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Winca
08-08-2001, 09:46 AM
Hi everyone, long time reader, first time poster!

The beautiful pictures on Tokyo Disney Seas broke my heart this morning, as I had just spent yesterday at the Disneyland resort. Sure, it was decent, but when I looked at the pictures of the opulent MiraCosta hotel, I felt like I was cheated out of a first rate resort by executives interested in the bottom line. That made me sad.

But when I remembered how Al talked about the media blackout instilled by Disney here in the states about Tokyo Disney Seas, it made me angry.

What right do the execs here in Burbank have to keep such a wonderful new theme park out of the public eye? Oh wait, I remember, it's because we have the cut rate, bottom of the barrel Disney's Carnival Adventure here.

If Americans found out the kind of filet mignon the Japanese were getting, we'd be rioting down the Sun street or whatever the heck they call their hub in DCA.

Why shouldn't the public stand up and demand coverage? We, as a community devoted to maintaining Disney excellence (well, at least I am), have the obligation, no, the RESPONSIBILITY, to make sure that people know and expect these things from Disney... not blindly pay premium prices and take whatever Disney stamps their brand on.

And maybe, just maybe, people will talk back. Not us, the hardcore, but normal hardworking people who expect a first rate park when paying first rate prices.

So what I'm asking for, is your help in e-mailing, phoning, and calling media outlets, like newspapers, and asking where is the coverage. I know in the Los Angeles Times, the person to talk to is E. Scott Reckard, or whoever has taken over tourism in the Los Angeles Times newspaper. I'm trying to find the e-mail, but I need a little help. That's a start. Anyone know anyone else?

Together, we can do it.

Sincerely,
William D.


PS: I'm very sorry if it sounds like I'm preaching or anything... I just don't want people to automatically connect Disney quality with the crud they put out nowadays. They should expect more. Tokyo Disney Seas could be the first step.


PPS: Ralph Wiggum (Dave), it's me Will, from IHS, remember? Don't rip me apart too badly, please! ;D

Gemini Cricket
08-08-2001, 09:56 AM
Here's some info regarding contacting the LA Times:

Feedback:

http://www.latimes.com/services/site/la-contactus.htmlstory

Letters to the Editor:

http://www.latimes.com/services/site/la-site-talk.htmlstory

Here's more info about contacting the Orange County Register:

http://www.ocregister.com/aboutus/contactus.shtml

Good Luck:)

DisneylandKid
08-08-2001, 10:04 AM
Would you just tell them about how the US isn't covering DisneySea, or how DCA is way behind Disney standards or both?

JeffG
08-08-2001, 10:05 AM
These conspiracy theories about Disney trying to "hide" Tokyo Disney Sea from the American public out of fear that the park will somehow hurt DCA are just plain silly.

If the media think there is any interest in the park, they will cover it. My guess is that the coverage will be pretty minimal here in the US, though, simply because relatively few Americans ever travel to Japan.

-Jeff

Corith
08-08-2001, 10:10 AM
'Tis indeed sad to see that the Disney Seas project still strives to live up the ideals set down by Walt Disney, yet our California park is done so cheaply, so poorly, and so lacking in vision. The builders, designers, & businessmen who build Disney Seas seem to understand full well that if you build something of quality, while expensive, it will still see a profit eventually.

Our problem is Eisner, plain and simple. He has NO, and I repeat that, NO creative mind at all. He couldn't envision a coke can. To him, DCA looks fine. Disneyland is in great shape. He mind reels at the possibility that DCA is failing, yet Seas is not. He can never, will never, understand a Disney theme park is more than a "resort destination". It is something special, something that needs special attention. You can't just plop down a tilt-a-whirl next to a hot-dog stand, flip up a Disney logo and have people accept it as Disney.

If he wants to recreate a carnival, let him, just don't put the Disney name on it and expect it to do well. I don't begrudge Eisner his desire to make a mark in the world. He just shouldn't be running Disney. He shouldn't be running a service based, creative company. His talents, and drive for the bottom line makes him much better suited for companies that produce products - Compaq, Intell, GM, Papermate, Nestle, or any one of million other companies.

Doodle Duck
08-08-2001, 11:25 AM
Sure glad your here Jeff to pull us all back from the edge whenever someone has defined opinions. No sense going over the top.
On the other hand...not all of us are Vulcans and occasionaly get emotional. But there's always room in the boat.
Of course this is all reaction (by us reactionaries) to Al Lutz comment the other day...

"How bad is it you may ask? Apparently bad enough that Disney is now applying corporate pressure to Oriental Land Company to NOT invite the U.S. media to the opening of Tokyo DisneySeas."


Imagine being 'silly' on a Disney site.

