The Avengers - Money In The Bank

[IllusionOfLife]

I still wouldn't compare the two films (unless I missed the five sucessful films that set up John Carter).

This. The Avengers is an entirely different animal than John Carter was. The Avengers is a film that has basically been promoted by five other films over the past four years, John Carter is the first (and, unfortunately, probably last) entry in a potential franchise. They could have released The Avengers without an ounce of marketing behind it because people have been waiting to see this movie since the post-credits reveal in Iron Man back in 2008. John Carter didn't have that kind of public awareness and Disney's marketing department severely dropped the ball there.

You blame this whole thing on the fact that it was an obscure property with a niche audience that no one was really clamoring for. You know what else were fairly obscure properties with niche audiences that no one was really clamoring for? Iron Man. Thor. Captain America. Outside of comic fandom, most people had very limited, if any knowledge of these characters, and even within comic fandom, these characters have never been as popular as Spider-Man, The X-Men, Batman, or Superman. Even Robert Downey Jr. wasn't exactly a draw at the time; he kind of re-made himself a star with Iron Man. It was a great marketing campaign that led Iron Man to success, and that success has fueled the entire Avengers franchise.

I've already expressed my conspiracy theories, but whether you buy into that or not, Disney grossly mishandled raising public awareness an anticipation of John Carter in a way that is baffling. The reason it was set up to fail from the start was not because it was an inherently bad idea, but because Disney, for some reason or another had no interest in marketing the thing. It's funny you bring up TRON: Legacy, because that was one where Disney threw in everything, including the kitchen sink, in terms of marketing. They showed that thing off at Comic-Con for more consecutive years than any other property in history, they had loads of marketing materials, theme park tie-ins, tons of merchandise, and a full blown ARG (Alternate Reality Game). And while it may not have been the Pirates level success they wanted it to be, it generally paid off, making back twice its budget and re-sparking interest in what was considered a dead property to the point where ElecTRONica could stick around for well past its expiration date, a hotly anticipated TV series premiers in a couple months, and sequel plans are still being kicked around.

John Carter had none of that. John Carter had a few lackluster trailers that didn't properly convey the tone or story of the film, and not much else. Is it any wonder that it failed? John Carter was a risk, and not a lot of studios are willing to take risks anymore. They want safe, unambitious, franchise properties that they could release without an ounce of marketing and still guarantee a profit; those type of movies are fine, but if we want to push the art form forward risk needs to be taken. When you take a risk, though, you need to own it 100%; get behind it and fight for it, and try to win as many people over to your side as possible. Disney didn't do that. They took the risk and essentially told the public, "well, we never really believed in this project anyway."

It baffles me that a studio would green light an expensive and ambitious project like John Carter only to abandon ship before the thing ever hits theaters.

[Alex S.]

It was a great marketing campaign that led Iron Man to success, and that success has fueled the entire Avengers franchise.

Hmmm...I would suggest that while a great marketing campaign may have made more people interested in giving it a shot, it was the fact that it was a pretty good movie that made it a franchise.

And being one of the few who have seen both John Carter and The Avengers I think that will bear out again. John Carter was a mediocre movie and the marketing wasn't good enough to get people in theaters before they heard otherwise. The Avengers is a good movie with the benefit of plenty of pre-interest (from marketing or otherwise) but there will be no noise to slow down interest.

[dban3]

Lets look at Disneys first 3 film releases of 2012 (not including the Disneynature effort) John Carter (March), The Avengers (May), Brave (June) different animals, sure. But its the same zookeeper and the name is Disney. You can look at the artistic merits of each film, but Im also looking at the business side. Each of these 3 films adds or takes away from Disneys profit and loss. The Disney Studios Chairman (currently vacant) sits on top of Disney, Pixar, and Marvel Studios (though they do operate somewhat independently). Look at the 3 Studios Pixar - focused on what they do best (OK, Im willing to overlook Cars 2), Marvel focused on what they do best, Disney - lets pass out gobs of money, make movies, and see what sticks. They should be doing what they do best more Princess & the Frogs and Tangled, fewer John Carters and Prince of Persia (wouldnt they love to have the cost of those two movies back).

Im looking for a smarter Disney Studios. The buying of Marvel and Pixar are sound investments at a corporate level that will make their costs back many times over but at the same time what Disney self- produces cant seem to get out of its own way a lot of the time. Thats the part that needs to change.

