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Hydroman
10-26-2002, 07:08 AM
DCA, IMHO, needs sealife. Sea Lions, Sea Otters, porpoises, harbor seals, whatever, but that is what is missing from the wharf/pier area. Animatronic animals might suffice, so long as they weren't cheesey like on the sub ride.

I would think Disney could hire consultants from Seaworld or the Monterrey Bay Aquarium to show them how to care for marine mammals, install the infrastructure, maybe even train them for shows.

Just having saltwater instead of chlorinated fountain/pool water would add to the coastal aroma. Thoughts?

Klutch
10-26-2002, 07:29 AM
Nice ideas.

What DCA needs more than anything right now is people. It's the only theme park I've ever visited where I actually wished there were more people. Seeing an acoustic quartet play for 5 people and watching an annoying but enthusiastic accapella troup sing for an audience of 8 is just plain sad.

The ways that Disney management shoots themselves in the foot over this park is beyond belief. While my wife and I were at DL last week, my daughter and her friend wanted to ride the California Screamin' coaster. When we met them later, they said the entire Paradise Pier area was closed off for an Angels pep rally.

Now, I think it's great that the Angels are playing in the series. Wonderful that DTD hosted a pep rally. But closing an entire section of DCA? I find that ridiculous. If I had dropped $45 a head and found that situation, I would pretty hopping mad.

Then, maybe there's really nobody who pays admission for DCA only. Perhaps all the guests are AP holders and park hoppers. If that's the case, it would be all the more sad.

The marine mammal idea for DCA is a great one. But I wonder if the extreme expense of caring for the animals could be justified in a park yet to establish an audience.

justagrrl
10-26-2002, 07:43 AM
Last trip to DCA was about a week after Bug's Land opened. We went to the new rides and were going to roam around the park for a bit, but it was too crowded for me. Yes - you heard that one right. There was actually lines for things! This was on a week day in the afternoon.

ErikBsandiego
10-26-2002, 08:33 AM
About three saturdays ago there was an hour plus standby line for Soaring. So while I am sure some weekdays the park is empty - on "good" saturdays it can fill up.

My guess is that the Marine life idea would be VERY expensive. Sea World of San Diego spends a large amount on a state of the art water filtration system, there are some pretty stringent (good thing) regulations on vets and animal care, and unless the lagoon was really built with the idea of otters and dolphins in mind you would have to do an extensive refurb to ensure proper health for the animals. Add in the required back stage area......

Hydroman
10-26-2002, 04:21 PM
Yes, the costs would be large, but how else can DCA be improved without spending money? I think most DCA critics, and even some supporters, would agree that they did things on the cheap, and that throwing some money around could help.

Animatronics may be the solution. Dolphins/porpoises could be placed on a series of vertically-mounted wheels (like ferris wheels) that could be synchronized to simulate a school (or pod, or whatever you call a group) of dolphins leaping out of/back into the water of the Bay (maybe even timed with the launch of CS). Or how about some remote-controlled (like the boats they used to have at the DLH) otters near the wharf. Barking harbor seals/sea lions could be placed on small rocky islands or buoys.

Morrigoon
10-26-2002, 06:59 PM
What DCA needs is a theme change. Disney's America would allow them to get in some more interesting attractions.

HeeHeeHeeHoHoHo
10-26-2002, 08:26 PM
I dont' think DCA needs a theme change. I think DCA needs an additional one billion dollars worth of imagineering.

Frequently newspapers toss the figure we've all heard 1.4 billion for DCA, DTD AND the very nice Grand Californian. From what I understand half the cost was the hotel alone.

Islands of Adventure cost over 2 billion - Tokyo Disney Sea cost something along those lines - and Disneyland Paris - 10 years ago (hotels included) cost over 4 billion.

I know!!!!

Laffite
10-26-2002, 08:56 PM
Originally posted by Hydroman
DCA, IMHO, needs sealife. Sea Lions, Sea Otters, porpoises, harbor seals, whatever, but that is what is missing from the wharf/pier area. Animatronic animals might suffice, so long as they weren't cheesey like on the sub ride.