Live long and prosper.

disneyhead
08-08-2001, 12:52 PM
In response to JeffG

Hey it's not my theory:
Quoted fom Al's 8/7 Update

"DCA's "Image" problem
Word of mouth ...continues to be bad for the park from visitors - no matter what the expensive new TV ad campaign (with the rave review quotes and inspirational music) tries to imply.
How bad is it you may ask? Apparently bad enough that Disney is now applying corporate pressure to Oriental Land Company to NOT invite the U.S. media to the opening of Tokyo DisneySeas."

But I will take the ball and run with it. If this is in fact the case, It will blow up in Eisner's face. There will be an all out attack on him. Rule one: never snub the media.

Ralph Wiggum
08-08-2001, 01:20 PM
Originally posted by Winca
PPS: Ralph Wiggum (Dave), it's me Will, from IHS, remember? Don't rip me apart too badly, please! ;D

Welcome to posting Will. I figured it was you the second i started reading(and when i saw the Irvine, CA). If I had a reason to rip you apart I would;), but I don't. I agree that the press should cover this park heavily. I dont think the media should be blocked, if they are. I havent seen the new park in Tokyo though the pictures look great. Hope to see more posts from you buddy!!

Corith
08-08-2001, 01:23 PM
Even before DCA opened, it was being criticized. After it opened, it was criticized even more. Eisner blamed everything and anything he could on the dismal showing and low attendance. Critics complain about high prices, low entertainment value, cheapness of the rides, and lack of total family entertainment options.

Now, Disney Seas is getting close to a public opening. The Disney fans lap it up. Nothing but great reviews. People rave about the wonderful attention to detail, the theming, the hotel, the shops, and the incredible attractions.

I'm leaving out the technical issues of the DCA attractions, as for all we know Disney Seas may also have the type of issues (but I doubt it).

The point here is that you get what you pay for. Eisner went cheap and the public knows it. They can see it in every corner of DCA. He needs to wake up from his accounting nap and see that his vision of a theme park is not what the public wants. He needs to stop creating junk like DCA and build more like Disney Seas.

Eisner (and his mindless cronies) thought the public were mindless automatons that would pay any price for anything that said Disney or go anyplace Disney built. DCA vs. Seas is showing that the public isn't as gullible as he'd hoped or thought.

I suspect Disney's Seas success and DCA failure will overshadow all that Eisner does from now on until somebody, someplace, wakes up and realizes that he has overstayed his welcome with the mouse.

Mr D
08-08-2001, 07:05 PM
We have the internet on our side folks, actually no one has outright said it but I honestly think because of websites such as MP the public has much more awareness and information available at our fingertips that cannot be censored so if you are frustrated at the PT Barnum style of management in America of Disney and if you could not afford to travel to Japan at the very least Wish upon a Star you never know what may happen just by admitting on these discussion boards that you are Fed UP and will not accept what is here, not now, tell Disney you WILL NOT patronize or spend more than neccesary (no inside the park foods) until the quality is brought up to a standard equal or If Not Better than what another country has. We are not a third world country deserving a cardboard park with missing light bulbs and rotting birds that can't sing anymore. Tell City Hall about your interest in Tokyo Disney Sea, do this in many subtle ways like saying arigato instead of thank you when you visit Dl and if a CM asks what that means tell them its for when you visit Disney Seas in Japan, maybe you never will as some cannot afford it but at least you have a dream and even Eisner cannot take our dreams, our money yes but not our dreams.

EandCDad
08-09-2001, 06:59 AM
Originally posted by DoodleDuck(A.E)
Sure glad your here Jeff to pull us all back from the edge whenever someone has defined opinions. No sense going over the top.
On the other hand...not all of us are Vulcans and occasionaly get emotional. But there's always room in the boat.


I'm all for you going nuts Doodle, in fact, I look forward to the day you go completely over the edge and hope you will document it in posts to this board.;)

I must, however, agree with Jeff's comments that it does seem a little far fetched the Disney is working to keep the media away from TDS. It could be happening, especially since things like Park openings are esentially PR puff pieces and not hard news, but it seems unlikely to me and not really worth it. Is comparison of TDS to DCA really going to keep people away from DCA? The average customer does not have much of a connect to something like that.

So have fun in the boat and be sure you bring enough food and water, we will miss you.

Doodle Duck
08-09-2001, 07:14 AM
You're in the same boat...byofood. Point is there's room in the boat (MP) for conformists and non-conformists alike.

Also about the possible call for OLC not to invite American media...I don't think there is a doub't that it wouldn't have the slightest effect on DCA in any way...
zero.
It would be an embarrassment factor though if one or two reporters who were on an 'expenses paid' junket started to ask the wrong questions and poke into corners.


Go nuts?? haha..I leave that to those who work for the Govt. :D

Ralph Wiggum
08-09-2001, 09:18 AM
I do think it could effect people visiting DCA, but not becuase they dont like DCA. I love DCA but I might not renew my pass so that i can go to TDS next year. I just dont have the money to do both. I think this is a possibility for alot of people if the word gets out about this park, especially for those people who have heard all the bad press about DCA.

