Advice on child harnesses(?)

[Bobcat]

We're heading back to Orlando in a few weeks and are considering the use of a harness type restraint system to allow our son to walk around as opposed to being couped up constantly in a carriage.

I apologize for not knowing the technical name for them, but they almost look like dog collars or something similar. I'm quite sure most of you have seen parents "walking" the children at various theme parks.

On our last vist in December, our son was walking, but just as happy sitting in his carriage, now he won't sit still. A few years back and many visits before this one, we'd see parents with their kids leashed up and would say that we'd never do that, funny how things change :)

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Take care,
Bob

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally posted by Bobcat

I apologize for not knowing the technical name for them, but they almost look like dog collars or something similar.
My god, you are considering treating your child like a dog?!?! I'll hold my tongue on my full opinion of kiddie leashes, but might I suggest that you look at your own words and decide for yourself if that's something you really want to do to your kid.

[EandCDad]

I want to be careful on how I phrase this post. We have two daughters and have been taking them to DL since they were both babies. We have never considered the type of child harness you are talking about.

I understand that there is a desire to 1)keep your child safe and near you at all times 2)give you some peace of mind when you are in a large crowd. Child harnesses do offer that.

That said, our opinion has always been, that if we can't control our kids in public situations, we shouldn't be taking em out. I'm trying to make that not sound trite or easy, it wasn't. We wern't born with "lucky" children, who always obeyed. We have placed expectations on our children when we are at DL and other places and we provide consequences if we are not obeyed. Our children are not perfect (by ANY stretch) but we know that they will stay near us without being physically restrained.

My alternate suggestion to you is to use your arm as the "leash". That is, have the child hold your hand whenever he is out of the stroller. You haven't indicated that your son won't obey commands or walk holding your hand. If that works, I would think it is a far superior option.

Oh, and good luck, whatever you decide, I hope you have a great trip!

[Cadaverous Pallor]

More agreement here.

Whatever happened to holding hands? Not only does it keep your child near you, safe, etc, but it's a loving gesture. I have fond memories of holding my parents' hand. Do you think kids will remember their leashes lovingly?

What I've seen parents do to kids on leashes horrifies me:

Parents of kids on leashes pay less attention to their kids than others. They talk to others, look at the sights, and hardly look at their children. This is like not looking where you are driving because your car is equipped with air bags.

I've seen kids on leashes straining against them constantly, like anxious dogs on a walk. The parents don't see this.

I've seen parents that, on deciding to move on after a pause, YANK the kid in the direction they want to go, with barely a glance at them, never mind actually SPEAKING to them.

Do them a favor and hold their hand!

[Bobcat]

Thanks for your input, my current feeling is that we will, more likely than not, go without the child harness.

I will say, our son is 14 months and, while I'd love to be able to hold his hand and attempt to get him to walk along side of me or my wife, that won't happen. Oh, I'll try pretty hard, but my feeling is that he may be a bit too young to understand the concept of holding hands.

Please, don't misunderstand me, my intention was to never imply that we were attempting to treat our child like a dog, so Ghoulish Delight, if that's what you'd thought, please think again.

EandCDad, keep posting my friend, your comments are to the point and very well thought out.

Take care everyone,

Bobcat

[MouseWife]

Wow, EandCDad and Cadervous Pallor bring up quite wonderful points.

I know that you are thinking safety, and that is good.

But, this is a good time to actually, pardon this, train your child to stay next to you and to be careful themselves. They will learn how to 'maintain' themselves.

If you put them on a leash, they may try to 'get away' because of it. And, when it is off they will feel such freedom they might just run off and give you more trouble.

It is just best to keep constant attention of them. You are there for them to experience it, right? It won't be easy. But, the bright side is they will get tired from walking and then they will willingly go back into the stroller. Oh yeah, don't give up on the stroller. I used it to feed them in, for them to sleep in, to watch the parades in. Heck ya! Definitely bring snacks and tell them they don't get to eat them unless they are in the stroller. ;)

And, a nice blanket in the stroller will entice them back into it for naps.

Have fun what ever you do.

Oh, having them wear a nice bright shirt so that they stand out helps. Hubby also puts a business card either in a pocket or in the shoe with our hotel name, room number, phone number and our cell phone numbers and pager numbers. Ya never know. When they got bigger, we told them to give it to a security person or ride person if they got lost. But, it sounds like you have a way to go for that.

