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mspangler
09-14-2001, 04:26 PM
Disneyland will always be the best. Even DCA is great (and yes, I did say great) when you compare it to ANY other park out there.

I absolutely despise Universal and Six Flags parks (again, sorry for those out there who like them) but even when I put DCA in front of them, they will never win. Here are a few reasons why:

*DCA has better rides....I'd rather ride on Soarin' or Screamin' anyday rather than some cheap, crummy pieced-together junk coasters and carnival rides.

*DCA's Paradise Pier may have a carnival feel, but certainly nothing as trashy as the above mentioned parks or the Santa Cruz Boardwalk (you want to see "trashy carnival"? Go there.)

*DCA, like all Disney parks I've visited, is clean--and it is kept clean. No graffiti in sight. No gum and cigarette butts all over the ground. Spills are promptly cleaned up, not left for hours at a time like at other places.

*Those absolutely wonderful CM's at our parks are the best out there....no other park can compare....in my experience, they have never ever been rude or unfriendly. They have always been helpful, and they do everything with a smile on their face....thanks guys (and gals)! :D

*The food. Ever had Universal or Six Flags food? :rolleyes: 'Nuff said. (plus, try to find Coke at some other places....I hate when some places only serve Pepsi...)

*The atmosphere. Even DCA's atmosphere is at the top. I know, it's not Disneyland, but then again, it's definitely not Six Flags or Universal either. :)

*Maintenance. You want to see some REAL run down places? I know Disneyland isn't what it should be in the maintenance department, but it sure looks a lot better than these other places....

*Anything else I left out---all of those little details---that's why most of us love Disneyland and DCA so much.

My point is, no matter how bad the DLR does, it will always be the best.

Anyone else out there who agrees?


See you there! I'm going at Christmas, can't wait! :D

pheneix
09-14-2001, 04:35 PM
Have you been to Universal Studios? Have you been to Islands of Adventure? It sounds to me like you went to a Six Flags and lumped Universal into the same heap without having even going.

I agree with your Six Flags comparison, but I have to wonder how you base your Universal comments.

BTW, Universal Orlando now serves Coke, and has for quite a while.

Please elaborate on why Universal is so bad to you.

Pheneix

mspangler
09-14-2001, 04:47 PM
Phenix,

Yes I have been to Universal here in California. Have not been to Islands of Adventure....not sure if I *could* be missing out on something. And, yes, even though it was just a small complaint, I did see that Universal was serving Coke (finally!) recently.

I agree with Al's update in that yes, they are improving, and I have not seen Islands of Adventure, but my main point was that neither Universal or Six Flags (heck, ANYTHING), in my opinion, will ever equal Disneyland or even DCA....I think most here would agree with me, no? Or has everyone decided that---even with the current situation Disney is in--- that there are better choices?

pheneix
09-14-2001, 04:57 PM
Oh, you're talking about THAT studios. :)

I thought it was a nice park, but besides the tour, I didn't see much of a reason to go back.

But you are really missing out on not going to IOA, you should check it out someday.

Pheneix

FantasmicFan82
09-14-2001, 07:08 PM
HEY, USH has good food. well, only the restaurants do. Any cart stuff is pre-cooked, re-heated junk. Any place there that sellf REAL food is great.

DisneylandKid
09-14-2001, 07:23 PM
Originally posted by mspangler
Disneyland will always be the best. Even DCA is great (and yes, I did say great) when you compare it to ANY other park out there.

I absolutely despise Universal and Six Flags parks (again, sorry for those out there who like them) but even when I put DCA in front of them, they will never win. Here are a few reasons why:

*DCA has better rides....I'd rather ride on Soarin' or Screamin' anyday rather than some cheap, crummy pieced-together junk coasters and carnival rides.

*DCA's Paradise Pier may have a carnival feel, but certainly nothing as trashy as the above mentioned parks or the Santa Cruz Boardwalk (you want to see "trashy carnival"? Go there.)

*DCA, like all Disney parks I've visited, is clean--and it is kept clean. No graffiti in sight. No gum and cigarette butts all over the ground. Spills are promptly cleaned up, not left for hours at a time like at other places.

*Those absolutely wonderful CM's at our parks are the best out there....no other park can compare....in my experience, they have never ever been rude or unfriendly. They have always been helpful, and they do everything with a smile on their face....thanks guys (and gals)! :D

*The food. Ever had Universal or Six Flags food? :rolleyes: 'Nuff said. (plus, try to find Coke at some other places....I hate when some places only serve Pepsi...)

*The atmosphere. Even DCA's atmosphere is at the top. I know, it's not Disneyland, but then again, it's definitely not Six Flags or Universal either. :)

*Maintenance. You want to see some REAL run down places? I know Disneyland isn't what it should be in the maintenance department, but it sure looks a lot better than these other places....

*Anything else I left out---all of those little details---that's why most of us love Disneyland and DCA so much.

My point is, no matter how bad the DLR does, it will always be the best.

Anyone else out there who agrees?
:D
I agree completely. It is good to see a TRUE Disney-park Fan!

mspangler
09-14-2001, 07:41 PM
Originally posted by DisneylandKid

I agree completely. It is good to see a TRUE Disney-park Fan!

AT LAST! Someone who actually thinks about Disney parks the way I do! :D :D :D

Darkbeer
09-14-2001, 07:42 PM
I would much rather stand in an Universal queue than a DCA queue. At least they give you shade (unlike the Hyperion queue..), and they have pre-show items, like Disneyland, to give you something to do (Unlike Soarin or GRR).

Have you ever seen Terminator 3-D??? This is a real movie ride, a videotape pre-pre-show in the queue, then a pre-show inside the building, including a live actor, who does a great job. Then the movie itself, 3-D, plus adding live actors, motion chairs, and other special effects. Total show from entering the queue to the end. What do you get in the WWTBAM-PI queue, two glossy pictures on the side of the building. (Don't take me wrong, I like the show on the inside of the building, but they didn't even try to hide the back of the Superstar Limo facade.

Jurassic Park's queue keeps you in the shade, plus has plenty of monitors giving you a pre-show to keep you entertained while waiting for the ride itself. Jurassic Park has a lot more Audio-animatronics than GRR does...

Heck, the Tram tour even has monitors in its queue now. Six Flags even has placed monitors in its queue's. Why not place some shade for the Hyperion queue, plus monitors. You can run previews for future Disney releases, plus other information regarding upcoming Disney events, plus some special pre-recorded messages from current Disney/ABC shows, to keep you occupied while waiting for the doors to open. (Now, adding bathrooms and escalators would be nice also.)

DCA is not a bad park, but seemed to be built more along the lines of Six Flags/Universal, not the old Disneyland standards, which makes people want to compare it.

Food, ever have Doc Brown's fried Chicken?? Not as good as Knott's, but still not bad. And the food at Universal's Citywalk is awesome.

Dark rides, ET over Superstar Limo any day....

Terminator 3-D overall is better than Soarin'

Jurassic Park over GRR

Backdraft over Armagdion (Even if DCA hasn't even built it...)

Tram Tour over... (Well, nothing last more than a half-hour at DCA)

Disneyland is still the best park in Southern California... but without replacing closed rides (and the replacements being better than what was removed...), continued maintenance, plus the addition of new state-of-the-art rides, ten years from now might be a different story.

I hope that they fix the known problems at DCA, and keep adding new attractions. (And not charge the same as DL until the amount of attractions increase...).

Six Flags is not a bad park, it does go after a different market than Disney, Thrill rides. But look what is happening at SFMM, they built three coasters to become the park with the most coasters in the world, and the coasters they built are state-of-the-art! They might not have the themeing of DL, but they are
making changes for the better.

I am so glad that DL is doing a holiday makeover of HM, but that is a makeover, where is the new and better....

Knott's tore down Windjammer because it was a bad ride (they are suing the builders of it..) and replacing it with something new and better.... They try and theme the areas (not as well as Disney, but parts of the park have good themeing, heck the old Knott's Bear-y tales was GREAT themeing).

What is Disney doing, closing down rides (Submarines, Rocket Rods..) and let the area gather dust...

As for the Cast members, at Universal, they have always kept the park clean, and the cast members have been great. As for Six Flags, its been over a year since I have been there, but they were doing their jobs. Seems like some Disney cast members still go out of their way, but I find more Disney Cast Members lately just "do the job" just like Universal, Six Flags and Knott's. And my best cast member experiance was from a Knott's employee. (Though I have had more "excellent" Disney CM experences.)

I still love DLR, especially DL, plus Downtown Disney and the Hotel areas. I think that DCA was done on the cheap, and that it shows. Compare Jumpin Jellyfish at TDS vs DCA.

I think that Universal Studios Hollywood and Sea World are about equal in value and experence to DCA. Six Flags is different, but they are spending money on new state-of-the-art attractions. And DCA hasn't spent that much (Soarin' is the best example of that, but they cut corners on the ride...)

I will still go to DCA, just as I will go to USH, Sea World and Knott's, and plan to go to SFMM a few weeks after they get all the rides up and running. They are all great parks, but just because California Adventure has "Disney" in front of it will not make me not compare it to the other parks. I am not a DCA hater, I plan to renew my 2-park pass, mainly since I can park-hop the same day, DCA has some good things. But DCA opened as a disappointment, and a park that did not stand out as better than any other park (other than DL).

Darkbeer aka David Michael

"Terrorist attacks can shake foundations of our biggest buildings, but they cannot touch the foundation of America." President George W. Bush, Sept. 11, 2001.

Thomas
09-15-2001, 09:18 AM
mspangler, either you have never been to USH, or you are just trying to...I don't know what you are trying to do.

I am a former manager at USH and now work for them in another capacity.

USH never has and probably never will claim to be DL or DCA.

Regarding your first point, USH does not have any rollercoasters or carnival rides, so what are you comparing?

USH is in no way a trashy park.

USH is very clean and is cleaned on a nightly basis which includes all windows being cleaned and the entire park being hosed down each night.

I guess you go to DL or DCA when all the polite CM's are working. I have run into numerous rude CM's, but hey, we all have bad days at work. I guess you live in Fantasyland or something.

Yes, the food at SFMM is horrible.

Do you know that USH paints there hand rails at rides and attractions almost on a daily basis? Who doesn't do that? Oh yeah, DL and DCA. What are all those glue spots on the facade of Small World.

Anything else you left out? How about you don't have to take a tram to get to the park (except to see it).

I totally agree with your regarding SFMM. I live close to SFMM. In fact, I can see it from my backyard. I went there once last year, and for a place that is closed M-F most of the year, the park looks horrible. We went on a SUnday at opening and there was trash still in the que lines of most rides from the night before. SFMM I feel has no excuse for the way their park looks.

Even though I 'work' for USH, I am and always will be, a DL fan.

Doodle Duck
09-15-2001, 11:56 AM
Thomas, full suport!

USH is a major World Class Park Experience. I really miss my pass.
Always clean* & well maintained...always friendly...always cutting edge...we really love the place and can't wait to get back this fall.


*If only there was a way to get many of the visitors to consider using deoderant and possibly WASH their clothes! Especially before riding on a wet ride or show! This seems to be a problem at USH more than other parks.

DisneylandKid
09-15-2001, 01:03 PM
I will agree that USH is a clean park. Knott's has more of a trashy feeling to it. And I have never been to SFMM, so I can't say anything about it. As I have said before, though, NOTHING compares with DL and even DCA. They have themes, Knott's does too, but they don't do as good of a job. USH doesn't really have themed lands.

