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Thread: Parenting in the Parks: Naughty Kids in the Parks

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by bumblebeeonarose View Post
    My aunt took her daughter's door away once too.

    How severe can a punishment be at three though... There are not too many things she really cares about, she's not attached to much. She wouldn't care if I took her toys, except the one she sleeps with. And I read never take that away because it is their comfort. We usually take the TV away because that is something she does like. However, that sometimes leads to more naughty behavior as she now doesn't have a movie to distract her. The other thing we use is a baby gate. We'll put it up if she won't stay in bed at night. She can actually take it down, but for some reason she only takes it down in the morning. It is like she knows that once it's up she's lost and must go to bed. She's not old enough for other electronics, so I really don't have much to take away.
    In my opinion, time outs are very effective for toddlers. They just need to be done immediately. And then I would add that you reinforce the behavior that got her in a timeout, ask her to apologize and then follow up with a hug. And like Malcon10t said, the removal from your time and attention is very effective.

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  3. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by dsnyredhead View Post
    I think my kid did that once as a toddler...I quickly grabbed him and sat him back down with a stern no.
    My MIL let my kids misbehave at a restaurant once while I was in the bathroom. I came back and quickly put a stop to the behavior. Her defense was that he was "so cute" doing whatever it was he was doing (I think it was practicing walking/toddling around the store and not staying in his seat. In her defense it was highly adorable). I looked at her and asked "Will it still be cute when he is 13?" I don't understand how (certain) people can think their precious children should be allowed to do whatever they want when they are little without it affecting what they are like when they grow up.

    Regarding behavior at school turning into consequences at home, I do think that it is important for kids to understand that school and home are on the same page. My kids know that misbehavior at school equals negative consequences at home. Last year, the consequence was "no electronics" (i.e. no tv, computer, tablets, radio, games on cellphones, or toys that use batteries). But that was something my child and I developed together, with me throwing out a number of possible consequences and latching on to the one that he reacted to least favorably. Extra good behavior at school also earned them positive consequences at home (usually us saying yes to special food requests). But I think I would have been upset too if the school had told me what the consequence should be.

  4. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by currence View Post
    I don't understand how (certain) people can think their precious children should be allowed to do whatever they want when they are little without it affecting what they are like when they grow up.
    My son, Heir, allowed Heiress to stand on the bench seat at Red Robin at dinner one evening several months ago, looking into the next booth. I "suggested" she sit down. He commented that there wasn't anyone there that she was bothering. I explained she is too young to make that connection next time, she will just know you allowed it, why are you making different rules... He had her sit down, but for a couple minutes, I felt like I was being a mean grandma. He has since come to understand.
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  5. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by currence View Post
    But that was something my child and I developed together, with me throwing out a number of possible consequences and latching on to the one that he reacted to least favorably. Extra good behavior at school also earned them positive consequences at home (usually us saying yes to special food requests). But I think I would have been upset too if the school had told me what the consequence should be.
    That was my whole issue. They were telling me what the consequences should be at home even after he had already sat in the principal's office for part of the day. It seemed like they were adding to the punishment even though he had already been punished. They have asked me at iep meetings 'how I discipline him' and while I agree that they are trying to find out what works..I do not feel that school should tell me what the consequences should be at home.

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    I am a single adult with no children. I travel to WDW and Disneyland both and I applaud parents who discipline their children. When kids misbehave it ruins the enjoyment of all those around them. The excuse that it is Disney does not fly with me. Children should be respectful no matter what. I have taken many of the kids in our family to different parks and I have my rules as well. If the kids do not follow my rules they know they will not be invited again.

    The thing I get annoyed at is adults who act worse than kids and set a poor example for kids who see them. I have watched adults for example kick the walls in the Pirate que. When I see things like this I am outraged. That is a sign of total disrespect for others property. If I was big and scary I would have a talk with adults that misbehave. I also do not allow other people's children to do whatever. On a recent trip to Six Flags these kids ran in front of us to get on a ride. They had friends that were behind us in between other family that was with us that they cut in front of. When the friends reached us and wanted by us I told them go ahead because your friends were already rude by cutting in line in the first place. They knew I was mad and apologized. My cousins that were with me were pleased that I said something because they knew if they did that there would be trouble.


