Hi everyone. Was I the only one to catch this little claim from the FEb 15th update?

“As was first noted here, the attractions he would like to update are Pirates of the Caribbean, Haunted Mansion, Jungle Cruise, it's a small world, and Space Mountain. The scale and scope of the proposed updates is really something WDI has not attempted before, without simply tearing out an attraction and starting over with a new idea.”

Sorry, but Westcoaster.net broke this rumor about a week, or at least a few days, before Mouseplanet did. For someone who claims to check and recheck his sources, I'm surprised Al let this little detail "slip" through.

I think he was refering to the first news report on Mouseplanet.

And hey guys, we're all in this together. Who cares who breaks news first as long as the group as a whole benefits from it.

-Don

Originally posted by dcadon
And hey guys, we're all in this together. Who cares who breaks news first as long as the group as a whole benefits from it.

Apparently MousePlanet does, otherwise they wouldn't copyright their own reports.

Don't forget to pay, err, donate for Al's update either.

I guess something has to pay for his churro 'research'.

Originally posted by mrcoffee
Don't forget to pay, err, donate for Al's update either.

I guess something has to pay for his churro 'research'.

Um, that's very clever and funny and all that, but the fact is, running a website isn't free. Do you think the domain costs just fell out of the sky and on to the laps of MousePlanet staffers?

Originally posted by rightofcenter
Hi everyone. Was I the only one to catch this little claim from the FEb 15th update?

“As was first noted here, the attractions he would like to update are Pirates of the Caribbean, Haunted Mansion, Jungle Cruise, it's a small world, and Space Mountain. The scale and scope of the proposed updates is really something WDI has not attempted before, without simply tearing out an attraction and starting over with a new idea.”

Sorry, but Westcoaster.net broke this rumor about a week, or at least a few days, before Mouseplanet did. For someone who claims to check and recheck his sources, I'm surprised Al let this little detail "slip" through.

Maybe Al doesn't read westcoaster.net and got the information from one of his contacts. Perhaps he didn't know that any other site had broken the news first. It's certainly no reason to indict him, although I think a small correction in the next update wouldn't be out of line.

Originally posted by marron-cream
Um, that's very clever and funny and all that, but the fact is, running a website isn't free. Do you think the domain costs just fell out of the sky and on to the laps of MousePlanet staffers? Thanks, I thought it was clever too..

I was pointing out the fact that for most web sites that post Disney information (laughingplace.com, westcoaster.net, disneygeek.com, screamscape.com, to name but ]4 ) don't do that. I'm sure they have quite high operating costs, too.

And most of those (except for disneygeek.com) don't open a new advertisement 99.5% of the time I click on a link.. Even in mousepad.mouseplanet.com).. It's been better lately, but it's annoying.

But then again, they don't have the expose' on churro carts, so hey, whatever.


[Moderator's note: vB code fixed for quoted material. -- Lani]

Originally posted by mrcoffee


I was pointing out the fact that for most web sites that post Disney information (laughingplace.com, westcoaster.net, disneygeek.com, screamscape.com, to name but ]4 ) don't do that. I'm sure they have quite high operating costs, too.

And most of those (except for disneygeek.com) don't open a new advertisement 99.5% of the time I click on a link.. Even in mousepad.mouseplanet.com).. It's been better lately, but it's annoying.

But then again, they don't have the expose' on churro carts, so hey, whatever.


I agree that the ads are annoying, especially considering they're the same ads that I see on the tops of the pages.

But MP isn't forcing you to give them money. They're just saying that if you feel the information was worth it, then go ahead an donate. It's not like your arm is being twisted. The Amazon thing isn't half as prominent or in-your-face as those ads are.

I totally agree. I'm just pointing out the fact that Al has that at the bottom of every update. Not a link on his page, not once a month, but every update.. And only his update.

Thomas

Originally posted by mrcoffee
I totally agree. I'm just pointing out the fact that Al has that at the bottom of every update. Not a link on his page, not once a month, but every update.. And only his update.

Thomas

Oh. I tend to only read Al's updates or David's stuff (basically just anything that pertains to DL). I never recalled seeing the link on David's articles, but I figured it was probably on other pages. But since you say it's not, I don't know what else to say, so I will concede defeat to you :D

Of course, I'm a liar. :)

I noticed that the amazon.com link is at the bottom of the WDW update that's currently on the homepage..

I looked at a few older updates, such as the current update of pictures from WDW resorts, and it's not there.. I also checked out the TRON review, nope, not there either.

So maybe it's hit or miss? {shrug}

It's a tie.

:D

Originally posted by Uncle Dick


Maybe Al doesn't read westcoaster.net and got the information from one of his contacts. Perhaps he didn't know that any other site had broken the news first. It's certainly no reason to indict him, although I think a small correction in the next update wouldn't be out of line.

If he offers a correction, naming Westcoaster by name as the site who had the information first, fine. However, I don't see that happening anytime soon. I know for a fact that Al hasn't listed (or even acknowledged) sites in the past that aren't alligned with MP, even when directly asked. If he corrects himself and actually points to the correct site, it'll be a first. It'll be great if he does, since it'll really help his credibility, but again, I don't see it happening.

As far as Al not knowing about, or not reading Westcoaster, again, I don't buy that as a valid excuse. It doesn't take long to click around the net and check out the information that your competition is running. And remember, Al boasts that he checks and rechecks his information/sources before he posts something. I know some errors can get through (and often do), but something like that isn't too hard to check out.

Whatever. I think you're making a rather big deal out of a quote that is somewhat nebulous. He didn't exactly come out and say "The story about the enhanced 50th anniversary attractions, which was first broken by Mouseplanet" or anything to that extent. And again with Al's "source checking". I don't see what that has to do with anything. You agree that Al's story was accurate. Does it somehow lose credibility because Al didn't report it first? And who says Al has to check every little Disney fansite that pops up? There are a whole lot of em, ya know. But I guess Al bashing is in vogue these days...

I also find it very interesting that you have registered quite recently and then proceeded to 1) complain about MP's speed and 2) question Al's credibility. Hmmmmm..... ;)

Who knows, maybe I am making a big deal out of nothing. I ask you this though, is anything I've stated in my above post inacurrate? I don't think it is. I'm simply calling him out on a few things, that's all. In the long run though, this certainly isn't a big deal.

If you wish to believe that somehow my credibility needs to be questioned simply because I came here and chose to not gush about MP, that's ok too. However, I've been reading the site for quite a long time, and have become very used to Al's patterns (again, as I stated above). I'm simply just speaking up a little.

He likes to post rumors as fact (or at least to as close to fact as one can get), and the MP readers just take it at face value. All I'm doing is presenting a little opposition - calling him out on it, as it were.

Ya, Al bashing is in vogue right now. However, Al's continual bash on everything in site as been the way of things for as long as I can remember (regardless if it's warranted or not, although sometimes it certainly is). If he wants to dish it out, I certainly hope he can take it in return. It just seems that more and more people are catching on to the tone of things in his updates, and maybe no longer taking things at face value. Like me, they're just calling him out on it.

rightofcenter,

If you have factual issues with things written here, that is fine. We'll deal with them as we can. Know, though, that Al doesn't read MousePad. So if you want him to do something then I suggest you email him directly.

We are ok with a certain level of opposition to MousePlanet on MousePad. However, if it is your only reason for being here, then we do ask that you move on. Or get your own venue (perhaps you already have one?).

You have 7 posts to MousePad, all of which are asking about or pointing out what you feel to be flaws with MousePlanet and MousePad. It is ok for you to not want to be a part of our community; but we don't really need people hanging around telling us how much they don't want to be part of it.

Originally posted by Alex Stroup
rightofcenter,

If you have factual issues with things written here, that is fine. We'll deal with them as we can. Know, though, that Al doesn't read MousePad. So if you want him to do something then I suggest you email him directly.

We are ok with a certain level of opposition to MousePlanet on MousePad. However, if it is your only reason for being here, then we do ask that you move on. Or get your own venue (perhaps you already have one?).

You have 7 posts to MousePad, all of which are asking about or pointing out what you feel to be flaws with MousePlanet and MousePad. It is ok for you to not want to be a part of our community; but we don't really need people hanging around telling us how much they don't want to be part of it.
I have to totally agree with Alex on this one. It seems this thread is one big MP bashing AND an advertisement for other unofficial Disney sites. Let's move on.

Originally posted by Alex Stroup
rightofcenter,

If you have factual issues with things written here, that is fine. We'll deal with them as we can. Know, though, that Al doesn't read MousePad. So if you want him to do something then I suggest you email him directly.