[Dlandmom]

Bobcat, wish I was going to be there with you!

While I agree with pretty much everything that's been posted here so far, here's what I did with my daughter.

My fear was that I would lose her in a crowd...call it paranoid, call it whatever you will...frankly, I was afraid I would let go of her and some mysterious stranger would sweep her away never to be seen again. I was just flat out nervous. I own one of those "harnesses, " but it was the type where you could take off the portion that goes around the torso and use it wrist to wrist, which is the part that I used. We only used it maybe 2-3 times at Disneyland until I felt comfortable that she wouldn't just run away from me if I wasn't being careful and attentive (which of course I wouldn't do intentionally, but being that it was usually just the two of us, I was afraid that when I was using my two hands to open or close the stroller, she wouldn't run into the path of someone else). That being said, she seems to now understand the importance of staying near me so that I don't lose her in a crowd and we haven't used it in ages (she may understand, but she doesn't always pay heed)...in fact I have no idea where it is. For the most part, she'll hold my hand when we're walking. Whether the wrist strap had anything to do with it, I doubt it. However, I did use it. Would I use it again?...if I have another child, and I'm the only adult with 2 kids, I'd probably use the wrist strap again for the first few times after she begins to walk.

I don't know...ask me again when and if I have another child!

[adriennek]

I think it depends on your child.

We used a harness with our older son. It was the right choice for us. Matthew is a 'spirited' child. The stroller wasn't keeping him contained. He also, frankly, got a little too "familiar" with Disneyland.

I'm seeing some generalizations being made here. Before Matthew could effectively communicate, holding hands wasn't always an option. If he didn't want to hold on, it became a power struggle for us. Children this age aren't always rational thinkers with whom we can discuss the importance of holding hands! And I did pay attention to what Matthew was doing when I had the harness on him.

Here are somethings I learned: there are two kinds of harnesses that I found. One has a velcro strip that can go around a wrist or the back of overalls ;) That one had an elastic strap. The wrist thing didn't work. The overall thing did but we didn't always have overalls.

The other kind of harness strapped around Matthew's torso but it wasn't elastic and was not as comfortable for Matthew or for us. So we took the elastic strap and attached it to the body harness. That was the best solution for us.

If your child is fine holding hands, that's fine. Matthew's energy level is not a reflection of good or bad parenting. It just is. And for awhile, from the time Matthew was 18 months to about 2 or so, harnesses were really good for us. Matthew liked having a little bit more freedom. When it didn't work, we didn't use it. You have to know your child. I never treated my child like a dog and I think that the people who know me would appreciate that.

I know two people who are friends but have polar opposite opinions on this issue. They agreed to disagree on it, but here's the point that I always appreciated from the mom who did not like harnesses: Diane would say that she didn't agree with them and would never use them, but Diane knew her friend was a DGM (damn good mom,) so if she used them, then it must have been for a good reason with a good approach. Many tools that parents use can be used positively or negatively. It's all in how you approach it.

Adrienne K

[Lani]

I am not a parent and don't play one on TV. That said, I've always thought that the child harness was one of the best inventions known to help parents. Maybe it's a cultural thing (I was raised in Japan) but I see absolutely nothing wrong with using child harnesses.

[lisap]

Whew...what an interesting thread. I'm glad I waited a few hours to post instead of shooting my mouth off :D

14 months is a wonderful but very difficult age in many ways--the whole walking, independant think is starting to hit with a vengence. I can see why many parents go the harness way for a while. And I'm not going to say someone is a bad parent for using one. I've learned the hard way about making hard and fast judgements about parenting before I've had a few of my own (my child? A Pacifier?? Never!!!! hehehe).

BUT....I still must agree with my hubby on the hand-holding thing. Parenting is partly about choosing your battles, and for us, this is one of them we choose to engage. Out kids were walking at nine months, and right from the get-go we worked on this--it was important to us.

Here's the thing. Even in a busy place like DL, there are places to let the little chitlins walk free in an enclosed area to give them some independant time. At Toontown, there is a circular bench area that works well, the balcony of the Disney Gallery, Big Thunder trail is usually pretty mellow. The point is, you can find places that are safe if you look.