  7. #56
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    Parenting in the Parks: Naughty Kids in the Parks

    Skimbob, I usually make the line cutters go back to be with their friends. Otherwise, they'll just have to be separated.

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  8. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by currence View Post
    But I think I would have been upset too if the school had told me what the consequence should be.
    I have never been a teacher, nor a parent, so I have zero qualifications in those arenas, but I'm butting in anyway.

    I guess I don't see that as being the school telling the parent what to do. If there's a problem at school, I certainly agree with you that the child needs to understand that there are consequences to be dealt with both at school and at home, and the two should be in conjunction. I could see where the school might be inclined to levy something more punitive if they didn't feel the child was going to get the adequate consequences at home, or they might not be quite as harsh if they knew the child was serving most of his/her consequences at home. So, if the school feels that they had an agreement with the parent regarding what consequences would be done at school and what would be done at home, and then all of a sudden the parent unilaterally decides not to keep up the home portion, I could see where the school now would feel that the child got off easy because he/she didn't have to deal with full consequences. At least if the parent was up front about what the home consequences were going to be, the school could then take that information and make their own decision about what the school consequences would be.

    And of course, by "school", I don't mean the physical building, but whomever the staff/personnel would be who would be dealing with this sort of thing.


    And, as far as behaviour at the parks, I rarely blame the child for any "bad" behaviour, unless the child is old enough, and even then, if they haven't been taught, it's not their fault. It's when the parent does nothing to try to stop and/or correct that behaviour or has the wrong expectactions of the child that it makes me somewhat annoyed.
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  9. #58
    It was a good day! Malcon10t's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cstephens View Post
    So, if the school feels that they had an agreement with the parent regarding what consequences would be done at school and what would be done at home, and then all of a sudden the parent unilaterally decides not to keep up the home portion, I could see where the school now would feel that the child got off easy because he/she didn't have to deal with full consequences.
    I usually worked with the school to enforce punishments. We also rewarded good behavior at school for the one who had issues at school. There was only one incident at school I refused to enforce any punishment at home, but that was as a teen for something I truly felt was unfair, not just for my child, but for another one also. Again, this was in HS. Through out elementary and middle, the school and I worked together. And I did work with the school psychologist for behavior mods my children needed. School really needs to be team work. While we only have a "few" kids (I have 4), teachers and staff see 5 times that, and often have more ideas than what we see.
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  10. #59
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    This has been really interesting and helpful to read. My kids are almost 3 and 17 months. My older one is not a tantrumer, but a fit-er. Like he gets angry but it is fairly short lived and not too traumatic on anyone. We use time outs with him which are fairly effective, usually this is for not following directions or speaking one too many times to Mommy in "that" tone. I feel like they have gotten more effective in the last 6 months or so- as in he cares more. Before that, he didn't really care much and would get up a million times. But after returning to time out a million times, he started to "get it." I just put my daughter in her first mini-time out today for throwing a roll of duct tape at her brother's head- and she aimed well. She is gonna test every parenting skill I have- I am pretty sure. She is a tantrumer and a thrower and a stomper. Right now, it is kind of hard not to laugh.... but we have maintained composure so far!

    I should ask you all, our issue that has cropped up lately is fighting over the same toy. Generally it goes like this, K- playing nicely with something. M- "Hey, I have not looked at that toy in 3 months but it is my favorite toy ever and I want to play with it NOW!!!!" Mom- "M, K is playing with that. You can have your turn when she is done." M- "I had it FIRST!!!!!" grabs it from her, she screams and cries, M goes to time out only to have the situation play out again 10 minutes later. It is driving me insane!! Sometimes, K is the instigator of the toy stealing, but not usually and she is still redirected easily to something else.

