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olegc
12-21-2009, 07:42 AM
from the Mouseplanet update today (12/23)
"...Disneyland park is now testing a new program of selling 1- and 2-day tickets directly at the turnstiles. Under the pilot program that began this weekend, customers pay for the tickets with a credit card (sorry, no cash), then receive the printed tickets and can enter the park immediately. Tickets are currently offered only at four marked turnstiles, and only for a few hours each morning. This effectively creates four more ticket booths during the busiest season, and is aimed at reducing the lines in the Esplanade. Customers who want to purchase multi-day passes or Annual Passports, or those who are paying with cash or travelers checks, will still use the regular ticket booths. If you already have park admission and are just trying to enter the park, be sure to avoid the ticket-selling turnstiles, as those lines are a little slower."

I know this theory sounds wonderful - but in practice it will be aweful. Already today if someone hits a turnstile with an incorrect ticket, and that dreaded boing sound is emitted, there tends to be a lengthy discussion wit the CM about how this can't be possible and at times a stern conversation takes place. I can imagine the same thing occuring with the purchase of tickets at the gate -why is it so much for my 10 year old, where is my receipt, wait I am only paying for three not four - and on and on.. Sure - we can assume that most folks would pass through rather quickly - but isn't Disneyland crowded enough? now getting more people in the parks faster? wow...

what about maybe promoting more purchase tickets at home? or at hotels? or at WOD and maybe even Disney Pin Traders? Multiple locations where you can purchase your theme park tickets - and then promote the heck out of it.

In fact - why not create a way to purchase tickets via a kiosk at the parking structure. You're waiting for a tram anyway, and it would be the same thing (approximately) as buying at the turnstile. The big difference is you, and the CM, would not have the pressure of a large line of annoyed guests waiting to get in behind you.

nbaum
12-21-2009, 07:49 AM
I agree. This sounds like a horrible idea.

AVP
12-21-2009, 08:06 AM
Oleg, I have to admit that the reaction at our house when we learned about this whole plan was total disbelief, followed by gales of laughter and a lengthy discussion of what other types of things they should also sell at the turnstilles - I believe the most popular suggestions were churros, limited-edition pins and embroidered Mickey Mouse ears.

And yes, I also asked "well, why don't you use the oh-so-klassy Holiday Faire tents as additional ticket booths," and "why don't you open up the never-used travel office in the parking structure to sell tickets," and "why don't you open ticket desks at the World of Disney store," and "why don't you add self-serve ticket kiosks like they have at Walt Disney World?"

That said... apparently the tests went really well. They are using four usually-closed turnstiles for this, and the gates are supposedly signed so people who already have tickets don't get in those lines. They aren't taking away turnstiles as much as they are adding four ticket counters. It's strange, but it seems like it's working...

AVP

DwarfPlanet
12-21-2009, 08:10 AM
Okay I admit its been along time (late 90's) since I have been to DLR during a peak traffic time. But it always seems that back then I would see some of the normal ticket booths closed. Is this in conjunction of having all the ticket booths open? I know I would hate to already have a ticket and get stuck in a line that not only takes tickets but are selling them also.

Drince88
12-21-2009, 08:12 AM
So they're ADDING staff to do this?

Are all the normal ticket booths usually open? Unless they usually are fully staffed there, it seems like just opening up more booths would be easier.

OH - but if these CMs don't have to handle cash, then they can do this with less training!

Koala Gurl
12-21-2009, 08:12 AM
What they should do is just have us swipe a valid credit card for entry. :) (Just kidding of course).

But yes, this sounds like a terrible idea. I do like the idea of some self serve kiosks though for tickets like Universal Studios and Sea World have.

AVP
12-21-2009, 08:24 AM
This is being done on days/times when ALL of the existing ticket windows are already open - not instead of opening windows. (That was my question too!)

Bytebear
12-21-2009, 08:30 AM
It sounds like it is an infastructure thing more than a good idea. They have the machines and technology already at the booths, so why purchase expensive kiosks when they have things already in place, albeit in an inconvenient and unexpected location.