I'm not as rabid on the subject as I used to be--even though we never considered using them, I know that parents just want to keep their children safe. If you decide to use a harness, don't worry about what other people think--it's none of their beeswax.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I want to clarify something here. I never believe that objects are evil. Leashes are not evil. It's what people do with them.

I know that if a truly good parent uses a leash, they would use it in a decent manner. But when I speak about what I see parents doing with leashes, I am just saying what I've been seeing (and whenever I see a leash, I tend to watch and see how child and parent are reacting). I worry that the behavior I see is caused by over-use of the leash and dependence on it. Only once out of every 10 times do I see parents using a leash in a good way - as a backup to hand-holding. If a parent is holding a child's hand and they have a leash attached, I have no problem with that. Heck, I would even be fine with a child on a leash walking alonside a parent, with the parent keeping an eye on them. But I'd estimate that 90 percent of the time, the child is in his own world and parent is in theirs, they're facing different directions and concentrating on different things, and over half the time the parent uses the leash to pull and drag the child where they want them to go.

Of course, this is only what I have witnessed. And I have never had my own child. My parents were the anti-pacifier type, and that's my influence here.

And as a closer, I am not trying to say you treated your kids badly if you used a leash. I'm sure you guys did fine by them. I know all this is a kid by kid, parent by parent basis. But this is definitely something I don't agree with.

[AVP]

Hi Bob,

I think there are about 5 topics that can ignite an instant spat on a Disney board - I applaud you for raising one of them! :D

As a non-parent, I have had limited experience with these, but I tend to fall on the pro-restraint side of the argument. I don't think they are an acceptable alternative to attentive parenting, and I have seen some pretty reprehensible actions on the part of parents who rely on them too much, but I think they are a tool that parents can use appropriately.

In one specific case, the child in question wanted to "explore" Adventureland, without having an adult holding his hand. Using the elastic restraint around his overall straps allowed him to "lead" me around the area, but I knew he couldn't run off. He was able to gain a little freedom, which was developmentally appropriate for his age, but I had the security of knowing he wasn't about to run into/over something.

I don't think they should be used as a way to control an older child who is otherwise unwilling to behave. I think they are a way to set a boundary for your younger child, and let them safely explore within that limit. Which, if you think about it, is what much of parenting is - setting limits, and letting your kids learn to act within them.

You've heard arguments from both sides, but *you* know yourself and your child best. Examine the practical considerations, make an informed opinion, then do what is best for your family.

AVP

[Not Afraid]

I am not a parent, just an Aunt of 18, so I've only experienced second hand the difficulties of keeping your children in tow.

I personally, am disturbed by seeing children on leashes. Right or wrong, I automatically think "oh, problem child". I guess I can see it as a last resort for a very energetic child. It is better than having the child run off. However, I can't help wonder how my parents and older siblings managed with their kids. No one in my family has used a leash and, believe me, none of us are the calm well behaved types (well, maybe just me). I guess I can think of the "leash for kids" concept as progress but I can't get beyond the disturbance I feel.

I reserve the right to change my opinion at any time due to pregancy.

[MouseWife]

Originally posted by Not Afraid

I reserve the right to change my opinion at any time due to pregancy.

Hello!!!!!

Clarify this please~ do you mean a current status or one that might happen in the future?????? :confused:

[Not Afraid]

Originally posted by MouseWife


Hello!!!!!

Clarify this please~ do you mean a current status or one that might happen in the future?????? :confused:

The later.

[MouseWife]

Whoa! You had me thinking about this trip to Paris, she is doing it now while it is early.............

You know that I think that you and that guy are very great people and would make very great parents. You have that demeanor about you that creates smart, cool kids.

Okay, so the Sunday Morning Breakfast Bunch may not be a good example of that but it does show that you have a very good sense of humor and self image. ;)

[MammaSilva]

I agree, any kid of those two would be lucky! wonderful parents that were excited to BE parents ....... and it would be CUTE!

[Not Afraid]

Thank you both sooooo much for those nice words. It will be great if it happens, but I'm not counting on anything - just doing the work;) . Believe me, I'll let everyone know if we hit a homer.

