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thamnarestan
08-28-2001, 12:18 PM
How do you all feel about Disneyland's smoking policy? A couple incidents over the weekend have compelled me to ask this question.

First, on Friday, I was standing next to another CM (female) outside when we started to smell cigarette smoke. We looked around, found the source of the smoke, and she approached to smoker to ask him to put out the cigarette. Though she had politely explained the policy and told him where the designated smoking area was, the man started yelling and cussing at her. I ran over to the scene to provide backup and told the man to watch his language and leave, which he did, but not without letting out a little more foul language, of course.

Then, on Sunday, a woman came up to me and started complaining about how terrible the area in front of the Splash Mtn smoking area is. She said, "Why can't they just leave their cigarettes at home?" I really couldn't beleive this woman. The smokers she was complaining about were there following the park smoking policy. They had probably gone out of their way to walk to Critter Country to smoke. All types of guests, including smokers, should be able to enjoy Disneyland.

My personal opinion is that smoking should be allowed outdoors throughout the park. I never noticed that much of a problem before the new policy, and if someone didn't want to smell cigarette smoke, they could just continue walking past the smoker. I don't think it's fair to make smokers walk all the way to Critter Country just to smoke a cigarette.

Ralph Wiggum
08-28-2001, 12:33 PM
I would have to disagree with you thamnarestan on being able to smoke anywhere outdoors. Not only is second hand smoke a concern but also allergies. I am very allergic to smoke and one smell of it makes my nose run wild.

Its not easy to just walk away from someone smoking. For one, the walkways and open areas at disneyland are not very big. If I were walking through Adventureland and saw someone smoking in front of me I probably wouldnt be able to walk around them cause the smoke travels through the air. I would have to turn around and walk through Frontierland.

Also, if your waiting for a parade/fireworks/Fantasmic and someone lights up a cigarette your stuck with the annoying, deadly, allergy agrivating smoke or you have to move.

One thing I will give you Thamnarestan is the lack of smoking sections. They really should figure out a few more locations to provide for this disgusting habit.

$.02

blusilva
08-28-2001, 12:37 PM
I'm a smoker, and although I can go a day without a cigarette, I like to have one or two while I'm relaxing (like I am at Disneyland). That being said, I never noticed other smokers at Disneyland until they instituted the "designated smoking areas" either. I think it's far more smelly to have all the smokers congregate in one area than it is allowing smoking all over the park. And when they are all together, and I smell that smell, THAT makes me crave a cigarette. I can only imagine what it must smell like to a non-smoker.

Castmbrdlx
08-28-2001, 12:39 PM
I am a castmember as well and I have had to remind guests of the policy several times only to be told off. I am also a father of a 9 month old and I do not want my daughter to be subjected to second had smoke. While I agree that you can avoid smokers at the park to a point, its those who smoke while in line for a ride (particularly in fantasy land) that bother me most.

blusilva
08-28-2001, 12:47 PM
Originally posted by Castmbrdlx
I am a castmember as well and I have had to remind guests of the policy several times only to be told off.

Disneyland is an international tourist attraction. Smoking is far more prevalant in other countries. Heck, it's far more prevalent in other STATES. I can only imagine you get told off a great deal. The locals are probably pretty much used to being treated like pariahs after years of being ostracized, but I bet the non-locals are pretty livid. And the smoking policy is pretty recent - I imagine most non-locals are completely unaware of it (even though it is printed in the handout. Come on, who really reads those?)

How often are you subjected to the "Walt Disney was a smoker" argument, just out of curiosity?

mad4mky
08-28-2001, 12:51 PM
Since I don't smoke, I didn't even realize that they HAD a policy...until I noticed the smoking area (by the heavy smoke smell as I walked by) by Critter Country. Excuse my ignorance, but is this the ONLY area in DL to smoke? If it is...one isn't enough. No one in my family smokes. But, if they did...we'd have to keep going back to one place? That would be awful.
Now, obviously I could be wrong and there could be more areas. I just havn't seen any...or paid any attention...
But I for one...do enjoy a smoke free environment at DL...and appreciate DL trying to make the park accessable and enjoyable to everyone.

