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View Full Version : Support for future over-head ride in TL (aka - Peoplemover)



Tomorrowlander
10-22-2012, 04:42 PM
There was a discussion that I see has been closed .....

http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/showthread.php?170094-Peoplemover-Cars-Spotted-Entering-Park/page9&

Over the last year or so .... There have been rumors floating around ... regarding the fate of the Peoplemover tracks.

Rocket Rods became permanent history in September 2000. That's 12 years ago!

Tomorrowland '98 became the butt of a lot jokes, following what has been dubbed - a botched TL remake. And the best we have heard over the last 12 years .. Is WDI tinkering with new concepts to reuse the tracks. But the largest obstacle .... is Cal/OSHA.

Because of them ... the '67 design can never come back. And it appears .. nothing too closely to that design .. could ever be built.

Now, we all have been hearing rumors for years now ... of a complete remake of the land. When it comes .. if ever .. is anyone's guess.

And I thought .. if the tracks have to come down because of age/deterioration .. that's fine. But what alarmed me ... is a rumor to remove them ... and not build ANY kind of a track for any ride - PERIOD!

So ... just picture that! A Tomorrowland .. much like it was pre 1967. Just a fairly boring layout/format ... No interesting visual icon .. that "wraps" all of Tomorrowland together.

Recently ... I was checking out a Disneyland Update picture set from Miceage (Andy Castro) .. who posts weekly updates of what's going on in the parks ... and in an August spread .. He said ..... If anyone wants to rally behind some sort of a "Peoplemover" type attraction .. the time is now!

I don't know what he knows ... But I get the feeling .. if anyone wants to show their support for some sort of an attraction to circumnavigate the land .. the way the Peoplemover did ... .you better show your support NOW .. or forget it!

So ... if anyone cares enough .... and wants to see Tomorrowland be a better land .. than what some executives want it to be ..... You need to be writing to who you know in the company NOW ... and if you don't know anyone ... Then at least write to the DLR president himself - George .. and tell him that you do care.

I just want to put the FYI out there.

Thanks for taking the time to read this.

oregontraveler
10-22-2012, 05:35 PM
Bottom line.... PM is no more. Tony Baxter, Senior Vice President of Walt Disney Imagineering, said as much last summer at a Washington fan club meeting. There are safety issues ie: too close to walls in some sections. And structural issues ie: the foundations took a beating while it was Rocket Rods. I'm looking forward to a new and improved Tomorrowland, but the PM track is not going to be part of it.

Tomorrowlander
10-22-2012, 06:47 PM
Bottom line.... PM is no more. Tony Baxter, Senior Vice President of Walt Disney Imagineering, said as much last summer at a Washington fan club meeting. There are safety issues ie: too close to walls in some sections. And structural issues ie: the foundations took a beating while it was Rocket Rods. I'm looking forward to a new and improved Tomorrowland, but the PM track is not going to be part of it.

Like you said - Safety issues, too close to walls in some sections, Age, Structural Issues. All ... perfectly understandable.

But lets look at the rest of the land ..... while we are at it! :-)

The age of the current buildings date to 4 specific time periods.

1. 1955 - 57 years of age BUZZ LIGHTYEAR, STAR TOURS QUEUE
2. 1966 - 46 years of age INNOVENTIONS, REDD ROCKETS PIZZA PORT, PEOPLEMOVER TRACKS/STATION, COKE TERRACE
3. 1976 - 36 years of age SPACE MOUNTAIN, STARCADE, SPACE MOUNTAIN QUEUE
4. 1985 - 24 years of age STAR TOURS MAIN SIMULATOR BAYS

Virtually, all of the 1967 infrastructure exists to this day. A stack of structural pieces coming on a half century in age.

There's a lot more throughout the land .. that is becoming obsolete, difficult to work with, and getting old ... than just the PM tracks!

How many more times is the '67 infrastructure/buildings going to keep being recycled ?

There's a word that comes to my mind ... that reflects what seems to be happening now ... and what happened long ago. "Catalyst"

There are some books that describe the coming of Tomorrowland II back in 1967.

Walt wanted Carousel of Progress in the land. But there was no room for it. The NY Worlds Fair attraction served as a CATALYST to inspire Walt's imagineers to draw up a whole new land. A land that not only fit the attraction in ... but a whole new land ... that gave imagineers a pretty clean slate to work with. No .. trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. (Which pretty much describes the debacle to fit a new PM type of ride, into an existing set of buildings with Cal/OSHA saying - "No", every time!)