[MouseWife]

:p :p :p :p :p


Well, if you have to call it 'work'..............

And you can keep the batting average to yourself, thank you very much!!! :eek:

{Just let us know when it is a homer, or a marge, or whatever!}

[Bobcat]

to all that have posted an honest opinion up to this point.
In reading all of the previous posts (parents and possible future parents alike) Two comments from previous posts somewhat summed up my feelings:


In one specific case, the child in question wanted to "explore" Adventureland, without having an adult holding his hand. Using the elastic restraint around his overall straps allowed him to "lead" me around the area, but I knew he couldn't run off. He was able to gain a little freedom, which was developmentally appropriate for his age, but I had the security of knowing he wasn't about to run into/over something. - AVP

and

I want to clarify something here. I never believe that objects are evil. Leashes are not evil. It's what people do with them. - Cadaverous Pallor

The reason I singled out these two comments is because our son is very, very "exploratory" right now, our thoughts were that this would in fact allow him to explore locations, yet be perfectly within our restraints. Also, I've been horrified at times to see parents use the child harness as some type of disciplinary measure.

I could go on all night about the posts that were are for AND against. As always, they were all well stated and well thought out.

My wife and I were out and about yesterday and ventured in to a childrens store (The Right Start), she picked one up, started talking about it, and decided against it, THIS TIME. Fortunately we'll have additional adult supervision on this vacation that'll give us an extra few pairs of eyes. This being our 16th or so time (2nd with Cam) we pretty much have an idea of where he'll be able to gain an extra amount of freedom so to speak. That's how we're going to approach it.

Once again, thanks!

Bob

ps..Dlandmom (I miss our chats) we MAY be shooting to head back down in November/December, interested? Also, if my beloved Bruins win the Stanley Cup , I may need a month to recover!

BTW...the knee's awesome, playing hockey again, e-mail me this week

GO B's!

[SoCalSnowWhite]

I'd say it's a matter of personal opinion. I personally wouldn't use it on my son, but then again he sits still in his stroller. If you think you'd feel uncomfortable using it, which sounds like you might, then I'd say consider the stroller. Maybe go for a few trial runs with the harness and the stroller to see which is better for you and him.

[AVP]

I was actually surprised that we didn't see more of these in France. Parents in most of Europe, the stereotypical English Nanny with her Pram aside, use strollers less than American parents.

(Of course, that is a huge generalization, and we did see strollers everywhere, but nowhere near the stroller density you experience in the US parks.)

What we did see were lots of parent carrying their children - those framed kid backpacks were everywhere! And, of course infants were in strollers. But kids who could walk were generally expected to! Maybe it comes from living with a subway system, which makes it hard to lug a stroller up and down stairs.

AVP

[HBTiggerFan]

OK,
Each parent knows their kid best and whats best for their kidlet and make their decisions based on that.

Wether I am for or against harnesses is a moot point, but all I ask, is if you do use a harness please do NOT do what I witnessed 2 weekends ago...

A kidlet of about 1.5/2 was running around with a wrist harness, the kidlet cut infront of me while trying to pull it off her wrist. She was successful and began following her parents until another group cut inbetween them nad she was seperated. Her parents never turned around :confused: until she started crying. This was over a 2 minute period.

[Lanc2000]

We have a five year old, who is very excited and we know will run ahead of us to a certain extent. When she was little (and we will continue) We went to Bush Gardens, Sesame Street, Etc. She wore a little box on her shorts - kind of like a locator - that would beeb if she got about 15 - 20 feet away from us. We had a box on our belt as well. It was wonderful, with out restraints. Also, We laminate an index card with information such as cell phone, room number, or intinerary for the day, so that is God forbid, something happens, we can be located and reunited. Hope this helps

[WildGrits]

My second child was very spirited also. Thankfully harness are not what they were when I was young. There are many types. There is the wrist to wrist, the child fanny pak to wrist, and the old fashion to wrist. I use to the the wrist to wrist one at the airports.

Although I dont think that they would be very good at WDW for the plain fact that I would hate to trip another guest with it. Our Houdini just spent alot of time on my shoulders.

And just a note about holding hands. Just how long do you think it would be comfortable to stand with YOUR hand being held above your head. I can bet that in theory it sounds good, but in reality it can become very painful.:crying: