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MidwayManiac
08-02-2011, 01:25 AM
If you’ve saved a spot for a Disney parade or show (particularly Fantasmic! and perhaps even WoC, Aladdin, Billy Hill, etc.) there’s a good chance you’ve witnessed or been a part of a dispute. Lately I’ve been attending more shows and parades and it dawned on me: where there is a show or parade, there’s an altercation. The two simply go hand in hand, it seems. A lot of “Hey got off my lawn!” type stuff and “Get here earlier if you want this spot.” Hilarious and riveting. It’s the show before the show. If CMs could talk, oh dear … you know some of them have nearly seen it all.

So what’s the most memorable parade/show dispute you know of?

disneyland addict13
08-02-2011, 09:19 AM
My family and I were sitting along the Rivers of America saving spots for Fantasmic! in December 2009 and a woman came up to an empty spot near us and scattered things like empty water bottles, food wrappers, and napkins throughout the space and then left. It was pretty obvious that she was intending to save the seat using garbage with no one sitting in it, which we thought probably wouldn't work out for her because usually spots left unattended will get taken. About 20 minutes later, a group came up and asked some groups around the spot if it was their garbage and they all said no. They proceeded to pick up all of the garbage, throw it away, and sit down in the spot.

Ten minutes before show time, the "lady with the trash" showed up with her family to claim her spot and was extremely dissatisfied to find another group sitting there. She spent a few minutes telling them that it was her spot and that they needed to leave, but they refused, saying that they just found some garbage here and so they threw it away. Eventually, she went and found a CM who asked the surrounding groups what they had seen. Most people said that she had essentially laid down garbage and left it there and hadn't returned until 10 minutes before the show (by this time the show was about to begin). The CM told the woman that at least one person needs to be sitting in a spot to save it, and she could try to come back for the later show.

For me, I can't even imagine trying to just lay a few water bottles down and expect that you will be able to save a spot. What do you guys think? Was she justified? Was the second group justified in throwing away the garbage and sitting down?

Teddi
08-02-2011, 10:51 AM
Beyond not justified. Excuse me, but TRASH? That's right, if you ain't sitting there, you ain't savin'! Good that the CM said that. I would be so :mad: seeing her leave trash on purpose, I'd probably have said something :eek: and told her the minute you walk away, I'm cleaning up your trash.

I can only think of once at Fireworks when I had a lady tell me to put my kids in their stroller so she could sit down on the bench I had been on for some 40 minutes. I think the extra space was because while we (5 of us) had all orginally been there, DH and DS had gone off for a ride on the Matterhorn. Then this lady tried arguing that if they weren't back soon, she should be able to sit on the bench. Happened to take them *extra* long, because the Matterhorn broke down and they had to wait 15-20 mins to get evaced off. After a couple of minutes of her HOVERING I got the call from DH that they were trapped on the MH and I told her, and that I wasn't giving up their spots because they stuck for now on a broken ride but that they WERE coming back. I had my two girls with me (I think they were 3 at the time) and I couldn't believe she really was arguing that I needed to use the stroller and keep them in there. *RIGHT cuz the twins were gonna sit there for another 30+ minutes in a non-moving stroller, uh huh, sure*

JunJunM3
08-02-2011, 11:19 AM
Someone has to be there in person to save the spot. Putting backpacks, towels, and in this case, all sorts of garbage, and then leaving the area unattended isn't saving it from my point of view. I've been with large groups to see F! (10+ people) and at least 2 of us would take turns saving our spot while the others freely roam around. I have seen disputes at F! but not so much with the other shows.

rustymick
08-02-2011, 11:37 AM
A few times that I have actually stopped to watch a parade we seemed to be sqeezed out of the premium viewing spot that I sat in at least an hour prior to the event. It starts with someone sitting next to me and then asking if me and my husband would move down for their spouse/sister/mom/etc. Then another will show up in their party and ask us to scoot down more, and then another.... I was dumb enough to fall for this twice, from there on out I tell them-nope, there's plenty of room on the other side of my husband-period, and then I ignore them.

One time I was watching the Dapper Dans by the Fire Station and a woman and her companion walked right up and stood in front of me so that I could no longer see and I couldn't understand this since there were plenty of other good spots available. I proceeded to have a coughing fit right onto her neck-that's how close she was to me-and she decided to go into the shade on the other side of the Fire Station.

bennette
08-02-2011, 11:45 AM
Well there was that drunk lady who recently walked up and grabbed on to me and asked if I wouldn't pretty please let her come into the front of the dinner seating queue for World of Color. When I said, "Um, huh, what? No!" she still kept a hold of me and asked again until I said more plainly "You need to move on," with a stern look and tone.