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  11. #60

    In the situation where school wanted to have him punished at home, I also talked directly with the aide who actually had the incident. She told me a very different story of what happened and that changed our opinion of what the punishment should be. It was clear that he reacted to something that he simply could not understand at that time. Thus our view of how the school wanted him punished did not fit the incident.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcon10t View Post
    I usually worked with the school to enforce punishments. We also rewarded good behavior at school for the one who had issues at school. There was only one incident at school I refused to enforce any punishment at home, but that was as a teen for something I truly felt was unfair, not just for my child, but for another one also. Again, this was in HS. Through out elementary and middle, the school and I worked together. And I did work with the school psychologist for behavior mods my children needed. School really needs to be team work. While we only have a "few" kids (I have 4), teachers and staff see 5 times that, and often have more ideas than what we see.
    I've actually had the school tell me: You don't need to do anything at home, we took care of it here and we consider it over. They knew/know that if they involve me, we're going to follow up at home. Sometimes they just want to inform me. I had to have a conversation with one teacher that went something like "Ok, if I get a written note, THEN I should follow up at home. If you're telling me something verbally, you consider it already addressed, is that what you're saying?" The same teacher told me "I know you have a very structured system at home and I appreciate that you'll follow through." This was the second time I "had" her. She was one of my favorites. It really has to be a cooperative team effort.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mermaid View Post
    But after returning to time out a million times, he started to "get it."

    SNIP TO

    I should ask you all, our issue that has cropped up lately is fighting over the same toy. Generally it goes like this, K- playing nicely with something. M- "Hey, I have not looked at that toy in 3 months but it is my favorite toy ever and I want to play with it NOW!!!!" Mom- "M, K is playing with that. You can have your turn when she is done." M- "I had it FIRST!!!!!" grabs it from her, she screams and cries, M goes to time out only to have the situation play out again 10 minutes later. It is driving me insane!! Sometimes, K is the instigator of the toy stealing, but not usually and she is still redirected easily to something else.
    I think you answered your own question! After losing the toy he grabbed from K, about a million times, he'll start to get it.

    I started to post a reply earlier but I got distracted. The "Removing me" part is what's critical, IMO, and also, sometimes the hardest. (See: Mermaid trying not to laugh at K and going insane with M.) I TOTALLY get it. When my kids are pushing my buttons, they try to engage me. And there was a time it worked. As I practiced more, I started to catch myself and reminded myself "Don't engage. That's what he wants."

    So I have to try hard to remember, sometimes: Don't laugh. Don't get mad and take the bait and escalate. Don't reward the behavior with a response. Don't get dragged down to his level.

    Stay calm. Give the consequence. If the child is reacting, give him time to calm down before escalating the consequence. I've been known to sit down with a child much later after he calmed down and say: Ok, I'm glad you calmed down, now, but I do have to add to your consequence because you did not calm down before.