(While at WDW last year, two women were smoking in a ladies room in Epcot, I kindly asked them to not smoke in there since it was against the policy, and I was told to go to h*ll...in not such a nice manor).:(

Castmbrdlx
08-28-2001, 01:00 PM
Originally posted by blusilva


Disneyland is an international tourist attraction. Smoking is far more prevalant in other countries. Heck, it's far more prevalent in other STATES. I can only imagine you get told off a great deal. The locals are probably pretty much used to being treated like pariahs after years of being ostracized, but I bet the non-locals are pretty livid. And the smoking policy is pretty recent - I imagine most non-locals are completely unaware of it (even though it is printed in the handout. Come on, who really reads those?)

How often are you subjected to the "Walt Disney was a smoker" argument, just out of curiosity?

Ive heard that a few times but usually I just get a dirty look and the person walks away.

Bill Catherall
08-28-2001, 01:11 PM
I am a non-smoker and grew up in a non-smoker family. I really can't stand the smell of cigarette smoke. However, having said that, there are very few smells that really remind me of Disneyland and bring back the fond memories. Some cigarette and pipe smoke are among those smells. Particularly cherry pipe smoke. I have no idea why, but when I was a kid that cherry pipe smoke was everywhere and it smelled GOOD.

Now when I am near a smoker that is smoking just the right brand it "sends me back."

Before the smoking policy was implimented at Disneyland we really never had a problem with smokers. We'd pass the occasional smoker, but it didn't bother us. It was usually in a nice open area that we could just hold our breath a moment or two and we'd be clear of it. I haven't been there since the new policy, but I'm sure having all the smokers condensed into designated areas is really kicking up quite a concentrated mess of polution in those areas.

blusilva
08-28-2001, 01:13 PM
Originally posted by Castmbrdlx


Ive heard that a few times but usually I just get a dirty look and the person walks away.

That's better than having people get in your face, I suppose. :)

Part of the problem, too, is the smoking areas seem to change "frequently" (for a theme park, more than once every 3 years is "frequently"). When it first was implemented it seemed like there were three areas - over near the Autopia, at the fountain near the HM and on Big Thunder Trail. The next time I was at the Park, I lit up over in the Autopia smoking area and was suprised it was so devoid of other smokers over there. I didn't realize until I saw a "smoking area" sign elsewhere in the Park later that I the area in which I was smoking was probably no longer copacetic.

Is the Critter Country area the only smoking area now?

Ralph Wiggum
08-28-2001, 01:17 PM
Originally posted by blusilva
How often are you subjected to the "Walt Disney was a smoker" argument, just out of curiosity?

How often are you subjected to the "Walt Disney died from enphazima(or something like that) as a result of his smoking" rebuttle, just out of curiosity? ;)


There are a few smoking locations:
Disneyland

By the exit of Haunted Mansion
Behind Big Thunder along the trail
I believe where the boats use to be near matterhorn
I think theres one in tomorrowland

DCA
Behind the Carosel
Under the lift for Grizzly River Run
In front of Millionare(though i am sure that will move)

Anyone know any others?

Ralph Wiggum
08-28-2001, 01:26 PM
Originally posted by Bill Catherall
I am a non-smoker and grew up in a non-smoker family. I really can't stand the smell of cigarette smoke. However, having said that, there are very few smells that really remind me of Disneyland and bring back the fond memories. Some cigarette and pipe smoke are among those smells. Particularly cherry pipe smoke. I have no idea why, but when I was a kid that cherry pipe smoke was everywhere and it smelled GOOD.

Now when I am near a smoker that is smoking just the right brand it "sends me back."

I know what you mean. I think it has something to do with the "candy" smells Disney pipes onto Main Street from the shops to make you wanna buy things. That smell has the same fragrence as some cigars!

Nigel2
08-28-2001, 01:33 PM
I need to go there on a day with unexpected downpour, just to see if the smokers will obey the rules and sit out in the rain. When I was at WDW I am pretty sure that I saw smoking areas but I am not positive.

no1here
08-28-2001, 01:35 PM
I still think it's cool that the Cigar Store Indian is still perched on Main Street even though the tabacco shop has been gone for years. The only time I disliked the smoking around the park was when standing in a long line on a hot summer day. Second hand smoke just makes it that much worse.

thamnarestan
08-28-2001, 01:38 PM
Smoking is supposed to be a relaxing experience, but it seems like it would be hard to relax smoking in a tiny little area crowded with 20 other smokers. The old Plaza Pavilion smoking area worked quite well, because it was a large patio with tables and chairs, not just benches. And the smoke had room to dissipate. I suppose, though, that too many people complained of smelling smoke while walking down Main Street.