I am a true disney fan.

mspangler
09-15-2001, 02:48 PM
Originally posted by DisneylandKid
I will agree that USH is a clean park.

To all of those who assume I also included Universal as part of the "unclean" parks, I want to say that I did not mean it that way...I was referring to many other places such as SFMM, SF Marine World, the Santa Cruz Boardwalk, etc. As DL Kid said above, I agree that USH is a CLEAN park, but that does not make it a GOOD park....again, just my opinion here.


Knott's has more of a trashy feeling to it.

I'm not sure about Knott's or Islands of Adventure, as someone else mentioned above, as I have never been to either park.


NOTHING compares with DL and even DCA.
I am a true disney fan.

That was my whole point to begin with...just to say, based on the other "amusement parks" I have visited, nothing else can compare to even DCA's level.

And I really can't call any Disney park an "amusement park"...because they will always leave every other park in the dust.

I love DL and DCA both. I can't find any other park out there that will top them--in my opinion, there will never be better parks than Disney parks.

Again, for all those who oppose, these are just my OPINIONS....people are entitled to their own views. After all, if we all thought the DLR was the best, it'd be even tougher to get into the gates and get reservations at the Disney hotels. :D

ripplededge
09-15-2001, 03:30 PM
Everyone has their own opinions about things and I am fine with that. I just want to bring up something Thomas said:

"Do you know that USH paints there hand rails at rides and attractions almost on a daily basis? Who doesn't do that? Oh yeah, DL and DCA."

The reason DL or DCA doesn't have to paint their rails on "attractions" everyday is because CM's are doing their jobs. As opposed to whatever other park that paints their's every single day.
Although, I must admit the DLR's painting expertise isn't what it used to be.

Darkbeer
09-15-2001, 03:44 PM
Amazing, as reported by Jim Hill at Laughing Place.

Disney is planning to buy one of the Slingshot rides, that are also featured at SFMM and Knott's. (Knott's hasn't finished installing yet..) They are planning it for WDW, but it will be an additional pay-per-ride feature. Did SFMM and Knott's get an state-of-the-art that Disney couldn't live without, or is it the fact that Disney is taking a step down in standards????

What's next, Universal and Six Flags are charging extra for their "Fast-Pass" like systems.... could Disney be next????

What a concept, heck, maybe they can convert all the rides to pay-per-ride, just charge a general admission, and sell ticket books, in fact, make the rides have different values, you could label the tickets by numbers, or better yet, letters. You could make "A" tickets for the simpler rides, and keep going, till you stop, maybe like "E" for the most popular rides :D

Nigel2
09-15-2001, 06:02 PM
Originally posted by Thomas
Oh yeah, DL and DCA. What are all those glue spots on the facade of Small World.


I dont think they are glue spots, thats what they connect the christmas lights to so they dont need to spend even more time with IASW/SMH shut down. Yeah, I know its ugly, but what are you gonna do?

Speaking of food, is it just me or do those jerky things they sell at some of the carts smell horrible?

stevefulton
09-15-2001, 06:40 PM
Universal Studios Hollywood is a great park. Yes, it is *IS NOT* Disneyland or DCA, but for what it is, it is the best in the world.

Universal Studios has been a working film studio since March 15th, 1915. The history of the park is amazing. It is like the history of the 20th century rolled into one day's adventure. The story of how Carl Laemmle fought the the film industry "Trust" of the early century to build his studio would make a great movie in itself). For a film buff, there is no real comparision to Universal Studios (even the Warner Bros Studio tour simply pales in comparision).

Universal opened its gates in 1964, and at that time it had no asperations to be a Theme Park. The 2 1/2 hour tram ride/walking tour was jam-packed with some of the most interesting displays of Hollywood history and person off-the-street could imagine. It was like a living museum to 50 years of filmmaking.

