Song of the South?

[disneyscott]

How long has it been sence this movie has been released on VHS. It seems with eveyone now owning DVD players it would be time for this one but eveytime I ask about it, Disney doesnt have it listed for the upcomming year?

[Lani]

Disneyscott -- because there are elements of the movie that some consider unacceptably racist, I have read various sources that have said that Disney will probably never re-release this movie in the United States.

You will have to find a copy released overseas.

[merlinjones]

>>How long has it been sence this movie has been released on VHS. It seems with eveyone now owning DVD players it would be time for this one but eveytime I ask about it, Disney doesnt have it listed for the upcomming year?<<

"Song of the South" has been available on VHS or laser in just about every territory in the world at one time or another (currently it's on hiatus everywhere, I believe, since about two years ago).

But the film has never, ever been made available in the USA/Canada on home video in any format (it's last, very successful, domestic theatrical release was in 1986).

The reason for the film's supression is that it does not fit the politically correct agenda favored by current Disney Executives, the NAACP and Disney Board Member Sydney Poitier.

The film continues to be massively requested and has figured to bring in around 200 million dollars to the company with full promotion - - cash desperately needed by the stockholders.

But the illusion of social progress is seemingly more important than business, history, art or freedom of access these days.

[Ace]

When I was in Australia last, they showed Song of the South on the Disney Channel at 8:00 PM on a Saturday. I would have taped it but it's PAL there. As for the content, I didn't really think it was that offensive... but I also don't think that Grand Theft Auto is, either. It might be me.

[Bill Catherall]

I found a good essay written on the subject of racism in Song of the South.

In Defense of Walt Disney's Song of the South by Christian Willis

[merlinjones]

>>Disneyscott -- because there are elements of the movie that some consider unacceptably racist, I
have read various sources that have said that Disney will probably never re-release this movie in
the United States.<<

The movie is not racist, but a celebration of the storyteller... and the tale of a valuable friendship between a black man and a white boy and the bond they share in the world of imagination. It is a beautiful piece of art and promotes harmony between races.

Political correctness is fascism by a new name.

[stinkerbell]

We have a copy on VHS, thanks to our fairy godmother, that we received just before Christmas this year. My girls have watched it time and again. The first viewing, I sat with them and I had to answer some hard questions re: slavery. But I figure, the way to avoid repeating history is to learn from it. It still made me squeamish and I was uncomfortable breaking the news to my seven year old that once upon a time, people were not as socially appropriate as they are now. I had to point out that people were just plain WRONG, but that more people believed in fairness and equality and freedom......(Boy, when she figures out that racism hasn't gone away and that people still suck all over, that's another conversation!!!)

It was similar to a discussion I had with her re: Mulan. That discussion almost made me cry. Ugh, why do we have to explain to our daughters that people used to think females were far inferior to males??? And some still do?

They're valuable discussion to have, though. Tough as they are. I wish Song of the South would be released on VHS and DVD, but it doesn't seem like it will happen.

[Bill Catherall]

Actually, I don't think they were slaves in Song of the South. At one point in the movie Uncle Remus was going to leave. If he were a slave that wouldn't be allowed with out at least paying for his freedom. I'm thinking they were actually endentured servants.

But the odd thing is, I see nothing racist in the movie at all. I see harmony between races. I can't see what would make people ashamed of that movie.

[stinkerbell]

Okay, Bill, come explain "indentured servants" to my seven year old. No, she thought they were slaves, and I remember growing up thinking the same thing. The fact that she knew the word "slave" and knew a tiny bit of the history was fascinating and sad to me. To have this discussion with a seven year was bizarre and her eyes looked so confused and sad.

BUT like I said, I didn't shy away from this, we've watched the movie quite a few times this month and I still love it.

[Bill Catherall]

Originally posted by stinkerbell
Okay, Bill, come explain "indentured servants" to my seven year old.

Here's how I explained it to my 6 year old: "They work on the farm. They live on the farm. It just makes it easier that way."

[JeffG]

"Song of the South" is set during the post Civil War reconstruction era. Uncle Remus and the other servants would have been ex-slaves during the time period that the film takes place. This is pretty directly evidenced by the climax of the film, which is set in motion by Uncle Remus' decision to leave the plantation.

Having seen the film fairly recently (I have the imported laserdisc), I do think it is a good film with a very strong central performance by James Basket and some great musical and animated sequences. The Uncle Remus stories themselves still have quite a bit of meaning and are very much worth preserving.