The smoking areas, in my opinion, would work better if they were expanded to include, for example, the entire Big Thunder Trail, or the entire path from the Haunted Mansion to the Hungry Bear restaurant.

As for the frequent changes, I agree that's a big problem. I'm not even sure where the other areas are, beyond the Thunder Trail and Splash areas.

I will restate this: both as a Cast Member and a Guest, before the new smoking policy was implemented, I never observed any problems with cigarette smoke or smokers. Now, people are complaining all the time about the smoke coming from the designated areas, and Cast Members are getting into arguments with otherwise innocent smoking Guests. The new policy has just created a lot of new problems.

blusilva
08-28-2001, 01:54 PM
Originally posted by Ralph Wiggum


How often are you subjected to the "Walt Disney died from enphazima(or something like that) as a result of his smoking" rebuttle, just out of curiosity? ;)



Personally, never. :)

Morrigoon
08-28-2001, 02:01 PM
As an asthma sufferer and an owner of a pair of lungs, I'm grateful for the non-smoking poilicies in the park.

What smokers dont seem to understand is that smoke doesn't just "disappear" because they do it outside. Nor does keeping a cigarette under the table keep others from suffering from it. I've seen many a smoker try to get away with smoking by "hiding" their cigarette under the table, as if others wouldn't notice - we do.

While it's not exactly desirable to have a large number of smokers in one area (because the higher concentration of smoke makes it more obvious), I prefer it to having them everywhere. Its a lot easier to avoid secondhand smoke when you know where it's going to be.

There's one other thing I like about the smoking areas- while you cannot control smoker behavior, asking people to remain in smoking areas mitigates it a bit. My niece was burned at Disneyland once, while walking past NOS on our way to the Mansion. This was thanks to a careless lady talking and waving her cigarette around in the air while sitting along a major thoroughfare. (Who, by the way, didn't even have the decency to apologize after burning a 10 year old little girl). But smoking areas tend to pull smokers off the main walkways, which reduces this danger.

I'm sorry if the smokers are offended by this, but I stand behind my opinions on this matter. Some people feel they have a right to smoke, arguing that it's their bodies. Well, some factories feel they have a right to pollute because the pollution is being created on their property - but it's everybody's air, and NO ONE, I repeat, NO ONE has the right to damage my lungs for me.

For the record; yes, Walt was a smoker... by the way, it killed him.

mad4mky
08-28-2001, 02:14 PM
Originally posted by Morrigoon
<<There's one other thing I like about the smoking areas- while you cannot control smoker behavior, asking people to remain in smoking areas mitigates it a bit. My niece was burned at Disneyland once, while walking past NOS on our way to the Mansion. This was thanks to a careless lady talking and waving her cigarette around in the air while sitting along a major thoroughfare. (Who, by the way, didn't even have the decency to apologize after burning a 10 year old little girl). But smoking areas tend to pull smokers off the main walkways, which reduces this danger.>>

This has happened to me and my children. It has ALWAYS been a pet-peeve with me. Smokers waving cigarettes while walking and bumping into people. They just don't get it. (Like people who bring dogs to Art and Wine Fairs..? Why...? To bite children in strollers? To have them stepped on? To fight with other dogs, or to poop on the street?...another pet peeve of mine...anyways, back to the topic). I too am thankful that the smokers are contained in several areas of there own. I grew up with smokers who had no idea how awful it was growing up in that environment. To have them hold my newborn babies while smoking was just enough to give me a coronary. When I complained, they were so offended. Well...now that they've have FINALLY had to stop smoking due to health problems, they have apologized, and now realized their errors. But, I constantly worry about my health, because my parents subjected me to that...
And I for one do NOT miss that smell, or any other "smoke" smell.

[Moderator's note: vB code fixed in quoted material. -- Lani]

blusilva
08-28-2001, 02:29 PM
Originally posted by Morrigoon
I'm sorry if the smokers are offended by this, but I stand behind my opinions on this matter. Some people feel they have a right to smoke, arguing that it's their bodies.

Respectfully, it is my right to smoke, and until the federal government declares tobacco an illegal substance, it will continue to be my right.