Plus, tourists don't seem to get the whole, buy a ticket somewhere other than the gates, and kiosks would likely be unused by them. First timers just wouldn't get it, but they would get the turnstyle thing.

lauramaynot
12-21-2009, 09:12 AM
WOW! incredibly bad idea! I would def prefer the idea that they put in some ATM type teller machines that you could buy tickets from with a credit/debit card...that makes more sense to me and would cost the park waaaayyy less :rolleyes:

olegc
12-21-2009, 09:15 AM
It sounds like it is an infastructure thing more than a good idea.... Plus, tourists don't seem to get the whole, buy a ticket somewhere other than the gates, and kiosks would likely be unused by them.

I will agree with you on the infrastructure thing - but really about the tourists? it's been since 2001 or so that they have had the ticket booths as is - and in fact when you are forced to go to bag check and you see the booths in front of you then what is one to think? they are souvenir stands? I don't by the whole notion that a tourist "shows up" these days. Maybe possibly a local family with a new baby who moved here a year ago - but for most "tourists" don't you at least plan your flight, hotel, and what you want to do? and then - you figure out how much tickets are, where to get them, etc. The seat of the pants model for long distance travel went out a long time ago.



That said... apparently the tests went really well. They are using four usually-closed turnstiles for this, and the gates are supposedly signed so people who already have tickets don't get in those lines. They aren't taking away turnstiles as much as they are adding four ticket counters. It's strange, but it seems like it's working...
AVP

OK - the tests went well... but during those tests did they have the best and most efficient CMs in place? or managers? did they limit the time for ticket purchases for this test? We all know that word of mouth takes a little while - but then once it does it increases the burden. Mind you, this is not Halloween Fireworks but it would be interesting to see after the holidays how this worked out. If it's a good thing - great and I can say I was wrong. However, the track record for some of these "experiments" has not been all that great up to now..

pixar
12-21-2009, 10:02 AM
This is being done on days/times when ALL of the existing ticket windows are already open - not instead of opening windows. (That was my question too!)


That said... apparently the tests went really well. They are using four usually-closed turnstiles for this, and the gates are supposedly signed so people who already have tickets don't get in those lines. They aren't taking away turnstiles as much as they are adding four ticket counters. It's strange, but it seems like it's working...

AVP

Sounds like they're adding ticket selling capacity, which isn't necessarily a bad idea. But like you mentioned, it would have been nicer if they had set up kiosks instead.

CariBelle
12-21-2009, 10:12 AM
I don't by the whole notion that a tourist "shows up" these days. but for most "tourists" don't you at least plan your flight, hotel, and what you want to do? and then - you figure out how much tickets are, where to get them, etc. The seat of the pants model for long distance travel went out a long time ago.


Being 3 hours away from the resort I see a lot of people who say "Oh hey, let's go to Disneyland today" only to come back and tell me that they couldn't believe how much the tickets were, they were so mad that they had to pay a ticket for their 5 year old, they had to pay for a whole day when they got there after 12, etc. meaning they had done zero research and had no idea what they were getting into.

olegc
12-21-2009, 10:18 AM
Being 3 hours away from the resort I see a lot of people who say "Oh hey, let's go to Disneyland today" only to come back and tell me that they couldn't believe how much the tickets were, they were so mad that they had to pay a ticket for their 5 year old, they had to pay for a whole day when they got there after 12, etc. meaning they had done zero research and had no idea what they were getting into.

wow... you'd think with simple internet access and 10 minutes you'd take a look at hours, prices, etc. Hmmm....

nbaum
12-21-2009, 06:03 PM
Being 3 hours away from the resort I see a lot of people who say "Oh hey, let's go to Disneyland today" only to come back and tell me that they couldn't believe how much the tickets were, they were so mad that they had to pay a ticket for their 5 year old, they had to pay for a whole day when they got there after 12, etc. meaning they had done zero research and had no idea what they were getting into.

I'm in San Diego and I hear stuff like this all the time too. IME, more people are like this, then the planning types here on MP.

Bytebear
12-21-2009, 06:37 PM
Being 3 hours away from the resort I see a lot of people who say "Oh hey, let's go to Disneyland today" only to come back and tell me that they couldn't believe how much the tickets were, they were so mad that they had to pay a ticket for their 5 year old, they had to pay for a whole day when they got there after 12, etc. meaning they had done zero research and had no idea what they were getting into.

I can't tell you how many times I have been at the turnstyles and the people in front of me act bewildered that they have to go to some other line to get tickets. It happens all the time.

bennette
12-21-2009, 07:20 PM
This is a slight derail. But it's turnstile-delay related and while I like to think I'm used to people not quite being ready for the process, I was taken aback.

We were in line behind a family with four children. The mother was in front with the oldest and second oldest walking and two younger children in a stroller. The dad was actually floating around behind us somewhere, not sure why. She put out an AP for herself and went on through. The CM stopped her for her oldest child and asked where his ticket was.

"He doesn't need a ticket. He's four." (wait for it) "He's, he's three."

The CM calmly but a wee bit sternly said "He needs a ticket if he's three."

The dad moves forward and just happens to have a child's paper ticket in his pocket, which he quickly pulls out. He hands it up to his wife who turns it over to the CM, they pass through, and eventually we do, too.

I really don't want to know what they were thinking. But I'm pretty sure you cannot simultaneously have a three year old; four children total; with the youngest one is old enough to eat solid foods and sit fully erect in a stroller.

(Yes, I know, maybe they adopted, brought a cousin, or two of them looked freakishly small and/or large for their ages AND they just forgot how old one was but come on.)

Maybe this new approach will be a boon to people who somehow manage to be both unprepared (so far as having come to the park without tickets or passes) and yet prepared enough to figure out there is a credit only booth at the far right, or wherever it ends up. But I have enough delays getting into the park via the "regular" turnstiles.

I'll just hope they are REALLY clearly marked. At last I'll know to stay away. :)

kfreak
12-21-2009, 08:19 PM
The seat of the pants model for long distance travel went out a long time ago.


Actually I still like the seat of my pants type of long distance travel. Its a blast.

mechurchlady
12-21-2009, 08:44 PM
"It is simple" and "It is online" sounds like a good answer but it is not a good answer. How many times have you seen online or in person people who did not go online, go to a library, did not call the business, did not read books, and did not ask an employee for help? How many times have you seen people lost because they did not buy or print out maps? I learned from my father about how not to do a vacation when we had an extra day and then showed up at a historical site that was full.

If they are at maximum ability to sell then don't they need entrances and exits at maximum capacity. I have been in stores with do-it-yourself check out stands and people do not use them. Are they paying for more people out there directing traffic to those turnstiles? What about more people to stock the machines, answer questions, and fix machines?

I wonder when carts will go self-serve. Stick a card in the reader then out plops a Mickey bar. Maybe they can turn Plaza Inn into an automat, lol.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automat

chancencinny
12-21-2009, 09:14 PM
but during those tests did they have the best and most efficient CMs in place? or managers?

So far all the cms trained on this are either leads (who supervise it while in operation) or hired within the last 3 months. Those who have been there longer have not even been scheduled for training yet. I think they are keeping the more experienced cms in the booths to deal with the more complicated transactions so the booth lines move quicker.

I think it is a good thing. It kept the lines from leaving the queue area over the weekend by getting the people with simple one or two day purchases out of the line and into the park more quickly. Those with more involved transactions benefited from shorter lines then are normally expected on a holiday weekend.

AVP
12-21-2009, 09:16 PM
So I went to observe this process in person this morning, and I have to say it works way better than I expected. Gates 1-4 are set aside for this, and are physically roped off. At least 6 signs indicate that these are "Express Purchase" gates, and there are CMs walking the line to make sure everyone in the line knows why they are there. I also observed other CMs talking to guests standing in the regular ticket lines, and, if the guest was 1) buying a 1- or 2-day ticket 2) paying with credit card and 3) ready to enter the park immediately, the CM directed them to the turnstiles.

I watched for probably 15 minutes, and timed the transactions to see how quickly they were processed. (Yeah, it's a glamorous life). The longest transaction was about a minute, and that was because the guest hadn't signed his card and had to find his ID. The shortest transaction was 25 seconds, for two 1-day, 1-park tickets. The average transaction was 45 seconds.