I would think Disney could hire consultants from Seaworld or the Monterrey Bay Aquarium to show them how to care for marine mammals, install the infrastructure, maybe even train them for shows.

Just having saltwater instead of chlorinated fountain/pool water would add to the coastal aroma. Thoughts?

How about Banana Slugs!!!

(the yellow-theme of this site reminded me so)

malin
10-27-2002, 11:12 AM
I think DCA needs to tear down the cheap carnaval side of the Pier.Keeping California Sceamin,Maliboomer,Sun Wheel and King Triton's Carousel.

It then needs to expand the San Fransisco area adding a new aquriem similar to Living Legends.With the theme being California sea life.

Rock (N) Roller Coaster would be a great addition to the Hollywood Backlot using MGM Studios theming and Walt Disney Studios disco lights.

I also think a copy of the brilliant Cinemagique from the Paris Studios is needed as well.

Also replace that Eureka parade and bring in a new parade theme to Its a bugs life.

Sailor Butterfly
10-27-2002, 06:54 PM
You know, from the moment I started reading about what was going into DCA, I always thought that having some animatronic sea otters in the Monterey area would be a nice bit of theming. Have one swimming on its back with a mollusk/shellfish on its stomach while it tries to break it open with a rock. Another one could come to the surface and then dive back down (utilizing a track) in different parts of the water area. Maybe have one of those thingamabobs that when you push the button, info on the creatures is told (of course there would be the plexiglass board thing that has the same info on it for the hearing impared).

Granted, it would be nice if they put in an attraction.....but hey, it's a start. *shrugs*

Banana slugs- ROFL That takes me back to my 5th grade trip to Camp Campbell over in Boulder Creek. :D

cujosr
10-27-2002, 07:40 PM
Originally posted by malin


Also replace that Eureka parade and bring in a new parade theme to Its a bugs life.

Don't you dare try to remove a very good parade and replace it with another lame bugs life anything!

malin
10-28-2002, 02:05 AM
Since when has that pile of crap been any good.

The parade lacks heart as its got no Disney characters.But this was I guess the image Paul Pressler wanted to make DCA.A Mickey and freinds free zone.That idea worked didn't it.I think Disney have been reworking the whole DCA theme by adding characters everywhere including adding a bugsland.You might think its lame cujosr but what about family's who want to do things together at this park.I would like to know which parade at DCA bring's in more audience Eureka or Disney's Electrical Parade?I mean if the parades that good why has it been taken out for the winter?Even the Walt Disney Studios in Paris which has lower attendance then DCA have a parade running.And the parade is good.In fact the parade is so good that MGM Studios are thinking about adding there own version to Orlando.

cstephens
10-28-2002, 12:43 PM
I think animatronic sea life would be cool. I would be completely against the idea of them adding real animals to DCA or DL.

Techie7
10-28-2002, 01:48 PM
Originally posted by cstephens
I would be completely against the idea of them adding real animals to DCA or DL.

Really? What about the horses on Mainstreet? The swans, ducks, and turtles at the castle are all real animals. Are you against having any animal in the parks or just new animals added to those that are already there?

Traci
10-28-2002, 01:58 PM
My very first time I visited DCA and the Paradise Pier area, that was my first thought. Why no sea lions? It's a pier, it looksso close to the San Francisco pier that it just needed some sea lions.
Even if they are animatronic.

I still have to say that I enjoy DCA, and am excited for every improvement, as slow as they might be.

Techie7
10-28-2002, 02:08 PM
Originally posted by malin
Since when has that pile of crap been any good.