The concerns about the film are not without some justification, though. It is very much a film of its time. Many of the characterizations are stereotypical in nature. More importantly, it very much tends to look at that era through rose colored glasses, essentially making plantation life seem much more pleasant than it really was. These elements, along with some of the various stylistic choices with the film, make it seem more dated than most of the other Disney films from the time when it was made. Even under the best of circumstances, this is likely a film with a limited market today.

If carefully handled, I definitely would be in favor of a legitimate domestic video/DVD release for the film. I think the marketing should be focused on the film's historical significance and the film should be accompanied by documentary content that places it into its proper historical perspective. The film would be a perfect fit for the "Disney Treasures" or "Vault Disney" DVD lines.

-Jeff

[zapppop]

I think some people are just sensative cry babies.
It's just a movie.
I doubt it will sit in a vault forever and fall apart.
Eventually, it'll be released.

In the meantime, just keep requesting it.

[Alex S.]

And I will point out that while the decision not to release the film in the United States is recent (in the last 15 years), the view among certain groups that this film has offensive elements is hardly new.

The film was protested well before it was even released, and there is documentation from internal to the Walt Disney Company that indicates many people within the company were not comfortable with the film.

Not justification for censoring the movie, but then it isn't censorship when Disney does it and they have shown themselves more than willing to provide copies of the film for research.

They just don't think it makes business sense to distribute it widely within the US.

[mad4mky]

Originally posted by Alex Stroup
And I will point out that while the decision not to release the film in the United States is recent (in the last 15 years),

This is true. As the last theatrical release was in 1986 or so. I took my oldest daughter to the theatre to see it around that time.

I am assuming a large uproar came about at this time, as Disney has pulled this out of circulation...as it seems, for good.

Not being a historian...I could be a year or so off on the last release.

[innerSpaceman]

Originally posted by JeffG
If carefully handled, I definitely would be in favor of a legitimate domestic video/DVD release for the film. I think the marketing should be focused on the film's historical significance and the film should be accompanied by documentary content that places it into its proper historical perspective. The film would be a perfect fit for the "Disney Treasures" or "Vault Disney" DVD lines.

What, are people too stupid to realize that not every movie was made after the year 2000? Even as a child, I could tell that some movies were made in the 30's and some were made in the 60's.

By all the rationale to censor Song of the South, such little-known films as Gone With the Wind would also never see the light of day again.

[Kuzcotopia]

Is the film racist?


Two words: Tar baby.


It might have been charming at the time, but MAN does it seem racist to me. I'm uncomfortable with the crows in Dumbo and the Indians in Peter Pan. But I'm chilled to think of the buck-and-wing in this film being shown to children without any historical perspective.

Remus o.s.:"BRER RABBIT 'LOW IT'S UP TO
HIM TO TEACH DE STUCK-UP
STRANGER SOME MANNERS, AN' HE
SAY ..."

Rabbit: "LOOK, IF YOU DON'T SAY
'HOWDY' TIME I COUNTS THREE,
I'S GOIN' BUS' YOU WIDE OPEN!"

Remus o.s.: "BUT DE TAR BABY HE DON'T SAY
NOTHIN' AN'..."

(from the complete script at www.songofthesouth.net)


Warner Brothers shouldn't release "Coal Black an' de Sebbin' Dwarfs" on dvd either.

http://us.imdb.com/Title?0035743

Say it's all in good fun and high-spirits all you like. Say that Walt was progressive, and we should remember our history.

But remembering history and selling it and profiting from it as a modern product in Blockbuster are two different things. Serious collectors can get copies from overseas sources on ebay. Academics can get copies from libraries or the Disney Archives.

I say don't make it a product, leave it in the archives.

[MammaSilva]

While I agree that Song of the South does have racial issues so do several 'great' movies I can think of, some of which have been mentioned...."I don't know nuthin bout birthin no babies Miss Scarlett" sound familiar anyone??????? And I did have a hard time explaining to my niece some of the side aspects of the movie.. such as the big house/shacks and a few other issues... the stories in the movie, Uncle Remus stories are the point and they are a part of our history, good or bad.. yeah it isn't a real version but what theatrical production is......does anyone REALLY believe that movies portray 'real life?" if you do let me hook you up to a mental health referal center....


Disney has decided for whatever reason to not release the movie in the States and it's their property and their choice.....do I agree with it, nope I would Love to own a digitally remastered DVD so that the sounds/music songs were wonderful but until the attitude changes I'll settle for my copy off a laser disc.

[Kuzcotopia]

For the record, I also think that Gone With the Wind shouldn't be shown to children either.

[mad4mky]

Originally posted by Kuzcotopia
For the record, I also think that Gone With the Wind shouldn't be shown to children either.

It's a classic.