She had a young person with her; I assume it was her daughter. Nice.

Thing was, she had a pass for the dining queue as well; she just wanted to be at the very front of it. What.ever.

candles71
08-02-2011, 11:55 AM
We had 2 different upset women this trip (Fantasmic). The first one came with her group of 10 or so 25 minutes until showtime and then got angry at the CM, that there was NO where for her group to sit. The other had left her blanket and backpack before we sat down at 7 (we never saw her) and was very upset when they came back at 10 minutes before showtime, and her "spot" was gone, along with her stuff. We directed her to the CM for our section for retrieval of her stuff.

cstephens
08-02-2011, 11:57 AM
We were at flag retreat on Fourth of July, and we'd been waiting for about an hour. About 5 minutes before it was supposed to start, a man came up and just stood right in front of us. I told him we'd been waiting and he couldn't just be in the front cause he was blocking our view. So he stood behind me. Blocking the husband and others instead. I told him he was still blocking people who'd been there for an hour. There was a whole section of people behind us. I think he finally went to the back.

Malcon10t
08-02-2011, 12:52 PM
We were at flag retreat on Fourth of July, and we'd been waiting for about an hour. About 5 minutes before it was supposed to start, a man came up and just stood right in front of us. I told him we'd been waiting and he couldn't just be in the front cause he was blocking our view. So he stood behind me. Blocking the husband and others instead. I told him he was still blocking people who'd been there for an hour. There was a whole section of people behind us. I think he finally went to the back.And he brought his mother/friend in the wheelchair and parked her right in front too, but since she wasn't blocking a view, it wasn't a problem. I did laugh when he just moved from in front of you to in front of The Husband. Like that was going to fly!


Well there was that drunk lady who recently walked up and grabbed on to me and asked if I wouldn't pretty please let her come into the front of the dinner seating queue for World of Color. When I said, "Um, huh, what? No!" she still kept a hold of me and asked again until I said more plainly "You need to move on," with a stern look and tone.This was just STRANGE! Why she expected to come just before they moved the line and be allowed to be at the front, I have no clue. And the line really wasn't that long!

MidwayManiac
08-02-2011, 02:15 PM
Roughly half the issues I see in the park involve foreigners (or, at least, people foreign to the American language and culture). Makes me feel bad for them. Then there’s the flip side that says when in Rome you better know the way of the Romans and adjust accordingly.

I’m always reminded of a conversation I had years ago with a friend who married a naturalized U.S. citizen and was fairly well-travelled. I fail to remember which culture/country we were talking about when he said, “You know, they’re not accustomed to standing in line in ___________.” This fascinated me since it’s so firmly ingrained in our culture from a very early age. He went on to explain our own American ideas about courtesy and punctuality and manners and arriving first/getting served first are, to varying degrees, American phenomenon. To that end, I stumbled upon this blog entry (http://www.culturalreflexions.com/2009/08/the-art-of-standing-in-line-understanding-order-in-chaos/) that points to some interesting (albeit anecdotal) examples among U.S./certain Euro countries and those of France/certain Latin countries.

I say that to say this: when I come across foreigners in the park I try to give them the benefit of the doubt. At Jedi Training recently my wife, dear friend, and two youngest had a couple tables and about 4 or 5 chairs at Tomorrowland Terrace. When the show ended and oldest and I made our way over, several foreigners were occupying a nearby table plus half of one of ours and our two once empty chairs without having asked, not to mention one of them was practically sitting in the lap of our dear friend. Wife was peeved and kinda gave them the business as we were leaving. From their reaction, I’d surmise they had no concept whatsoever this sort of thing was a breach of etiquette. This instance didn’t strike me as rude behavior as much as it did a cultural misunderstanding. And I think these misunderstandings happen frequently.

bennette
08-02-2011, 02:28 PM
This was just STRANGE! Why she expected to come just before they moved the line and be allowed to be at the front, I have no clue.

Diminished capacity...

MidwayManiac
08-02-2011, 03:27 PM
Then there's the parent that shows up with kids in tow 10 minutes before a parade and expects parties who've held a spot over an hour to be understanding and move. One of the most pathetic tactics is 'sending in the kids'. Lady at Soundsational recently told her two little girls to "go stand over there" which happened to be our spot. It may have worked for them had not the little girls been flailing their arms and roughhousing and being generally obnoxious. We told 'em sorry youngsters, but ya gotta go.

When they returned to mommy with crocodile tears she had some choice words under her breath for dear wife and my in-laws. Little did she know she was within earshot of wife's dear friend who summarily explained "Know what? We've been here over an hour waiting. It's hardly anyone's fault but your own you waited 'til the parade is starting to find a spot."