The parade lacks heart as its got no Disney characters.But this was I guess the image Paul Pressler wanted to make DCA.A Mickey and freinds free zone.That idea worked didn't it.I think Disney have been reworking the whole DCA theme by adding characters everywhere including adding a bugsland.You might think its lame cujosr but what about family's who want to do things together at this park.I would like to know which parade at DCA bring's in more audience Eureka or Disney's Electrical Parade?I mean if the parades that good why has it been taken out for the winter?Even the Walt Disney Studios in Paris which has lower attendance then DCA have a parade running.And the parade is good.In fact the parade is so good that MGM Studios are thinking about adding there own version to Orlando.

malin: I wonder how you can post such an opinonated view of this parade when you have not been to DCA. (http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/showthread.php?postid=157446#post157446) Parades do not need to have Disney characters to have magic. I can cite Epcot as a pime example. Illuminations and Tapestry of Dreams both have no "Disney characters." I would consider both of these shows to be very entertaining and some of the best entertainment Disney has come up with in a while. Eureka is a very different type of parade for the Disneyland Resort and has people who love it an people who could pass it up (just as the Electrical Parade does). What is unique about Eureka is that it really does fit the theme of DCA and has some great floats and costumes. I really enjoyed seeing a different take on a "Disney parade" and don't think it suffers from a lack of characters.

Either way many parades and shows are seasonal at the Disney resorts. Fantasmic will not be running in the "off season" again. There are other examples at parks overseas but I will not comment on them since I do not have first hand knowledge of this. Different shows will tend to target different audiences. Eureka is one show that was not dumbed down. I do look forward to your review of DCA after your trip in November.

cstephens
10-28-2002, 04:38 PM
Originally posted by Techie7
Really? What about the horses on Mainstreet? The swans, ducks, and turtles at the castle are all real animals. Are you against having any animal in the parks or just new animals added to those that are already there?

I'm sorry, you're right, I phrased poorly. (BTW, I don't count the ducks as they aren't property - they just live there as far as I know.)

I'm against marine mammals being added to the parks as they are now. I know a little bit (through simple self-education) about what is involved in providing for and taking care of them properly, and I don't know that Disney would be up to the challenge. As an addition to the pier area, they'd really just be oddities and decorations, and there isn't enough room there to sufficiently house and keep those kinds of animals.

I know nothing about what horses or turtles or swans require, so I have no opinion on their presence at DL.

Laffite
10-28-2002, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by cstephens
I'm sorry, you're right, I phrased poorly. (BTW, I don't count the ducks as they aren't property - they just live there as far as I know.)

I'm against marine mammals being added to the parks as they are now. I know a little bit (through simple self-education) about what is involved in providing for and taking care of them properly, and I don't know that Disney would be up to the challenge. As an addition to the pier area, they'd really just be oddities and decorations, and there isn't enough room there to sufficiently house and keep those kinds of animals.

I know nothing about what horses or turtles or swans require, so I have no opinion on their presence at DL.

I agree there. If people want to see those fun animals they can go to Sea World, just an hour drive away. DLR (believe it or not) is not a zoo......errr..I may be forced to take that statement back :p

malin
10-29-2002, 03:12 AM
First of Techie7 your probely right.But I am a strong beliver that characters should be in all Disney parades.Thats just how I see it.And I wasn't a fan of the Epcot Tapestry of Dreams.I have read a load of reviews of the parade which all say the parade is poor.Sadly I can't find out for myself as the parade won't be running during my stay :( But atleast I get to see Disney's Electrical Parade.I look forward to giving you my review as soon as I get back.I have high hopes for DCA as I think I will like it.Maybe not as much as DL but alot better then Knotts and Universal Studios.

On the other subject of people saying Disney have no experience when it comes to marine mammals.Im sorry the company did a great job on living legends.But placing Sea Lion's in the lagoon is probely not a great idea with all the noice's that there would hear.

Sea World does an excellent job in helping injured sea life back into the wild.Like the Manatee's but I don't really like the way there keep the whales locked up in tanks.Im sure Sea World treat them better then other marine parks.So I have mixed feelings of Sea World,Animal Kingdom and other zoo parks.

cstephens
10-29-2002, 11:33 AM
Originally posted by malin
First of Techie7 your probely right.But I am a strong beliver that characters should be in all Disney parades.Thats just how I see it.And I wasn't a fan of the Epcot Tapestry of Dreams.I have read a load of reviews of the parade which all say the parade is poor.

