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ladodgerjon
01-29-2009, 07:46 AM
A story on KTLA Morning News today (Thurs., 1/29) said that beginning yesterday, leftover food oil from the park's restaurants will be recycled and used by the park's five trains as a power source.

DLR spokespeople say that they will save up to 100,000 gallons of fuel each year.

smd4
01-29-2009, 08:10 AM
Just to be clear...

This doesn't mean the trains will be burning 100,000 gallons less fuel--just that they won't have to purchase it in the form of No. 2 diesel oil.

Here's a good breakdown of the benefits of biodiesel:

http://www.biodiesel.org/pdf_files/fuelfactsheets/emissions.PDF

newhdplayer
01-29-2009, 08:13 AM
I like it. Environmentally friendly, saves money, and reduces waste, all at the same time.

I wonder if Disney can convert their support vehicles to alternative fuels as well?

miss bianca
01-29-2009, 10:29 AM
We have a friend whose car runs on this and he gets it from local Chinese restaurants and it smells like Chinese Food when you drive behind him! Wonder if the trains will smell like churros??

newhdplayer
01-29-2009, 10:57 AM
We have a friend whose car runs on this and he gets it from local Chinese restaurants and it smells like Chinese Food when you drive behind him! Wonder if the trains will smell like churros??

I've got a stupid question.

Are churros fried, and then coated with whatever substance they put on 'em, or are they extruded and baked?

I really don't know.

miss bianca
01-29-2009, 11:00 AM
Fried! That's why they are soooo good!

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/152696/how_to_make_homemade_churros.html

AnotherJenny
01-29-2009, 11:55 AM
I for one would like to see them put solar panels on the top level of Mickey & Friends to run the escalators, etc. Also because I'd like to park in the shade, but mostly it's for the environment ;)

Bolivar
01-29-2009, 11:59 AM
We have a friend whose car runs on this and he gets it from local Chinese restaurants and it smells like Chinese Food when you drive behind him! Wonder if the trains will smell like churros??

Funny I too have a friend who runs his on biodiesel, he gets his from an Asian restaurant (not sure it is Chinese) and it smells like Chinese food.

The funny thing is that he wants four wheel drive and the only four wheel drive diesel he can get is a huge Ford F250 truck. This thing is massive and looks that farthest from green as you can get. He catches a lot of crap from people making comments to him about destorying the planet and such for driving it and really he is more green than almost anyone making those comments to him.

ScottC4746
01-29-2009, 12:04 PM
There was another thread about this on her before. The two drawbacks I have on it is you dont get all the steam you used to get from the engine and when you go through the tunnel it smells like fried food.

houseofmouse
01-29-2009, 12:14 PM
We rode the Tender in Oct. and were told they use biodiesel already.

smd4
01-29-2009, 12:20 PM
There was another thread about this on her before. The two drawbacks I have on it is you dont get all the steam you used to get from the engine and when you go through the tunnel it smells like fried food.

Of course, their first part of your statement is quite untrue: The amount of steam produced is unchanged. The engines still run at 125 - 150 psi. Biodiesel doesn't burn quite as hot as low-sulphur No. 2 petroleum diesel, so more fuel per hour may be needed. But the amount of steam generated is the same.

smd4
01-29-2009, 12:22 PM
We rode the Tender in Oct. and were told they use biodiesel already.The trains were switched over to biodiesel in January 2007, following successful tests with the E.P. Ripley. Before that, since their creation, the trains burned No. 2 "red" diesel (the same stuff you can buy at the gas pump, but instead it's dyed red to signify that road-use taxes haven't been paid on it).

Over the past few months, the trains were switched back to No. 2 diesel because the storage tanks weren't rated to store biodiesel.

houseofmouse
01-29-2009, 12:27 PM
Oh. Thanks. :) So they got new tanks then??

smd4
01-29-2009, 12:30 PM
Oh. Thanks. :) So they got new tanks then??I'd have to ask. Things may be different since they're "brewing their own" instead of buying it from a commercial vendor. I'll see what I can find out about the storage tank issue.

houseofmouse
01-29-2009, 12:33 PM
thanks. :)

Drince88
01-29-2009, 12:42 PM
No. 2 "red" diesel (the same stuff you can buy at the gas pump, but instead it's dyed red to signify that road-use taxes haven't been paid on it).
I thought the red dye signified that it didn't necessarily meet the sulfur content requirements for on-road vehicles.

smd4
01-29-2009, 01:04 PM
I thought the red dye signified that it didn't necessarily meet the sulfur content requirements for on-road vehicles.
Nope--It's cheaper than regualr diesel because road-use taxes aren't paid on it. If it's ever discovered you're using red-dyed No. 2 in your car, you're in for a hefty fine.