    And I almost went insane. And I had to do it a million times. And I probably annoyed some of my friends by privately venting to them or going to them and saying "Ok, tell me I'm doing the right thing" for the millionth time.
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  13. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mermaid View Post
    Generally it goes like this, K- playing nicely with something. M- "Hey, I have not looked at that toy in 3 months but it is my favorite toy ever and I want to play with it NOW!!!!" Mom- "M, K is playing with that. You can have your turn when she is done." M- "I had it FIRST!!!!!" grabs it from her, she screams and cries, M goes to time out only to have the situation play out again 10 minutes later. It is driving me insane!! Sometimes, K is the instigator of the toy stealing, but not usually and she is still redirected easily to something else.
    Do you want an idea? Here is what *I* would do. He is old enough to understand now. Make a hard and fast rule that if he steals a toy from K, he cannot play with that toy today. (M, from now on, if you take a toy from K, you will get time out, and you cannot play with that toy today. If K takes a toy from you, come tell me, and I will get it back for you.) He takes it from her, you take it back, give it back to her, tell him no more toy that day. He gets time out. He takes it back again, same thing, reminding him he cannot have it period today, even if she isn't playing with it. If he doesn't stop taking the toy, escalate to removing not just the toy he took, but the toy he had been playing with before for the day. (If you take the Pluto from K again, I will also have to put up your truck for today.)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcon10t View Post
    Do you want an idea? Here is what *I* would do. He is old enough to understand now. Make a hard and fast rule that if he steals a toy from K, he cannot play with that toy today. (M, from now on, if you take a toy from K, you will get time out, and you cannot play with that toy today. If K takes a toy from you, come tell me, and I will get it back for you.) He takes it from her, you take it back, give it back to her, tell him no more toy that day. He gets time out. He takes it back again, same thing, reminding him he cannot have it period today, even if she isn't playing with it. If he doesn't stop taking the toy, escalate to removing not just the toy he took, but the toy he had been playing with before for the day. (If you take the Pluto from K again, I will also have to put up your truck for today.)
    We got a tool box and a lock. In our case, by the time we got it, the boys were old enough that we actually wrote on it "DS Jail." It was for their Nintendo DSs (obviously) but it's big enough to hold iPods and Wii-remotes, too. (Not big enough for the iPad that eldest bought for himself so we have to have a hiding spot for that.)
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  15. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by adriennek View Post
    We got a tool box and a lock. In our case, by the time we got it, the boys were old enough that we actually wrote on it "DS Jail." It was for their Nintendo DSs (obviously) but it's big enough to hold iPods and Wii-remotes, too. (Not big enough for the iPad that eldest bought for himself so we have to have a hiding spot for that.)
    I was assuming it was OK for K to have, but just restricting M from having. But as the kids get older, the tool box is a great idea.

    And like you, I don't care if the child has purchased the item themselves, under my roof, under my rules....
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    Yes, generally K is playing nicely with it (before the standoff ensues) if it is a toy they both are being crazy over- it gets put on top of the fridge until after naps or the next day depending on when it happened- but that has only happened a handful of times. I am sure as K gets older- it will get much worse before it gets better!

    I like Mal's rule- in fact I told DH today I was instituting it. But amazingly, no toy fights today. I was struggling to teach Matthew that if he waits a bit, she will be done and he can have the coveted "I have not ever played with you, but now you must be mine" toy. But, that's not really working- the taking it from him for the day I think will be more immediate and concrete. My plan is to wait until she is done and then just put it up. This should work for now since she isn't super attached to anything and wouldn't miss anything for a day. He often does ask her nicely if he can have it and then complains that she's not sharing (and then either fits or grabs it), which is funny but exasperating! He uses the good behavior of asking nicely, but gets super upset when it doesn't have the desired outcome. Just because you asked nicely, does not mean she has to give it to you. And we do have a rule that unless she is invited, K is not allowed to play with M's trains- those are his toys alone. K doesn't have anything that qualifies for that yet, but will soon enough, I'm sure.

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  17. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by cstephens View Post

    I guess I don't see that as being the school telling the parent what to do.
    The school told me, "we need to deal with it this way, this is what we want you to do". So yes, the school did tell me "what to do." That is where I had a big problem with it. After hearing directly from the adult involved who was there, my opinion changed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcon10t View Post
    I was assuming it was OK for K to have, but just restricting M from having. But as the kids get older, the tool box is a great idea.

    And like you, I don't care if the child has purchased the item themselves, under my roof, under my rules....
    Agreed with Mermaid's K & M.

    And yep - most of the hand-held electronics were bought with their own money. Those that have passcodes, WE know the passcodes for. They have to come to us to unlock their codes in order to use them. My M figured out he could still listen to music on his iPad when it was passlocked, so now when he loses it, he LOSES it. DS's didn't have passcode locks so we had to confiscate them.
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  19. #68

    When toys are creating issues in our house we have been known to give "Toy time outs." Pretty similar to kid time outs but they tend to last a lot longer and the toys don't have to talk about what happened or give me a hug to get out. They tend to be used when a toy is causing issues that are annoying me (not sharing, being dropped on the ground, etc) but the behavior may not have escalated to a person time out. They are especially helpful when the little person alleges that they "can't help it." Often threatening the toy time out is enough to stop the bad behavior. ("If your [favorite stuffed animal] can't stay in your hands, he might need to go into time-out for a little while to think about why being dropped isn't such a good idea").

