PDA

View Full Version : Kevin Yee's latest: "Disneyland's Costliest Mistake" 11/20/03



Pages : [1] 2 3

Darkbeer
11-20-2003, 04:05 AM
http://www.miceage.com/kevinyee/ky112003a.htm


It works like this: by the mid-1990s, the world knew that DCA was coming. Expecting a crush of tourists at DCA, Paul and other managers decided to crown the 1995 addition of Indiana Jones with a whole new land – Tomorrowland – and then leave Disneyland alone for as long as a decade. They would instead focus their attention on DCA, which was planned from the outset as a park which would open small and expand in several stages.
Tomorrowland was the linchpin of that plan. For Tomorrowland to fail would mean that Disneyland would effectively have no new rides from 1995 to 2005, at least not of an E-Ticket caliber. Unthinkably, to them anyway, Tomorrowland did fail. Longtime readers might remember Al commenting at our old online home even before DCA opened that the new park was going to be a heroin monkey on Disneyland’s back – meaning that it would suck up all the money otherwise allocated to Disneyland for capital improvements. Voila, here we are at the end of 2003, and DCA is getting Tower of Terror after its new kiddieland addition, while Disneyland has made do with exchanging the bears’ theater show for a new dark ride in the form of Pooh.

Please note, this is just 2 paragraphs of a long and interesting article, I suggest you read the entire thing before commenting....

CraigMBA
11-20-2003, 07:13 AM
He got it pretty much spot on. A tactical mistake, nothing "evil and sinister" about it.

merlinjones
11-20-2003, 07:23 AM
There are a few oddities in that article: The chart of Tomorrowland gains and losses equates a restaurant with a ride and ignores two restaurant closures and the closure of Skyway and Submarine Voyage and other anolomalies. By my count:

Innoventions for America Sings (-)
Autopia for two older Autopias (-1)
HISTA for Captain EO (-)
Astro-Orbitor for Rocket Jets (-)
Redd Rockett’s Pizza Port for Space Place and Lunching Pad (-1)
No ride for Mission to Mars (-1)
Rocket Rods for PeopleMover and CircleVision, since closed (-2)
No ride for motor boats (-1)
no ride for Submarine voyage (-1)
No ride for skyway (-1)

So I see a LOSS of 8 Tomorrowland area facilities today as compared to Disneyland in the late 80's.

(minor note: Walt didn't close Pack Mules... they were still trekking through Nature's wonderland in the early 70's)

merlinjones
11-20-2003, 07:31 AM
>>He got it pretty much spot on. A tactical mistake, nothing "evil and sinister" about it.<<

Depends on your defintion of tactical mistake.

They were well warned to invest properly in the Rocket Rods by banking the track, and the decision to cut the approved budget of TL 98 by half in mid-planning personally benefitted the pocketbooks of executives, but detroyed the potential payoff of the land. Non-creatives making major creative calls also soiled the land.

The sum of these actions is more than tactical error, that is stupidity and incompetence on a grand scale, tinted by greed, lust for power and arrogance in intent and attitude. Whatever all that adds up to it has emotions and karma attached.

Business people are still human and should be held accountable for their all to human ego farts.

Kevin Yee
11-20-2003, 08:23 AM
I agree that if you compare 1980s TL to 1998 TL, you've got a loss of about 8 attractions.

My chart, though, was created to compare TL 1997 with TL 1998. I guess I didn't make that clear enough in the article. In other words, what did the "Imagination and Beyond" rehab do? Motorboats, Skyway, etc were not involved. Subs was a separate deal not at the same time as the Opening of New TL.

I toyed with making R2P2 a loss since it replaced a ride. I also toyed with Lunching Pad becoming a radio station. In the end, I figured the restaurant-for-ride thing was balanced by me not including the exhibits of NASA and Cosmic Toilet.

merlinjones
11-20-2003, 08:35 AM
>>I agree that if you compare 1980s TL to 1998 TL, you've got a loss of about 8 attractions.<<

Let's see an article on that!:)

iwannabeanimagineer
11-20-2003, 08:48 AM
Originally posted by merlinjones
...the decision to cut the approved budget of TL 98 by half in mid-planning personally benefitted the pocketbooks of executives, but detroyed the potential payoff of the land.
Do you have any support for a statement like this? If it were an obvious leap of logic, I could let it go, but it's possible that the executives that made the decision to cut the budget needed to do so for reasons other than personal gain. My experience in major corporations has shown that making a major budget cut may save your job or create a coup if you can put the money into something more lucrative, but rarely any direct personal gain. In fact, if they are stockholders, they may have shot themselves and every other stockholder in the foot. For those who subscribe to the theory that capitalism=greed=evil, the statement might need no support, but I don't subscribe to that theory.


Originally posted by merlinjones
The sum of these actions is more than tactical error, that is stupidity and incompetence on a grand scale, tinted by greed, lust for power and arrogance in intent and attitude.
Again, without some support, this appears to be mud-flinging.



Originally posted by merlinjones
Business people are still human and should be held accountable for their all to human ego farts.
No question they should be held accountable. Are you saying Disney hasn't noticed the goofs and won't hold them accountable?

Doodle Duck
11-20-2003, 08:54 AM
Numbers of disappointments aside...bottom line is the changes to the MAP overall SUCKED and for the reasons Kevin and merlinjones give in tandem.

Paul Pressler effectively put DL in a dumper for all the wrong reasons and skates away clean as a whistle...the man was/is a villain and vile enough to be called to task at every opportunity.

Good job Kevin.

Forbin
11-20-2003, 09:08 AM
1) I don't agree with the orbiter being a '-'. I used to ride it in the 80's and I can now ride it in the 2000s. I loved that ride, and still do

2) You forgot what I consider the biggest '+'. The Buzz Lightyear show. It's not much of a ride...but then, neither was mission to mars.

Duane
11-20-2003, 10:04 AM
The Magic Kingdom in Disney World, like Disneyland, has not received a new E-ride in the past decade either. Do we want to blame this on California Adventure too? Similar to California, Orlando is adding new E-rides to their other parks but not the Magic Kingdom. Why add attractions to parks which are already filled to capacity? Disneyland still offers several more attractions than the Magic Kingdom in Orlando so consider yourselves lucky. Although I'm not blown away by California Adventure, it is much more exciting than MGM in Florida. We don't even bother with MGM anymore while visiting. I'll have to admit that if DCA was not located within walking distance of Disneyland, we probably wouldn't bother visiting there either!

merlinjones
11-20-2003, 10:40 AM
>>Are you saying Disney hasn't noticed the goofs and won't hold them accountable?<<

Eisner still reigns. Pressler and his finance lackey are reigning over the GAP - - all still making millions, and the institutional investors seem to be quite happy with the status quo at WDC - - as rides are shuttered, guests perish and animation is discontinued... meanwhile we are stuck with an ugly Tomorrowland and no good cartoons. And this is all the fault of fans and talent, not the senior execs?

More power to the elite.

merlinjones
11-20-2003, 10:42 AM
>>The Magic Kingdom in Disney World, like Disneyland, has not received a new E-ride in the past decade either.<<

Alien Encounter

merlinjones
11-20-2003, 10:52 AM
>>My experience in major corporations has shown that making a major budget cut may save your job or create a coup if you can put the money into something more lucrative, but rarely any direct personal gain. <<

If executive compensation packages include bonus incentives - - as they do at WDC - - corruption is often the net result. If they took home any extra money that year, part of it came from the budget for fixing the Tiki Room or building banked turns for Rocket Rods... or any injuries that happened at the expense of deferred mainenence. Also, Pressler was angling to become Eisner's goldenboy and potential successor by wielding the axe and driving the profit margins to impress Scrooge himself. This is also personal gain.

Sheila
11-20-2003, 11:07 AM
Originally posted by iwannabeanimagineer
Do you have any support for a statement like this? If it were an obvious leap of logic, I could let it go, but it's possible that the executives that made the decision to cut the budget needed to do so for reasons other than personal gain.

Unfortunately and oh-so-sadly, merlinjones is very correct. Although I do not have the "proof" at my fingertips, at the time the new Tomorrowland was being built, there were many, many leaks about how the budget was cut midstream.

Merlin, please jump in here and correct me if I have my facts jumbled up here (it's been a while): Basically, the Imagineers were given a fairly tight budget for the re-do. As the costs escalated, they realized they would need more money in order to properly create the Rocket Rods ride because it was discovered that the PeopleMover track was inadequate.

The accountaneers said no. At that point, the Imagineers had to start cutting the budgets for all the other additions in order to get the Rocket Rods up and running. At one point, Tony Baxter even donated artwork from his own personal collection just to theme Redd Rocket's.

So I can understand the beancounters wanting to hold down the costs of a ride whose costs were rapidly escalating. However, when the whole budget for the land was not even enough to begin with, then the project was pretty much doomed to failure from the beginning.

Sheila

merlinjones
11-20-2003, 11:15 AM
Yes, Sheila, and I recall hearing/reading that the budget to build a scaled back version of TL had been approved... and then they whittled it down by half again during the process. When no corporate sponsor materialized for RR, they cannibalized other budgets as you say.

Who do you think profited from TL coming in under budget?

The whole RR ride failed - - in thrill, operation and maintenence - - due to the lack of committing to the banked turns. Of this they had been duly warned. What a waste of time, money and opportunity.

That Tony had to use his own posters is a fact and a double crime... since DL and WDI trashed and burned stacks of those hand screened posters back in the 80's to save money on storage! ...and now they only have fading litho repros to use at the train depot!

DrIndianaJones
11-20-2003, 12:21 PM
I wonder when Al will have a new article.

I must say that this is one Kevin Yee article that I have nearly 100% agreed with. He his right on the money.
Personally I want to see the "nature future" idea. This would allow for some great thematic elements. Though the 2055 Alien Infestation would be cool too.:cool:

merlinjones
11-20-2003, 12:51 PM
>>Personally I want to see the "nature future" idea.<<

Nah - - it's too much like Frontierland and Adventureland in the overall schematic balance of design. What was cool about Tomorrowland was its contrast... cool color schemes, stark design, it was futurustic and unique by way of contrast to the warmth and heavy forestation of the west side.

Mr. Wiggins
11-20-2003, 01:34 PM
A tactical mistake, nothing "evil and sinister" about it.Many of those who've spent years hands-on in the WDC creative trenches have a quite different point of view.

CraigMBA
11-20-2003, 05:01 PM
Originally posted by Mr. Wiggins
Many of those who've spent years hands-on in the WDC creative trenches have a quite different point of view.

Keeping projects on time and under budget is what keeps your job when you do projects for a living. Reacting to what comes your way via the budgeting process is what gets you another crack at another project instead of a reservation on the unemployment line. If you find that sort of motovation "Evil and Sinster" OR you think that sort of thing is only found within corporate Disney (read that: it's everywhere) you're dead wrong.

BTW, that pressure to meet budgets comes from INSTITUTIONAL SHAREHOLDERS and their expectations for quarterly earnings. You want to fix the problem with the park maintance issues/lack of E tickets/rides offline? Fix the assumptions that you will make earnings improvments every quarter and find a way to get the institutional investors to lighten up!

I don't know if you've been paying attention to recent business news, but the pressure to meet earnings expectations have been getting to some companies, and as a result, the decided to get cute with their accounting. After they get caught, they never live for very long.

At least DL's books are straight.

wendybeth
11-20-2003, 09:23 PM
"At least DL's books are straight"

Do you know that for a fact? What about the Disney Co? I would be very nervous, and angry, if I were a shareholder these days. You blame nefarious financial doings on the pressure to produce profits; what about corporates' responsibility to ensure the long term stability of the company? Eisner had engaged in some very lucrative (and questionable) financial activities that have greatly enriched his personal coffers; Ovitz and his infamous 'Golden Parachute', and now the intentional neglect of Disneyland in order to redirect funding to Eisner's little excercise in ego- DCA. I don't buy your jaded explanation of 'this is how the big boys play in the business world' either; that sort of attitude has given us Enron, MCI, K-Mart, Kaiser, and so many other business's that have been raided into bankruptcy. My city was home to Kaiser for decades, then Hurwitz and the Maxiim group took it over and ran it into the ground. We lost thousands of jobs and it has wiped out our economy, and this sort of thing is occuring all across the nation. I think that most people who live in the real world and are adversely affected by such activities would agree that individuals who are engaged in this kind of business are indeed 'evil and sinister'...

Morrigoon
11-20-2003, 09:27 PM
Wendybeth: first place to look is their 10-K filings with the SEC. If they're doing creative accounting, it will show up in the footnotes. See how many "special charges" they take, how many related party transactions are taking place (Eisner's not THAT dumb, is he?) and see how many footnotes seem intended to confuse even the most financially educated. That'll give you a good idea whether they're getting creative or not.

There's a book about this, called "Financial Fine Print", worth reading, very interesting stuff. You should see what they used to do with loans! (Instead of paying the CEO a certain amount, which he'd be taxed on, they'd make a loan to him, portions of which would be forgiven for each year the CEO in question remained with the company... sneaky stuff and no longer allowed, but many companies still have some grandfathered-in loans on their books. I'm fairly sure Disney is not one of them though)

Tigertail777
11-20-2003, 09:56 PM
first off, DISNEY's books arnt straight (hello shredding of pooh evidence/documentation anyone?).... SO how could the other smaller branch of the same company be "clean"? I am willing to bet the pooh shredding is just the tip of the iceburg in Disney's bag of dirty tactics.

Secondly, what you say is true to a degree, but a) one of the things that USED to seperate Disney from the dog eat dog corporate world was they they ran things different. Even in Walt's time those ways were considered old fashioned and passe by the rest of the corporate world, but hey guess what? that kind of more down to earth attitude with the paying public, and above all MORE honesty (not complete honesty) than other businesses made Disney, and Disneyland in particular a big hit with the public.
b) We are not talking about some EXPECTED or minor budget cuts, we are talking taking a budget, cutting it in half, setting people to work on the project with the thought that would be THE budget, then coming in later and saying "guess what guys? we have to cut THAT budget in half". Gee you think this might demoralize and embitter nearly all who work for them when they are CONSTANTLY lied to, and never know when the budget axe may fall on some marvelous new project they are working on? What would be the point of continiuing to dazzle when its going to get chopped down anyways?

Meanwhile, wow big surprise Michael Eisner and several top execs get big fat bonuses, bonuses big enough to have covered some of the major problems happening. It doesnt take a huge leap of logic to figure that bonus money is not coming out of thin air, and has to come from somewhere, since it sure isnt coming from many profits. WHAT IS THERE TO SHOW OF in Disneyland, Disneyworld, the Disney company itself that would justify that kind of bonus? What DIRECTLY did eisner do to deserve that bonus? if anyone deserved that kind of money it was all the peons that he took credit for their ideas and hard work.

As for what is happening in business news now... just because it IS happening does that make it right? Does it even in the long run make it the best way to run a business? NO. Its more like raping and pillaging a village (yo-ho its a corporate life for me), many of these comapnies leave nothing but wreck and ruin behind, and they dont care because they still get away with it. I think we are coming at another cross roads for big businesses like Disney, just as when the definition of monopoly was defined with the likes of JP Morgan and other tycoons. Its time to redefine what businesses can and cannot do, and enforce those rules. There is many businesses out there that under normal logic are definately monopolies, but wriggle out of any legal complications under legal loopholes. I cannot understand for instance for the life of me how "Time/Warner/AOL" could NOT be considered a monopoly... they own, or partially own the major part of the entire publishing industry... were talking a good 90% of all the mainstream book publishers.
Hate to say it, bit it looks more and more like we are heading into a bladerunner future, where corporations are so huge and mighty that they are even more important than the government, and they are only a tiny handful of them that squash all small businesses. It wont take but a good 30 more years (perhaps less) the way things are going, unless large businesses are held more accountable. We are still dealing with the mess Enron left behind here in Oregon, and its not a small matter its quite considerable.

Sorry for the long rant... my hot button was pressed down hard.

TerryTiger
11-20-2003, 09:57 PM
Originally posted by merlinjones
>>The Magic Kingdom in Disney World, like Disneyland, has not received a new E-ride in the past decade either.<<

Alien Encounter

Like Rocket Rods, Alien Encounter opened in the past decade and is now closed for good. I would rate it a D-ticket at best anyway so I'm sure it doesn't count.

wendybeth
11-20-2003, 10:16 PM
Tigertail777 "Yo ho it's a corporate life for me.."


LOL!!! Thanks, Tigertail, great post and a great new catchphrase!:cool: There is no excuse, no justification that can make these sort of dealings morally or ethically acceptable, especially not at the Disney Co. :mad:

Mr. Wiggins
11-20-2003, 10:31 PM
>>Sorry for the long rant... my hot button was pressed down hard.<<

Never try to teach an MBA to emote. It wastes your time and annoys the MBA.