Now, I will say that it helps A LOT that there are CMs in the queue, making sure people are ready with their credit card IN HAND when they hit the turnstile. I imagine the regular ticket lines would move a heck of a lot faster if people weren't rummaging for their wallets after they got to the counter. Heck. I imagine the lines at the regular entrance gates would move at warp speed if there was someone there to remind people to have their tickets out and ready when they got to the gate.

I don't know who was staffing the ticket-selling turnstiles today (leads or just front line CMs), but I don't think it really matters. Whoever they had working those positions today knew what they were doing, and the lines MOVED. And, that's really what this is all about, isn't it?

AVP

orchid2
12-21-2009, 09:30 PM
sounds like a bad idea to me... how many of us have stood behind someone in line that didn't understand and it took for ever to get thru our line while all the others seem to be moving right along.... leave the tickets to be purchase at the booths and let us with AP get thru and on with the show....

currence
12-21-2009, 09:58 PM
sounds like a bad idea to me... how many of us have stood behind someone in line that didn't understand and it took for ever to get thru our line while all the others seem to be moving right along.... leave the tickets to be purchase at the booths and let us with AP get thru and on with the show....

That's just it though, as was previously mentioned, they are using an entrance area that would normally otherwise go unused. So the people using the express entrance are not taking up your gate agent and are, if anything, keeping people from clogging up the regular entrance lines.

That said, I recall when DCA tested an annual passholder only line. At the time, It was simply a failed experiment. Now, with people not paying their monthly dues, trying to get in on blackout days, and otherwise being clueless, I would guess that AP delays exceed those of day guests - with the possible exception of people trying to park-hop on one-park tickets.

I had to stand in the ticket lines twice in October to renew various annual passes using the Costco promotion. Both times my transactions took significantly longer than I would have imagined, and we weren't signing up for the monthly payments or redeeming birthday fun cash. I would not want to wait in the regular ticket lines if I was just buying a simple ticket using my credit card. I imagine Disney's customer satisfaction will go up if they can get these easy transactions out of slow moving lines and into the parks faster.

We saw these lines set up yesterday as we were leaving the park. My only concern was that they seemed under utilized and I wondered if Diseny was doing anything to direct people from the ticket booths to express lanes. It was late enough in the afternoon that they may have simply not been selling many of the basic tickets. While I imagine this is probably something they will only bring out (and staff) on crowded days, I thought it was a good idea.

olegc
12-21-2009, 11:10 PM
well, i'll admit when I am wrong - and in this case it appears so for now. I hope this works out. And, as AVP said, we all wonder what happens down the road. However, it seems they would only use this option for the busiest of time anyway - so plenty of cast members would be present (or so the theory goes anway).

One thing I am curious about is that I thought there was a ceiling on dollar value of transaction before requiring a signature. Is Disney allowed to choose any kind of ceiling they want? does a guest still get a receipt for total transaction? Just wondering,.

now if they can just do this at some of the restaurants in the park we can be REAL happy.

AVP
12-22-2009, 07:27 AM
One thing I am curious about is that I thought there was a ceiling on dollar value of transaction before requiring a signature. Is Disney allowed to choose any kind of ceiling they want? does a guest still get a receipt for total transaction? Just wondering,.The guests I observed yesterday were signing something - it looked to me like a signature slip printed out on a ticket blank.

AVP

adriennek
12-22-2009, 07:49 AM
sounds like a bad idea to me... how many of us have stood behind someone in line that didn't understand and it took for ever to get thru our line while all the others seem to be moving right along.... leave the tickets to be purchase at the booths and let us with AP get thru and on with the show....

This makes no sense whatsoever. People with an AP would not be in the same line with people that need to buy tickets. Even from the earliest posts, let alone the post right before yours, it was stated that these would be lines exclusively for guests purchasing specific tickets, separate from the turnstyles for guests who already have tickets.

If you have an AP and want to get on with the show, don't get in the wrong line. ;)

Adrienne