    For us, for now, toy time outs are not done to punish the child. We have also been known to take toys away as punishment, but that is different than the toy time out.

    I like the idea of DS Jail! I will have to mentally file that one away for when the day comes I need to use it!


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    Quote Originally Posted by currence View Post
    They are especially helpful when the little person alleges that they "can't help it." Often threatening the toy time out is enough to stop the bad behavior. ("If your [favorite stuffed animal] can't stay in your hands, he might need to go into time-out for a little while to think about why being dropped isn't such a good idea").
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    Quote Originally Posted by adriennek View Post
    We got a tool box and a lock. <SNIP> (Not big enough for the iPad that eldest bought for himself so we have to have a hiding spot for that.)
    Sounds like an excuse to buy a new tool box... and more tools.
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  22. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by currence View Post
    When toys are creating issues in our house we have been known to give "Toy time outs."
    We have done this. I think sometimes it is more effective than a time out for DD. She doesn't like the idea of her Thomas train in timeout.

    We don't have problems with her stealing toys from her brother yet as he is too young. Though sometimes there is a problem with her giving him so many toys he is buried. I think part of our problems right now stem from the age, she has become very stubborn and many of my friends' kids are the same way right now. But I also think it was a lot of change at once. Baby brother was born (there's a big change) and so now I was home with her and she wasn't going to school. Then summer came, so I'm still off and my husband is doing an internship so he's gone all day. That is a big switch for her as she's used to him being home and me being gone.

    I work hard to stand my ground with her. It just isn't any fun when a fight over nap time takes hours. I won (locked her in her room with a bungee cord tied on hers and brother's door knobs), but it was a long battle. She's always taken naps without a problem, and still usually does. She was very tired too, but she didn't want to and was not relenting. She's the stubbornness little thing. Not sure where she got that from...

  23. #72
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    I need y'all to know, I used this thread yesterday. Yes, it was my own advice, but I'd FORGOTTEN my own best practices.

    We were at Disneyland at the time, too!

    My youngest was doing his pouting thing. It's not really tantrum level anymore, but when he's NOT happy, he lets EVERYONE know. I was with another Padder and we were talking about this thread, actually. I realized I hadn't taken away ME. I was feeding his pout!

    So I stopped. I just started ignoring him. I stopped trying to talk him out of the pout. I stopped trying to lecture him out of the pout. I just started to ignore him.

    Another thing I got from her that was fabulous - we had 5 boys between the two of us - and there was an argument as we were loading up the car to come home. J wanted to sit next to M, C wanted to sit with P, J wanted the back seat, M wanted the middle seat (S didn't care he just wanted it all to stop.) So other mom said "I'm going to count to TEN and if you all don't figure this out, I will." I'm totally down with the "if you don't figure this out, I will" but I've never added the counting thing to give them that guideline. As soon as they said it, J was a lot more into finding a compromise. She was clearly counting slow enough to give them time to get everyone moved around. By 4, the kids were saying "you can stop counting! We're doing it!!" and she did.

    This could totally work in so many situations at the parks, too.

    So I'm totally going to do that. I think I fix the problems WAY too often, in the interest of time. Now I have a tool to manage how long it takes them to fix the problem themselves. SCORE!

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  24. #73

    Ignoring the pout works great with Arg too. The more we feed it, the more it grows. I simply tell him "when you are ready to speak to me in a clear voice, I will listen, the tantrum isn't going to work with me".


  25. #74

    The removing me seems to be working better than anything else, thanks for the tip. I put myself in "timeout" in my room. I tried this the other day when she was in timeout but kept opening my door (we use the stairs for timeout, and when we're upstairs it happens to be outside my room). I locked my door so she couldn't open it. And that was it. She hated it and threw a huge fit, which I didn't have to witness, and then finally calmed down. She realized she had lost and didn't have my attention. Did this again today and it worked again. Thanks again for the tip.


  26. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by bumblebeeonarose View Post
    the removing me seems to be working better than anything else, thanks for the tip.
    yeah!!!
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