Private companies like Disney have the right to designate non-smoking areas on their property and local governments can legislate that public areas are non-smoking areas. As a smoker, I abide by those rules. I may not be happy with them, but I do abide by them. Yet, it does "offend" me when I'm told I don't have the right to use a legal product that I bought and paid for and am of age to use. Because the fact of the matter is, I still do.

I'm sure that within a matter of a few decades non-smokers will ban smoking in all public places. Until then, however, it darn well is my right to light up where it is legal to do so. Even if a non-smoker happens to be standing there.

I don't intend this to sound hostile, merely factual.

And to bring this back to being more specifically on-topic, perhaps if Disneyland offered enclosed, themed smoking parlors for their guests, the issue would be resolved. The non-smokers wouldn't have to smell it and the smokers would have a place to go that is nice and relaxing.

Castmbrdlx
08-28-2001, 02:33 PM
Originally posted by blusilva
Respectfully, it is my right to smoke, and until the federal government declares tobacco an illegal substance, it will continue to be my right.Additionally it is our right to breathe clean air. Goes both ways.

[Moderator's note: vB code fixed around quoted material. -- Lani]

Morrigoon
08-28-2001, 02:37 PM
actually, enclosures would serve both smokers and non-smokers alike... good idea. Unfortunately, since it serves Disneyland's guests pretty universally, they probably won't do it.

Yes it is your right to smoke... in places and ways that do not damage my health or impede my ability to breathe. Which excludes indoor and outdoor public spaces.

I wouldn't be surprised to see smoking banned altogether in my lifetime... that, or limited to people's private homes.

I'm not offended by your strong stance. You feel as strongly as I do, we just happen to be on opposite sides of the issue.

no1here
08-28-2001, 02:42 PM
I am greatful for free speech which allows me to state I don't like cigarrette smoke and the more banned areas the better. Although I run the risk of being shot by someone who legally owns a gun that might disagree with my opinion.

Ralph Wiggum
08-28-2001, 02:42 PM
Respectfully, what about common curtosy. Do you just light up when you feel like it, or do you think about the people around you who might be affected by it. Or as mentioned the children or even anyone who might get burnt by someone holding one.(this is not directed directly to blusilva or anyone in particular).

blusilva
08-28-2001, 03:01 PM
Originally posted by Castmbrdlx
[QUOTE]Originally posted by blusilva


Respectfully, it [B]is my right to smoke, and until the federal government declares tobacco an illegal substance, it will continue to be my right.

Additionally it is our right to breathe clean air. Goes both ways.

No, it doesn't. Not a one of us, smokers included, has a "right" to breathe clean air. It may be what many (even most) people desire, it may be what many (even most) people feel entitled to, but it isn't a "right".

Get on the phone to your legislator and make it so. Make the government declare it your "right". Make the government continue to take on all forms of air pollution, including second-hand tobacco smoke.

Until that time, I do indeed have the right to partake in the use of a legal substance in areas where it has not been designated illegal. Even if it offends you or makes you sick.

**edit: I just realized that sounds really nasty. I honestly don't intend it to be. This is a pretty emotional issue and it's hard not to be inflamatory, even inadvertantly. I think this is factually accurate and stand by the statements made herein, but I honestly don't mean to be starting a flame war with my asserations. *****

Nigel2
08-28-2001, 03:07 PM
Anyone in OC know if the Revere House still violates the health code by letting patrons smoke in the building. If they banned smoking across the board then definately they would ban it in your own home, lots of fires start by idiots who fall asleep with a lit pipe, cigar, joint, whater in their mouth and it falls and starts a fire, which can kill firefighters since they have to go in and rescue the person.

blusilva
08-28-2001, 03:08 PM
Originally posted by Ralph Wiggum
Respectfully, what about common curtosy. Do you just light up when you feel like it, or do you think about the people around you who might be affected by it. Or as mentioned the children or even anyone who might get burnt by someone holding one.(this is not directed directly to blusilva or anyone in particular).

That's ok, I'll answer it anyway. :)

I personally think I'm very courteous about when and where I light up. If I am with a group of people, I generally announce I'm going to go find a place to smoke and ask if anyone else wants to go and I separate from the group.

Even before Disneyland had specific smoking areas, I would find a sparsely populated area that wasn't near a restaurant and smoke there. Since Disneyland has instituted smoking areas I have never smoked outside of them (except for that one time, near Autopia, inadvertently.)

I rarely just smoke and walk around. I can't do both at the same time. ;)