I am all for showing children, of appropriate ages, classics. It is up to the parents to discuss and teach their children of errors, misrepresentations and such.

[MammaSilva]

I wish I had a photographic memory so I could give credit where credit is due and also to be sure I'm 'quoting' the exact quote here... but to cover all the bases I'll say this is a paraphrase of a famous quote ok..... those of us who do not learn from our history and past are doomed to repeat it.....

Am I proud that our country was founded on slavery NO, am I proud that racist attitudes abounded once upon a time in America, the 'home of the free' NO, it is reality...yes, unfortuantely it is. My children are mixed ethnic....Mexican/Anglo....my nieces children are mixed.... african american/Anglo....have times changed OH yeah they have... do they need to change more.. most definately.....but that does NOT change the past, nor the movies based on the past.....'not" showing our children those types of movies takes away the opportunity to point out the wrongs done to so many groups of Americans in the past starting with our Native Americans and moving right on down the line to the current day bias of Middle Eastern hertiage and of homosexuals.....

Movies are like a tool to teach our children of our past... good and bad and to help them learn the things they need to do to make a better tommorow..

[Alex S.]

That quote is from Santayanna (Harvard, around 1902, I believe). It is the second part of a longer thought and is generally misquoted and misunderstood.

I'll go find the full thing now.

But having said that, the intent behind the common understanding of the quote is not any more or less valid.

[Bill Catherall]

What's so racist about the tar baby scene? Is it because of the way they talk? That's doesn't have anything to do with race, but more to do with one's educational background and where they grew up.

There's nothing in Song of the South (or Gone With the Wind for that matter) that is inappropriate for children.

[cstephens]

I haven't seen "Song of the South" myself, but for those who have seen it and "Gone With the Wind" and "Birth of a Nation", can you give your opinion of the differences, as far as the racist aspects? I mention the two latter films because I know those and can then have a point of comparison. I know that people keep trying to ban "Birth of a Nation" as well, but I don't really understand that rationale. The film existed and was a ground-breaker for many reasons at the time of its release. And yes, it's also incredibly slanted and racist.

I agree that it's the job of the parents or the educator (whichever is relevant) to make sure that the kids who see these films understand them in their historical contexts.

[Kuzcotopia]

Well, we have two different opinions here. One is whether or not it's racist or perhaps to a lesser degree merely offensive or objectionable.

And the other opinion is that the past, warts-and-all shouldn't be kept from children's eyes.

Mommasilva, I'm all for you showing your children classic films and educating them in the context of the times they were made. I know you're going to do that in a consciencious manner. I say, go for it! It's a great lesson!

For people who don't think it's offensive, or question why I think the Tar Baby is offensive, well, it's a TAR baby. As in BLACK AS TAR. It's a joke about the blackness of people's skin. It's saying that the color black is the only discerning feature of a person's skin, such that you could make a lump of tar, and put a hat on it, and folks would mistake it for a black person. Now you might also make a joke about piling a bunch of refried beans up, and put a sombrero on it, and perhaps B'rer Conejo would mistake it for a Latino. I'm hoping that they also pile up a ton of wonder bread and stick a cowboy hat on it, just so I can know what it feels like!

But I don't think that this or any of my hypothetical films should be a source of new profit for the company, as I see that profit coming at the expense of teasing and worse. Remember, most of America's schools are still racially homogenous.

I remember when I was a child thinking that black people were somehow made of chocolate, and I remember being confused by a Little Rascal's short that showed Buckwheat sweating black "sweat", as if he was melting when sitting on a stove. I didn't understand that it was a joke. Nor did I know enough to be offended. I took it to be fact. And I find it hard to explain now as an adult how that could have been meant to be funny.

As racially-mixed as we are in California, most places in America aren't like that.

If Song of the South is released to be a big home-video hit, most white children will know the "Tar Baby" before they know a real black child. They will be able to mimic the buck-and-wing "Aaah sho doo lub me duz watahmellin' " "accent" before they learn "I have a dream."

[cutelittleartist]

Thank you Kuzcotopia!

I totally understand why some non-Black fans of the film do not see the film as racist. If you have not experienced the derogatory slang first hand, how would you know?

And if I hear someone say that people are to sensitive one more time. I'm going to scream!

Racism is still happening. When and if it stops, people of color won't be so 'sensitive.'

One would not tell a Jewish person he or she is being to sensitive over the Holocaust.

Slavery was the Black Holocaust. I don't know if any of you are familiar with the Middle Passage. This was not taught in most history books. There is a new estimate out stating that there may have been more African slaves killed on the way to America then those killed during the Holocaust.

For more info on the Middle Passage, please check out this link.



Middle Passage