Through the years, this has deteriorated a bit. The Tram-Tour was cut down to the bone in the early 90's (after the fire), and many more "attractions" were added to make the park feel like a Theme Park. However, there are still 7 world-class attractions currently at the park:
1. "Back To The Future"
2. "Jurrassic Park"
3. "E.T."
4. "Terminator 3-D."
5. "Back Draft"
6. "Waterworld" show
7. Western Stunt Show

I hate to say it, but these all DO add up to more entertainment than DCA.

Plus, for kids, the new "Nickelodeon Blast Zone" is fantatsic.

The tram-tour, while sorely missing the great "Battlestar Galactica" portion from the early 80's, is still quite good. "Earthquake" and "King Kong" are still a joy to see. "Jaws" is showing its age, but they recently rehabbed it and its a lot better. Plus, you still get to see histpric sets and have the chance to see real movies and TV shows filing in-progress.

Disney just can't match the actual film history of Universal Studios. Sure, they can try with MGM, and Hollywood Backlot at DCA, but it is not the same. There is no park in the world where you could see the filming of "The Time Machine" and "The Power Rangers", and "hot" sets for "Jurassic Park 3" in the same day. If that is what you are into, then Universal is the only place to go.

I do wish the "Tram Tour" was more like the old days, and I do think they need to add at least 2 more world-class attractions to make the park really stand-out, however they are far better-off than DCA, which I think could only be improved with a few bull-dozers and a wrecking-ball.

Steve Fulton

Nigel2
09-15-2001, 09:34 PM
Speaking of the studio aspect, does anyone know if MGM studions does any production there anymore? I saw some developers for Sheena, but I don't think they use the studio as a studio anymore. Or at least as much.

SimpTwister
09-16-2001, 05:03 AM
DCA could really use something like Jurassic Park- A nice long boat ride with AA's and a big drop at the end!

Not sure how they could theme it, though... A classic Old Mill-type dark ride in PP would work... Or WRE!!!

Thomas
09-16-2001, 08:20 AM
The reason DL or DCA doesn't have to paint their rails on "attractions" everyday is because CM's are doing their jobs.


I'm sorry, have you been through DL lately, especially it's a small world?

DisneylandBoy
09-16-2001, 08:47 AM
Originally posted by Darkbeer

Backdraft over Armagdion (Even if DCA hasn't even built it...)


WOAH! SLOW DOWN! How could you say this? This quote right here proves that you are biased towads USH. Armagedon hasn't even been built at DCA - you have no idea what it is going to be like. Wait until they build it, then you can rethink your position. If it's the same, fine. But if it changes . . . Just wait. Ok?

ripplededge
09-16-2001, 05:20 PM
Reply to Thomas'

"I'm sorry, have you been through DL lately, especially it's a small world?"

Uhhh no Thomas I am only a S/O at DLR, so no I haven't been there in like 3 hours.
I am sorry that you don't like the paint job at It's A Small World. If you like you can go down to Casting at TDA, building 700, and ask for an application to work on the paint job, so you can make it to your liking... if you wish. Their open Monday thru Friday..... don't wait, go today!

Darkbeer
09-16-2001, 08:41 PM
Two comments....

First, the Backdraft comparison was SARCASTIC!!!! I think we all know that DCA has NOT built anything like Backdraft.... I am not bias towards either park, I like them both!!! And if DCA builds something like Backdraft, then I will compare the two and figure out which I like more (And maybe decide I like both of them... will wait and see...)

As for the queue painting, was at DL/DCA Saturday night, and Space Mountain really needs some painting, and not just the queue rails, there was a few places on the walls that realy need some paint and TLC!!!

If you are looking towards bias, look at the first couple of posts, and how people responded.... USH is NOT DCA, but still is a good park, and did not deserve some of the slams it got!!!