Today ... Cal/OSHA has put the breaks on any Peoplemover return .... deeming the current infrastructure "unsafe". This should serve as a catalyst for imagineering to finally say to themselves - We need to kill 2 birds with one stone - Number One, the land is vastly overdue for a remodel. And once new buildings are built, they can be built to accommodate (NUMBER TWO) a new ride that some how mimics the old Peoplemover. It will be something NEW .. but in some ways ... be a "homage" to what really was a terrific piece to the land, that not only served as a ride, but also did something very important to the overall "aesthetic" of the land. It gave it kinetics, it looked like something that is futuristic .. and not a "lonely" set of buildings .. that look like a shopping Mall!

houseofmouse
10-22-2012, 07:37 PM
I may be mistaken but those old other infrastructures you refer to, as long as they don't go down and need to be rebuilt or there is not an accident or safety issue, OSHA leaves them alone. I don't know what work was done to have Buzz up to code when it was built. So I am sure that building is fine. Peoplemover also needs a way to evacuate safely, I know we have discussed that in the past. I hope that if they re-do the land, those tracks will come down.

olegc
10-22-2012, 09:59 PM
Buildings are just that - buildings (pirates 1965, ride open 67. HM 1965, ride open 69, MS train station 1955). Their safety requirements are quite different than ride structures and the forces on the building don't even meet the same things as rides.

houseofmouse is right. as long as structures are not completely rebuilt they are left alone. Why do you think the drawbridge of the castle was not repaired and made to work for the 50th. Too much infrastructure and changes to the building to make it up to code (including more ADA changes for the building). If they put in a new track (which they would, they can not use the old one) they would have to place handrails on most evacuation paths, rails and guides elsewhere - and it just wouldn't, you now, look very much tomorrow.

The PeopleMover is done. Long live the PeopleMover.

spectromen
10-23-2012, 01:44 PM
I sure do miss it badly these days. Personally, I say reopen it as is and make any rider sign a waiver excusing Disneyland from any liability of any form, and distribute copies in English, Spanish and Chinese. heh.

cstephens
10-23-2012, 03:33 PM
Personally, I say reopen it as is and make any rider sign a waiver excusing Disneyland from any liability of any form

Those kinds of waivers are incredibly easy to fight in court. Wouldn't protect Disney at all.

olegc
10-23-2012, 03:59 PM
Those kinds of waivers are incredibly easy to fight in court. Wouldn't protect Disney at all.

and a great example is the case of the kid who cut his toes off on BTMRR - and the response? settle with the kid and put in gates (which is one of the primary reasons gates are now everywhere).

Tomorrowlander
10-23-2012, 06:39 PM
Buildings are just that - buildings (pirates 1965, ride open 67. HM 1965, ride open 69, MS train station 1955). Their safety requirements are quite different than ride structures and the forces on the building don't even meet the same things as rides.
.

Good points.

Though .. in the case with Tomorrowland ...... the 1967 buildings are proving to be a great source of agony. Prohibiting imagineers from coming up with a new ride .. to travel second level throughout Tomorrowland.

The only reason to not do another "PM" type ride again ... is they let the '67 buildings .. be .. for all eternity ... and never attempt to re-work them .... to give Tomorrowland that proper "push" it needs .. to be a dynamic land again.

I cannot envision a new Tomorrowland that has no lively .. kinetic ride ... to ride all throughout the land. We're talking .. a layout that's pretty static and very "20th Century".

I'd say what's really holding WDI up .... is a lack of vision .. and a lack of committing the right funds ... to make Tomorrowland that special place it deserves to be.

olegc
10-23-2012, 08:33 PM
@Tomorrowlander - I think WDI has had a lot of other priorities right now - and remember that WDI doesn't necessarily commit the funds - that approval comes from executive management of Parks and Resorts - especially for a new attraction that has to fit with all the other attractions in a land. To tell you the truth buildings are great because you can do whatever you want inside of them (like a soundstage) and then provide some theming and elements outside to introduce an attraction. Also Tomorrowland has always had a very clean aesthetic - which is why the white base was brought back to remove the T98 scheme (even though I liked that one too).

I seriously doubt there will ever be a 2nd level tomorrowland attraction ever again unless its a larger track with an enclosed vehicle and a ton of other elements - almost like a tunnel -which would kill any notion of it being similar to what I think you're thinking of. THe one thing I lament is that when you get chances to talk to Imagineers at special events you can't really talk futures or ideas with them because WDC does not want that ideas from the public to come in without vetting (multiple legal reasons).