[familymemories]

We are so looking forward to seeing The Avengers.

[dban3]

We are so looking forward to seeing The Avengers.

As many people are and from almost all sources who have seen the film - it delivers - BIG. Action and humor.

[Ohthatjeff]

You can look at the artistic merits of each film, but Im also looking at the business side. Each of these 3 films adds or takes away from Disneys profit and loss. The Disney Studios Chairman (currently vacant) sits on top of Disney, Pixar, and Marvel Studios (though they do operate somewhat independently). Look at the 3 Studios Pixar - focused on what they do best (OK, Im willing to overlook Cars 2)

As a movie lover, I'm looking forward to Brave. If I was the person who sells toys to WalMart, the day they announced Cars 2 would have been the happiest day in my professional life. The day my boss walked in and used the phrase "medieval Scottish princess" would have been the day I updated my resume. Cars2 is the kind of movie that lets you make a movie like "Brave."

And for what it's worth (about $18*), I liked Prince of Persia.

*Movie ticket, soda, half a medium popcorn.**
**Don't usually get anything close to half.

[dban3]

As a movie lover, I'm looking forward to Brave. If I was the person who sells toys to WalMart, the day they announced Cars 2 would have been the happiest day in my professional life. The day my boss walked in and used the phrase "medieval Scottish princess" would have been the day I updated my resume. Cars2 is the kind of movie that lets you make a movie like "Brave."

And for what it's worth (about $18*), I liked Prince of Persia.


*Movie ticket, soda, half a medium popcorn.**
**Don't usually get anything close to half.

Ha.... Once we put The Avengers to bed in about 3 weeks and Disney is counting its millions we can go to work on "Brave", yes, a Princess movie, hopefully a transcended one. Go out take a look at what Disney has to offer the rest of this year. Question marks-a-plenty even going up until next spring's Oz: The Great and Powerful.

[pixar]

As a movie lover, I'm looking forward to Brave. If I was the person who sells toys to WalMart, the day they announced Cars 2 would have been the happiest day in my professional life. The day my boss walked in and used the phrase "medieval Scottish princess" would have been the day I updated my resume. Cars2 is the kind of movie that lets you make a movie like "Brave."

Every time I see the merchandise revenue charts, I'm amazed at how tall the bar is for Cars.

As many people are and from almost all sources who have seen the film - it delivers - BIG. Action and humor.

It does. Hulk...SMASH!

[Ohthatjeff]

Every time I see the merchandise revenue charts, I'm amazed at how tall the bar is for Cars.

I'm not. The day y'all make a movie about transforming dinosaurs driving cars in space, all my money is going into stock.

[jananafish]

Hulk...SMASH!

It was SO GOOD!! And honestly I had really low expectations for this film. As an avid comic book junkie I was actually pretty impressed with the overall narrative of the film. It was really entertaining and the story was well written and directed. A solid A.

And bless her heart, I love her, but I don't really think she's that great of an actress...but Scarlett Johansson was phenomenal this go-around. Everyone was really solid.

[dban3]

Time to start counting the money. Over $200 million in domestic box office receipts for The Avengers opening weekend, a new record by almost $30 million. In a about a week and a half of world-wide release, The Avengers has grossed close to $650 million. Disney execs have to be smiling. As one article has written "The Avengers redefines the standards for a blockbuster debut". Four billion for purchasing Marvel may end up being a bargain in a very short time.

[cstephens]

Disney execs have to be smiling.

Paramount is pretty happy too, I expect.

[Iceman]

Paramount is pretty happy too, I expect.

What ARE the legal arrangements between the relevant companies. How much of the profits go to each, who gets home video rights, who gets licensing fees for merchandise and video games, etc., etc. And does anyone know for sure the restrictions and loopholes on theme park attractions and other tie-ins?

[dban3]

Paramount is pretty happy too, I expect.

Paramount still gets some credits on screen as part of a buy out deal but Disney paid Paramount about $115 million to get exclusive control of The Avengers and Iron Man 3, the last two pictures on the original Paramount / Marvel deal. The profits from The Avengers belong to Disney. The party is at Bob's house.

http://www.deadline.com/2010/10/disn...uibution-deal/

[cstephens]

Paramount still gets some credits on screen as part of a buy out deal but Disney paid Paramount about $115 million to get exclusive control of The Avengers and Iron Man 3, the last two pictures on the original Paramount / Marvel deal. The profits from The Avengers belong to Disney.