Wackokid
09-16-2001, 11:15 PM
Knott's is still better for DCA i mean DL and Knott's try to do two different things but DCA tried to be a thrill park also and sorta failed compared to Knott's
what do you mean Knott's has a "trashy" feel?
is there trash everywhere?
Knott's doesnt have as much theming as DL and DCA(it still has lots) but the rides make up for it
just like the rides at DL arent that thrilling, but the theming makes them more fun

Thomas
09-17-2001, 10:57 AM
What's an S/O? I am not completely up on Disneyspeak.

FredofLasVegas
09-17-2001, 11:49 AM
My point is, no matter how bad the DLR does, it will always be the best.


My point here is that you COMPLETELY bias towards Disney. You are a victim of the "Disney Dogma" and the above statement you wrote proves it! And it is thinking like that that has caused Disney executives to run the parks as poorly as they have recently, and the reasons why we are now getting half-baked attractions with extreme budgets cuts. All of because of people like you who still say Disney will still be the best no matter what they do. Shame on you!

I'm sorry---but this post you wrote disgusts me. It shows you have absolutely NO TASTE. True, DL has many attractions that are absolutely incredible like Indiana Jones, Pirates, Haunted Mansion, and the list goes on and on and on. DL in a way is still the BEST but far below what it could be. How you can think DCA falls into that category is beyond me. Soarin' may be awesome but that is one ride. Screamin' is fun---but very gimmicky when you compare it to the *real* thing. As in "real" I mean comparing it to REAL WOODEN COASTERS like Ghostrider at Knott's or the classic Giant Dipper at Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk.

And speaking of both parks, I have visited both Knott's and SCBB and never found them to be dumpy or dirty. SCBB I found to be one of the most delightful amusement parks I've ever visited. I never felt uncomfortable with the crowds, never found the place dirty, and was impressed with many of its authentic carnival rides that DCA fails to duplicate with its cheap gimmicks. The classic Giant Dipper, I already mentioned, is maintained extremely well. I took a tour of the coaster and I was amazed how much TLC goes into it. SCBB also has a brass ring Carousel, which is A LOT of fun and *very* rare to find these days. And have you tried the food at SCBB---believe it or not--I find it be a better value than Disney's food these days. The owners of SCBB take tremendous pride in their little park. I cannot say the same for the people of Disney these days. I mean, have you EVER been to SCBB?

How you can praise DCA (for being cheap and fake) and pan SCBB (for being truely authentic) is sick! The same goes for Knott's, which is light years better than DCA. Knott's and SCBB make for a better "California adventure" than DCA does. Spend sometime at both, forget your bias towards Disney and you will see what I mean.

As for IOA, I have never been but everyone who has been to it that I know has RAVED about it. Many have said that Spiderman is the BEST ride they have ever been on! Including anything at Disney. When comparing IOA to DCA it shows how much heart Disney did not have in DCA.

Now having said all that, I will agree with you on the Six Flags aspect. SFMM is becoming one of my least favorite SF parks (I have been to ALL of them in the US). The park is poorly operated, the coaster either poorly maintained or highly overbraked, or both. The employees are unenthusiastic. The park is essentially an emperor with no clothes. With "X" opening, SFMM will have claimed the title of be the park with the most coasters, beating out Cedar Point. Even with that, the park still has little to offer. I get bored after a few hours at SFMM, but will spend 2 days at Cedar Point wanting to stay another day.

Not all Six Flags parks are bad. The two that are definitely worth the trip are Six Flags over Texas in Arlington, TX and Six Flags Great America in Gurnee, IL. Both are well themed, efficiently operated, have a great collection of coaster, and are far more enjoyable than DCA.

Here are my grades for the parks mentioned:

Disneyland: A-
DCA: C
SFMM: C-
Knott's: A-
Cedar Point: A
SCBB: B+
SFOT: A-
SFGRam: B+

Just something to put in perspective. It's all about what parks want to do and how well they do it. These companies have set their own standards, and DCA has fallen way short of what Disney is capable. So Disneyland may be still the best, but DCA is NOT DL.

Fred of Las Vegas