Here's a PDF which shows other vehicles that can use it:

http://www.chorleybottlegas.co.uk/docs/reddiesel.pdf

Wildwill
01-29-2009, 01:08 PM
Wow, where do you guys get your information from, and why do you know that?

I think it's very, very cool all around.

smd4
01-29-2009, 01:14 PM
Wow, where do you guys get your information from, and why do you know that?

I think it's very, very cool all around.

Well, the Disneyland trains are sort of a hobby passion of mine.

Drince88
01-29-2009, 01:19 PM
Here's a PDF which shows other vehicles that can use it:

http://www.chorleybottlegas.co.uk/docs/reddiesel.pdf
You do realize that's a document from the U.K., right - not necessarily the same rules as in California.

I did find something on the EPA pages about some changes in sulfur rules for non-road diesel, that happened after 2005, and I've been fairly out of the air emissions calculation game since before then (at least at the level that I"d know the supplied sulfur content of different diesels). And I did find from an unreilable souce that it used to be higher sulfur. So I think we're both right - but you're right now and I was right in the past.

newhdplayer
01-29-2009, 01:20 PM
I for one would like to see them put solar panels on the top level of Mickey & Friends to run the escalators, etc. Also because I'd like to park in the shade, but mostly it's for the environment ;)

Here goes...

Assuming 450,000 sq ft available space = 30,000 panels (15sq ft) x 224 Watts (full sun) per panel = 6,720,000 Watts total output.

I think that's enough to power a few appliances.

smd4
01-29-2009, 01:29 PM
You do realize that's a document from the U.K., right - not necessarily the same rules as in California.

I did find something on the EPA pages about some changes in sulfur rules for non-road diesel, that happened after 2005, and I've been fairly out of the air emissions calculation game since before then (at least at the level that I"d know the supplied sulfur content of different diesels). And I did find from an unreilable souce that it used to be higher sulfur. So I think we're both right - but you're right now and I was right in the past.

Sorry--Here's something Federal. Click on No. 7.

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-utl/federal_excise_taxes_faqs_v2.pdf

From what I have researched, the red dye has absoltuly NOTHING to do with sulfur content. Wouldn't that be like coloring gasoline for different octane ratings?

The red dye signifies simply that no road-use taxes have been paid.

Bolivar
01-29-2009, 02:22 PM
I have to be honest and say that when my friend was telling me about his biodiele I was a bit distracted. He told me he has a machine in his back yard about the size of a washing machine and he pours the used cooking oil in, adds a couple of catalyst chemicals and a few hours later he has biodiesel that he uses in his truck. He mentioned that it isn't completely legal. Is the tax issue the reason it isn't completely legal? He mentioned something about California not recognizing it as a fuel, but I didn't really ask.

smd4
01-29-2009, 02:37 PM
I have to be honest and say that when my friend was telling me about his biodiele I was a bit distracted. He told me he has a machine in his back yard about the size of a washing machine and he pours the used cooking oil in, adds a couple of catalyst chemicals and a few hours later he has biodiesel that he uses in his truck. He mentioned that it isn't completely legal. Is the tax issue the reason it isn't completely legal? He mentioned something about California not recognizing it as a fuel, but I didn't really ask.Well, you've got me there. I think I've seen some History Channel documentary showing a company in CA doing biodiesel conversions to stock cars and trucks. Seems to me if you can fuel you car on something you can make yourself, there wouldn't be any law against it.

Drince88
01-29-2009, 02:59 PM
From what I have researched, the red dye has absoltuly NOTHING to do with sulfur content. Wouldn't that be like coloring gasoline for different octane ratings?

That is the case NOW. From this EPA webpage (http://www.epa.gov/nonroad-diesel/2004fr/420f04032.htm)

This rule will reduce nonroad diesel fuel sulfur levels in two steps. First, starting in 2007, fuel sulfur levels in nonroad diesel fuel will be limited to a maximum of 500 ppm, the same as for current highway diesel fuel. This limit also covers fuels used in locomotive and marine applications (though not to the marine residual fuel used by very large engines on ocean-going vessels).

Second, starting in 2010, fuel sulfur levels in most nonroad diesel fuel will be reduced to 15 ppm. This ultra-low sulfur fuel will create immediate public health benefits and will make it possible for engine manufacturers to use advanced emission-control systems that will dramatically reduce both PM and NOx emissions. In the case of locomotive and marine diesel fuel, this second step will occur in 2012.

So NOW (post 2007) there is no difference in sulfur content, and non-road diesel is the same chemically as road-diesel, except for the dye. In the past (pre 2007) the red dye did indicate that it was higher sulfur AS WELL AS that it hadn't had the taxes paid on it. It wasn't colored because it had higher sulfur content, it was colored because it was 'offroad' diesel, and offroad diesel happened to be allowed to have higher sulfur content.