Hmmm, interesting. I didn't know that. Thanks.

[cstephens]

Paramount still gets some credits on screen as part of a buy out deal but Disney paid Paramount about $115 million to get exclusive control of The Avengers and Iron Man 3, the last two pictures on the original Paramount / Marvel deal. The profits from The Avengers belong to Disney.

Variety just posted an article that the $115 million to Paramount is only a guaranteed minimum. They're entitled to a percentage of the take from "The Avengers" and "Iron Man 3" as well, and that's including all platforms (theatrical, home video, etc.) worldwide. With the box office success of "The Avengers", Paramount is expected to receive much more than the minimum - the better the two films do, the more money Paramount gets, so as I mentioned previously, Paramount is celebrating right along with Disney over the success of "The Avengers".

[Alex S.]

Yeah, that was my reading of the article dban3 linked too. Disney gave Paramount a $150 million advance against royalties (meaning that Paramount wouldn't have to return it if box office didn't support it but would get more if their 8-9% distribution fee would have been more than that.

In return Disney got to control the distribution and marketing plans for the movie. So I don't think Disney is getting any money that they otherwise wouldn't have (since the advance will be more than covered, at least on this movie), but they get to take full credit for whatever it does generate.

[jcruise86]

I saw The Avengers today and loved it!
It was surprisingly funny, and I'm looking forward to seeing it again.

[dban3]

I saw The Avengers today and loved it!
It was surprisingly funny, and I'm looking forward to seeing it again.

Exactly what Disney wants to hear. The easiest way to turn a popular movie into blockbuster status is to see it more than once in the theaters. They last movie I saw more than once in a theater was Iron Man 1. Saw it three times in a theater (you just have to take your friends/family that haven't seen it). From there I bought the deluxe DVD set and then when Blu-Rays came out, bought that as well. I can see a lot of this going on with The Avengers.

Disney will release its quarterly earnings report via conference call with Bob Iger and Jay Rasulo today about 2 pm (May 8). The movie studio is going to take a hit because of the Carter affair. But Bob has an ace up his sleeve for his investors. In fact, he has a bunch of aces. They're called The Avengers. The Avenged for Disney alright. They Avenged John Carter.

[houseofmouse]

Took my oldest to see it last night. Super action packed and in my theater very very loud! There were a few, what the heck moments,

 

like when Samuel Jackson's character pulled a handgun on a running down the runway fighter jet. Uh, really?

a few silly moments and for my taste too many one liners. It just because monotonous after a while. However all the action made up for it!

[pixar]

Took my oldest to see it last night. Super action packed and in my theater very very loud! There were a few, what the heck moments,

 

like when Samuel Jackson's character pulled a handgun on a running down the runway fighter jet. Uh, really?

a few silly moments and for my taste too many one liners. It just because monotonous after a while. However all the action made up for it!

 

Maybe he could shoot out all the tires? That could cause problems for the jet taking off.

[houseofmouse]

 

Maybe he could shoot out all the tires? That could cause problems for the jet taking off.

Riiigghhhtt...LOL!!!

[jsilkey]

I don't think Hubby and I have EVER seen a movie twice in the theater....but the day after we saw it (opening night) he said, "Let's go again!"......blockbuster is too soft of a word for how I think Avengers will do in the next month or so.

[cstephens]

I was amused by a tweet from someone I follow that I read the weekend before "The Avengers" came out: "The Avengers" is going to make "The Hunger Games" look like "John Carter".

[Ohthatjeff]

Took my oldest to see it last night. Super action packed and in my theater very very loud! There were a few, what the heck moments,

 

like when Samuel Jackson's character pulled a handgun on a running down the runway fighter jet. Uh, really?

a few silly moments and for my taste too many one liners. It just because monotonous after a while. However all the action made up for it!

 

He's a sharpshooter in the comics and the pistol is his perferred weapon of choice. He's one of the few people beside Hawkeye that could have hit fuel tank or the pilot from that range. It would have been his first instinct to pull out the handgun.