Malcon10t
08-02-2011, 03:54 PM
One year at Christmastime, we had staked out a spot right in front of the castle for fireworks. It was very crowded. Our family is known for camping out early for spots. I believe we had sat down about 630-7pm, taking space for our approx 10 people, plus the service dog. Now when we stake out a spot, it isn't me holding a spot for 10, it is rarely less than 3/4 of our party there the whole time. The other 1/4 are usually only gone to grab snacks for the rest of us or potty breaks. So, we had been there for 2 hours and they had requested everyone stand. Now, because we have the service dog with us, we have a specific way of handling our "spot." Basically, we circle the dog to protect them from people accidentally stepping on her. So, sometimes it can look like we have space, when we don't.

On this date, we had done the same as we always had. The park was packed. There was no space anywhere in the hub. CMs were doing a good job of making people keep moving and directing traffic. We had warned people around us to hold their spots as people would try to cut in. A few did, but as soon as we said there was no space, they moved on. Then, this woman came along dragging her parents. She was probably in her 40s. She SHOVED her dad towards us and TOLD us to make room for them. We explained there was no room, we'd been here for almost 3 hours, and the spot she thought might be open was our service dog. She told us to move the dog so her dad, who had a heart condition, could watch the fireworks. We told her no, she should have gotten here earlier if she wanted a spot for her dad. Well, he couldn't wait because he had a heart condition. (??) She continued to try to argue with us, until the CM came over and told her no, she needed to move on, this area was full. Then we got the parting shots of how we were breaking an old man's heart.

The problems we have generally had have not involved language barriers. More of a self involved issue.

CariBelle
08-02-2011, 07:22 PM
BF and I got in for WoC about 15 minutes before we were supposed to be let in, the rest of the family (4 adults, 2 kids) had to stop for an emergency bathroom break at the front of the park. They opened the WoC area early so BF and I went in and stood at the railing with our bags between us and everyone else joined us probably 5 minutes later. So we wait and everything is fine, no pushing or anything. Right as the show is starting I feel someone stepping on my feet and my bag (which was mostly on my feet) and I see a little girl being pushed by her mother to stand in front of me. I turn and say "Miss, your child is stepping on me and my bag" "Well, she can't see" "I'm sorry but we have been waiting here for over an hour" to which I got the classic "You should be ashamed of yourself, taking a space from a child" Luckily I was able to yell back "You should be ashamed of yourself for teaching her that being rude and pushing is ok!" and she pushed her way back out of the crowd. There were easily 6 people deep behind me, I'm not sure how she made it all the way to us in the first place.

Angie2009
08-02-2011, 09:10 PM
I got in a fight with my MIL when she sent my kids up front so they could see the parade. The folks they budded in front of were nice enough about it, but it put tons of people between her and the very small kids she was supposed to be watching while I was riding something or another. And it was rude.

adriennek
08-02-2011, 10:45 PM
This wasn't a fight, but it was definitely a case of a disappointed or annoyed guest with an unreasonable expectation.

On July 17, we found a spot on the sidewalk in front of the Showcase to watch the (brief) "Birthday Moment." The place was already quite crowded. We were NOT in the front by any stretch of the imagination. There were at least two rows of people standing between us and the edge of the sidewalk.

Now in this particular area, there was a bench sort of built into the side of the building behind us. There were some women sitting on this bench. Just as the "show" was about to start, one of them stood up to ask us if we were going to sit down when the show started." I don't know about anyone else but I had to stiffle laughter. Really? Sit down? And where would you like us to sit down? (Sitting down requires far more real estate than standing and there was NO room to sit.) And let's pretend we sat down - there were at LEAST two rows of people standing in front of US.

This was clearly, to us, a standing area. I could see why they may have assumed that a bench meant they could sit and watch the show, but by the time they asked, like I said, the place was way too crowded for anyone to sit and having our group sit would not have remotely begun to solve her problem. Her question was unrealistic, to put it mildly. All we said was "no, this is a standing area." At some point I mentioned all the people standing in front of us, too.

There was no fight or hostility, but she was clearly disappointed.

Tinkermommy
08-03-2011, 07:07 AM
There were two that I'll never forget. Both happened when the Tinkerteen was very young. One night, we sat in front of the castle for a looong time, surrounded by a lot of nice, friendly people. Nearby was a spot nobody sat in because it was all wet. Moments before the fireworks started, a group saw the opening and climbed in over all the seated bodies. Of course, they decided to stand because the ground was wet. When the fireworks started, people started yelling at them to sit down. They wouldn't. So the people behind them stood up. Then the people behind THEM yelled for them to sit down. Before long, the back half of the crowd was screaming at the front half of the crowd, the front was screaming back, and we were smack in the middle of it. There was a family with several toddlers behind us, so my daughter didn't want to stand and block their view. But there was a row of butts right in our faces, so we couldn't see anything else. So she just started to cry, and cried throughout the fireworks. It was so ugly.

