jest they were jealous because they put down something that you had an opportunity to do? The remark about giving up being a serious writer and becoming a political talk show host was more pointed, and in reflection was the closest thing to a personal attack of your skills. That remark was based on the analogy I made and my belief of your statement that you were a freelance show writer, and that the style of basing a strong opinion as fact without even having the experience, is a dig at political talk show hosts - because that is what I think they do.

When later you said you were waiting to be shot - I shot what I saw as a hastily crafted opinion based on little evidence. Sorry about the personal attack of your skills. That was not my intent.

I agreed with the point you made. I just saw the logic used to make it as flawed, and that's what I "shot".

danyoung
01-04-2004, 06:03 AM
Originally posted by sleepyjeff
It was. It was a C-ticket attraction( at least it was in the summer of 79').

Y'know, on further reflection I think you're right (I was distracted last night by the Cowboys' losing on TV!:crying: ). It then changed to a free coupon in the ticket books, I think, the same as Mr. Lincoln, and then went to totally free in its latter days. Someone feel free to jump in and correct my faulty memory, if need be.

danyoung
01-04-2004, 06:06 AM
Originally posted by Loric
I examined the attraction thoroughly, or atleast as best as can be done considering it doesn't actually exist anymore.

I reiterate my objection that you could not POSSIBLY have examined the ride thoroughly by examining what evidence is available today - it's just not the same as experiencing the ride IN THE 70'S!!! I think that those of us here who have ridden agree that it was incredible for its time, became dated, and was ripe for replacement. I can't imagine the ride returning today in the same somewhat low tech form and being any kind of success. That doesn't keep me from wishing that I could go back in time and experience it again. It really was one of my favorites back then.