EandCDad
08-09-2001, 09:40 AM
Originally posted by DoodleDuck(A.E)



Go nuts?? haha..I leave that to those who work for the Govt. :D


We actually had a guy in another field office who got fired and began lurking around some of the offices (not mine) with guns. He was arrested and sentenced to 180 days in jail. He is supposed to be out soon:eek: . If I stop posting suddenly, I count on my friends to avenge me.

I think Ralph makes a good point, the more people who see TDS may make the trip and that's a win-win, fans get to see a reportedly great park and Disney sees that high quality is rewarded.

Ralph Wiggum
08-09-2001, 10:10 AM
Originally posted by EandCDad



We actually had a guy in another field office who got fired and began lurking around some of the offices (not mine) with guns. He was arrested and sentenced to 180 days in jail. He is supposed to be out soon:eek: . If I stop posting suddenly, I count on my friends to avenge me.


Don't worry..Jrob's got your back...and I guess i'll help out too.;)

TomSawyer
08-09-2001, 01:35 PM
For those of you that are overly concerned with the Disney corporations obsession with the bottom line -- you do realize that Disney is a business, don't you? You do realize that in order for us to have the Disney parks, they have to make an actual profit, right?

Even Roy Disney told Walt that he couldn't do things that he wanted to do because they couldn't afford it.

Corith
08-09-2001, 01:43 PM
Disney has every right to make a proft, as it is a buisness. But, when you start cutting you ability to repair yourself, when you stop innovating and offer your customers poor quality you lose money.

DCA, designed to be an overgrown mall is an insult to the public. Eisner people would come just because it has a disney name on it. He and his crew of "yes" men figured they didn't need to spend buckets of money to draw in the same number of guests.
I got news for him, Seas is going to show him just how wrong he is.

Seas spend the buckets of money, they turned on the golden facet and watched the yen flow. In time, that hugh cost outlay will be returned in repeat buisness, customer enjoyment, and popular branding.

disneyhead
08-09-2001, 05:10 PM
Give me a park like TDS and I will throw as much money as I can at them. I want Disney to make money hand over fist.I want Disney to make more money from me than they will get at DCA.

Doodle Duck
08-09-2001, 05:36 PM
"You do realize that in order for us to have the Disney parks, they have to make an actual profit, right?"

Here we go again. 4,000 had to be FIRED because Eisner had to make a personal profit as well. That make it right?

Of course it's a business..everything is a freakin business...does that mean nothing ever again can be done correctlty, with the consumer in mind, without us all being 'understanding' about how we come up with the short end? I don't want to be understanding and 'feely' for this greedy bunch of pin heads. There is no rule that I live by that forces me to 'understand' their gazillionaire pain when the profit is already far and above what is necessary to DO THE JOB RIGHT.


Enough appologies and pleas for understanding.
Do the damn job right...increased profit will follow.

DisneylandKid
08-14-2001, 09:08 AM
OK!!! After seeing those AMAZING pictures of Tokyo DisneySea's Mermaid Lagoon, I feel it is time we use our anger to get Disney's attention. Definitely. DCA? What's that? Look at the beautifully detailed Jumpin' Jellyfish @ TDS...then look at the not-so-well-detailed Jumpin' Jellyfish @ DCA...and the whole rest of TDS vs. DCA! Someone get Disney's attention! No, someoneS. We need a group for this...

Doodle Duck
08-14-2001, 09:18 AM
The photos deliver a very simple message which should be obvious to pro & con DCA-ites and it is ...we got short changed.
How about some ammends?

Corith
08-14-2001, 09:43 AM
I don't know whether to weep at our loss, or shake my fist in anger.

DCA is junk. Let me repeat that for all of you missed it. DCA IS JUNK. Even Paul's precious retail areas look dull, drab, and ill-concieved when compared to TDS.

Einser will never, should never, be allowed to live this down. The two disney theme parks opened 6 months apart, and the one he smacked down next the orginal Disneyland looks like it was designed by Six Flaggs - not Disney.

Its so . . . so . . . so disgusting, so vile. There really aren't words to discribe it.

Sure, DCA might have something nice, but it doesn't look like a disney theme park. It is Six Flaggs over Anahiem. It just doesn't have the "disney" touch. It has that Pressler/Eisner touch.

3894
08-14-2001, 09:45 AM
You cannot shame those who have no shame. The only way to grab their attention is through their wallets. Economic boycott is the only way.

JeffG
08-14-2001, 09:47 AM
Originally posted by Corith
You may like it, you may not, but everything, every one can and must agree on is that it doesn't have the "disney" touch. It has that Pressler/Eisner touch.

Please stop trying to tell other people how they "must" think. I think you are completely wrong in your view of DCA, but I respect your right to your own opinion.

-Jeff

Corith
08-14-2001, 09:49 AM
And Eisner has the audacity to build DCA and still ask for his bonus!