The other was during the holiday fireworks. The crowd was so dense that I was holding my daughter. Just before the snowfall, a woman behind me started pushing me. I thought it was an accident, but she kept it up. I finally asked her to stop, and she yelled at me to get out of the way. Seriously? There was nowhere to go. My daughter (again) started crying, and the woman somehow managed to bulldoze her way through that mob of people. I suspect we would have been knocked down if the crowd hadn't been so tightly packed. Everyone around us appeared to be as shocked as we were. Good times. :rolleyes:

Bolivar
08-03-2011, 07:59 AM
Roughly half the issues I see in the park involve foreigners (or, at least, people foreign to the American language and culture). Makes me feel bad for them. Then there’s the flip side that says when in Rome you better know the way of the Romans and adjust accordingly.

I’m always reminded of a conversation I had years ago with a friend who married a naturalized U.S. citizen and was fairly well-travelled. I fail to remember which culture/country we were talking about when he said, “You know, they’re not accustomed to standing in line in ___________.” This fascinated me since it’s so firmly ingrained in our culture from a very early age. He went on to explain our own American ideas about courtesy and punctuality and manners and arriving first/getting served first are, to varying degrees, American phenomenon. To that end, I stumbled upon this blog entry (http://www.culturalreflexions.com/2009/08/the-art-of-standing-in-line-understanding-order-in-chaos/) that points to some interesting (albeit anecdotal) examples among U.S./certain Euro countries and those of France/certain Latin countries.

I say that to say this: when I come across foreigners in the park I try to give them the benefit of the doubt. At Jedi Training recently my wife, dear friend, and two youngest had a couple tables and about 4 or 5 chairs at Tomorrowland Terrace. When the show ended and oldest and I made our way over, several foreigners were occupying a nearby table plus half of one of ours and our two once empty chairs without having asked, not to mention one of them was practically sitting in the lap of our dear friend. Wife was peeved and kinda gave them the business as we were leaving. From their reaction, I’d surmise they had no concept whatsoever this sort of thing was a breach of etiquette. This instance didn’t strike me as rude behavior as much as it did a cultural misunderstanding. And I think these misunderstandings happen frequently.

I have noticed in Europe that lines diminish the farther south you go. England, Sweden, Norway... very orderly lines, people will go out of their way to make sure they aren't cutting in front of someone else. Italy, Greece, Spain... mob scene. At the airport in Greece they would would start to call out that they are seating first class only and everyone at the gate would rush forward pushing and shoving.

olegc
08-03-2011, 08:16 AM
for me I tend to spend time at the parks alone - so I sometimes scope out good spots to grab close to showtime and then when I do bring the family we try for those so we don't impact anyone. Not so often with WoC since it's such a confined space.

However, my biggest pet peeve is shoulder sitters. While I understand the kids can't see (including my kid at times) it frustrates me to no end that folks get right up close or maybe in the center of the viewing area - and then when the show starts up go the kids. I don't say anything except one time (see later) because I don't know whether these are long time passholders or one-time guests. I even noticed this on the uploaded videos for 4th of July WoC. Tallest two or three men in the group - then right in the center camera angle up go the kids. Again - I don't want any kid to miss anything - but if you're a man who's 6 foot 3 in or so, and you put your kid on your shoulders, how about standing in the back.

the one time I did make a stink was Fantasmic with my son when he was 8. we got to the bridge in front of Pirates about 30 min before showtime and had a good spot but not too high. when the show started 4 or 5 dads snuck in under the rope on the section near the water, and then placed their kids right on top. When I and a couple of others complained, all they did was turn to look, smirk and shrug their shoulders, as if to say "snooze you loose". I went on to say I hope someday it happens to you too and you can't do anything about it - then one of the dad's got mad. C'mon - is that the American way? I want mine, the rest of you can go pound sand? wow...

jananafish
08-03-2011, 10:52 AM
i've never seen a fight or participated in one, but i have had parents push their kids in front of my group when we have "camped out" for good spots. one time we were waiting in NOS to watch F! and we found a spot right after the first show let out. so we hadn't been there all day but we were the ONLY ones there. a couple people started forming groups around us but no one was in front of us. then at the last minute the 2 tallest dads in the world stood in front of us with their kids on their shoulders. i waited about a minute to let the annoyance pass over me, and i tapped one dad on the shoulder and just said, "REALLY?"

they both just looked at us like "well what do you want us to do?" and i wanted to tell him to go jump in the river but i guess one of their wives was watching and called them back over to where they were. bleehhhh rude people.

jananafish
08-03-2011, 10:53 AM
However, my biggest pet peeve is shoulder sitters.