I didn't see Tapestry of Dreams and also heard it was pretty bad. But I did see Tapestry of Nations, which was awesome and had no Disney characters whatsoever and didn't need them, and ToN got mostly rave reviews, if I recall.

hbquikcomjamesl
10-29-2002, 01:06 PM
Well, I recall seeing the "Eureka" parade once, and maybe seeing bits and pieces of it once or twice more, and it kind of strikes me as something that ought to be spelled "U-Reeka." And keep in mind that I rather like POTS, and thought Light Magic would have been quite good, if they'd ironed out the bugs and added viewing at the plaza Hub and Town Square.

As to Disney not being up to the challenge of handling real sea life, I can only point at "Living Seas" in EPCOT and the various zoo-type attractions in AK, and say that it's not a matter of not having the know-how; it's a matter of Disney knowing <insert rude adjective of your choice>-well what's involved, and that it's not practical for such a small tank.

And DCA not being a zoo, nor even a semi-zoo (like AK), I suspect they'd have all sorts of problems with people trying to feed the animals things that might make them sick.

Personally, I'd say (and indeed, I've said it before) (1) fill the empty storefronts in Bay Area (and please, not ALL retail), (2) tear out Mulholland Mistake, and (3) replace the whole Northwest corner of Paradise Pier with an expansion of Bay Area, including a cable car attraction.

Incidentally, anybody who thinks a few exhibits on farming HAVE to be boring needs to see the agriculture wing of the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry. Among the exhibits there is a John Deere combine (fitted for corn) with several Plexiglas panels to show the interior workings, sitting in a simulated cornfield, with a film loop showing on a screen in front of it. And that's only one exhibit.

Techie7
10-29-2002, 05:08 PM
Originally posted by cstephens
I didn't see Tapestry of Dreams and also heard it was pretty bad. But I did see Tapestry of Nations, which was awesome and had no Disney characters whatsoever and didn't need them, and ToN got mostly rave reviews, if I recall.

Ahhh. Yes Tapestry of Nations! I looked it up becuase I was no sure what it was. It was Nations now that I checked my video. Thanks

Sailor Butterfly
10-29-2002, 05:22 PM
I agree that real live animals could be a problem (I'd pitty the CM who'd have to clean up after the seals).

I've always wondered, what would be a great attraction for a Bay Area theme? I can only see a cable car attraction as being like the transportation on Main St. What else would be a good attraction? :confused:

Also, what if they utilized the California theme by having a disasters ride? I know it's been done before, but what could be more fun that experiencing mudslides, wild fires, and earthquakes? ;)

Techie7
10-29-2002, 05:34 PM
Originally posted by Sailor Butterfly
Also, what if they utilized the California theme by having a disasters ride? I know it's been done before, but what could be more fun that experiencing mudslides, wild fires, and earthquakes? ;)

But I live in California! Why would I want to go to a themepark when I can experience a REAL earthquake, mudslide, and fire near my home??? ;) :D

jrad32
10-30-2002, 02:08 PM
Some animatronic seaslions would be a nice bit of extra themeing, but as others have said the park really needs some more rides.

We were there last weekend, and it was depressing walking around the end of the Hollywood backlot. Just a lot of buildings with nothing there. Tower of Terror, and hopefully a good Alladin show will help this area.

Condor Flats has only Soaring to hang its hat on. It's a great ride, but enough for a whole area? I guess there's not a lot of space to shoehorn anything else in there.

We went on Mullholland Madness, and while I thought the themeing was awful. The ride itself was pretty fun. Our group liked the sensation the non-banked track created. I could see them tieing this area back to the Bay Area, and making this a dark ride maybe themed to Herbie the Love Bug, as others have suggested. With good theming it could be a nice addition.

The whole park is laking in the dark rides that showcase the details that set Disney apart. Superstar Limo was garbage. They need to do something with that ASAP. Why don't they theme it to a muppets dark ride, or this Great Movie Ride I've heard about at MGM.