...

the one time I did make a stink was Fantasmic with my son when he was 8. we got to the bridge in front of Pirates about 30 min before showtime and had a good spot but not too high. when the show started 4 or 5 dads snuck in under the rope on the section near the water, and then placed their kids right on top. When I and a couple of others complained, all they did was turn to look, smirk and shrug their shoulders, as if to say "snooze you loose". I went on to say I hope someday it happens to you too and you can't do anything about it - then one of the dad's got mad. C'mon - is that the American way? I want mine, the rest of you can go pound sand? wow...

haha!! i didn't even see this!! same story! i was in the same spot on the bridge in front of pirates!!!

leota's necklace
08-03-2011, 11:26 AM
Not a fight over a show spot, but for the Monorail, and the saddest thing I have ever seen at Disneyland.

I was on one of my birthday trips, back when I was still making the mistake of celebrating my actual birth date, which sets this scene in the end of August. Hot, crowded.

I had waited through three cycles for the Monorail and was finally able to board. It was tight, and as the doors began to close, a man in the middle of the remaining crowd started agitating to be allowed to board. The CM told him he was sorry, but he would have to wait, as the Monorail was at capacity for that run. After arguing as long as he could, he turned to his tired daughter, who looked to be maybe three or four and on the verge of tears. "You wanna go?" he kept asking her, holding her up by her armpits in the sun. "You wanna go?" She kept saying yes, yes, yes, getting more and more frustrated until she started sobbing. Then he turned her around to face the CM on the other side of the rope and said "then tell the man."

It was manipulative and disgusting. I wished I could get off the Monorail, so I could 1) offer that little girl a seat, and 2) be free to pop her dad or whoever he was right in the chops.

adriennek
08-03-2011, 12:23 PM
I thought of a nice story I'd like to tell!

About a year ago, we met codewoman and codeboy at the parks for an ice cream. We enjoyed each other's company so much that we ended up spending the rest of the evening together after our separate dinner arrangements. We decided to see Fantasmic and found a spot behind a fence/wall near Pirates. We were not the first people there. We waited patiently. The kids chatted, the adults chatted. And when it was time for the show to start, all the adults made SURE that the kids did NOT push in front of people who had been there before us.

Read that last line again. We kept telling our kids, No, stand over here.

Well there was a mother-daughter duo of Annual Passholders, big Fantasmic fans, right near us with slightly better views. They were the people we didn't want the boys butting in front of. They actually said to us "Would the boys like to stand in front of us?" I looked at them like they had 2 heads and said "Are you SURE?" They said "Oh yeah, we can see fine over them."

We totally did NOT expect them to. I very much respect "They who get there first, get the better seats." ;) And I am NOT judging anyone who wouldn't do that because I KNOW that if a child would obstruct the view that *I* camped out to see, I would NOT be letting someone push their kids in front of me.

But it was a very lovely offer they made and we made SURE that the children were gracious and appropriately thanked the nice ladies. It was a great show. I think it really goes to show that you can get a lot more with honey than vinegar and these pushy guests really miss the boat. They had a choice how they behaved and got the consequences of their choices.

CariBelle
08-03-2011, 09:16 PM
I think it really goes to show that you can get a lot more with honey than vinegar and these pushy guests really miss the boat. They had a choice how they behaved and got the consequences of their choices.


Oh yes yes yes. Last July we camped out for F! seats for almost 2 hours. We weren't on the river's edge, but up a bit and right behind the corner of a planter. A young family sat behind us and we satrted chatting and their little boy was SO cute! It was his first trip and he was telling us about his day. So when it was time to stand up we asked if he wanted to stand in front of us for the show. He enjoyed it so much! I even stood behind my friend, who is shorter than me, so that the Mom could see as well. When we left he thanked us and said "May the force be with you!"

Drince88
08-04-2011, 01:29 PM
"May the force be with you!"
Too Cute!

My sister and I rarely camp out long durations for shows or parades, and generally only stand where it's not crowded - but a lot of the time we do allow those that come up after us to have 'the shorter ones' stand in front of us. AND make sure if the parents are behind us, that the kids get back to the parents at the end of the show/parade. (A lot of the times, particularly if the kids are with just Mom or Grandma, Mom/GMom are shorter than us too, so we let them in front to avoid the whole getting back together heart stoppage time.