I've done that, and haven't received a response. Ya, I know...he's busy. However, if I were being called out on something like this, and received a direct email about it, I would answer the opposition as soon as I possibly could - ESPECIALLY as the leader of this site, and the author of the column. But, that's just me. I think I know what's going to happen though. My email will appear on the next issue of Ask Al, and he'll remark. At best, he'll defend himself (obviously. I would too); at worst, he'll make a flippant remark without even dealing with the issue. I know I've seen that plenty of times. Not answering his email directly, and not reading the boards seems like a pretty safe way to deal with a little opposition. You don't have to directly debate anybody, just pick and chose what emails you like and post them to the website.

We are ok with a certain level of opposition to MousePlanet on MousePad. However, if it is your only reason for being here, then we do ask that you move on. Or get your own venue (perhaps you already have one?).

I do not have my own.

You have 7 posts to MousePad, all of which are asking about or pointing out what you feel to be flaws with MousePlanet and MousePad. It is ok for you to not want to be a part of our community; but we don't really need people hanging around telling us how much they don't want to be part of it.

It sounds more like you don't want people making valid points about inaccuracies in a column, hanging around to defend their reasons for bringing it up, and expecting a response from the author. I haven't once stated something like MP sucks, make any personal attacks, or anything of the sort. That's not my style. I'm not that kind of a person. I simply presented a little opposition about a claim that I had a problem with. I've emailed Al, and presented to the discussion boards. In both areas, I've received nothing even approaching a simple "We understand how that claim my have been misinterpreted. Here's what was really meant..." from anyone on staff.

If I remember the community rules correctly, I don't recall a rule about a positive post/opposing post quota. Maybe I missed something? Ya, I've made 7 posts, and none of them have been neutral. I understand that. However, as a long time reader (since the D-I-G was posted on a.d.d. and there wasn't any MP), I've noticed that the inaccuracy of Al's columns has become so blatant lately, that I'm very surprised Disney legal hasn't tried to hold him liable for his statements. Not to mention the rising bitterness that's been all over his articles and the overall self-important tone. As a long time reader, I decided to finally say something, and see if MP has any legs to stand on. Is it alarming to anyone that there might be a reason why I finally took the time to say something, after all this time?

I believe to have presented a very calm, rational, and intellectual opposition. Maybe that's what's so scary. Someone who's fed up with Al's habit of passing off inaccuracies as fact isn't a raving, loony, Disney addict. Instead, I'm someone with a cool head, and a decent presentation.

Speaking of this thread only, as I did get a very valid response to my other concern (thank you for that), I've noticed that not one staff member has presented any back-up to what the article was trying to say. It’s been a few days now. I’m realistic. I don’t expect an overnight solution. However, nothing has been mentioned, and when I do get a response, I'm asked to leave or start backing down and being more positive.

I would've hoped that with such an extensive staff, that someone would have been able to defend Al and what he claimed. Heck, it probably wouldn't have taken very long either, and this whole issue could be a non issue. It could very well be that Al made a simple mistake, or his thoughts on the issue didn't come across as clearly as he had hoped. If my email was responded too, or if someone would've been able to say that right away, a lot of this discussion could've been prevented.

I'll leave. That's fine. You don't have to worry about me anymore. However, I leave with a very telling image of what MP is really all about, and the image is pretty pathetic. I see now that MP isn't willing to defend the claims of their most popular column, even something as trivial as this. Could it be worse? Could it be that the MP staff feels that they don't need to defend anything on the site, as if MP is the end-all-be-all of Disney web sites? I certainly hope not.

I'll wait to see what happens in the next Ask Al. At this point, I’m expecting to be blown off with some sort of flippant response. Maybe I’ll actually be surprised and get something a little concrete, especially on such a minor issue.

As for this long-time reader, you have your wish. I will leave. No more clicks, no more page views, no more ad revenue, and no more expectations of a simple answer to a rather simple question.

How's this for an answer from a staff member:

Until this thread I had never heard of Westcoaster.net. Therefore I have no idea what they wrote when in relation to what Al wrote.

I would be happy to look into your claim but you have not provided any information to allow me to do it. Please point me to what you believe is Al's first mention of the whatever you are concerned with and to what you believe is Westcoaster's first publishing of the same information.

I make no promise as to what anybody will do with the information. As said in another thread, we have no obligation to respond, though hopefully we will in a way that can satisfy you.

I also didn't ask you to leave. I asked you to think about your goal here and if it wasn't to be a member of the community but rather a commentator upon the community then to please go elsewhere. Right now it is up to you to decide whether to leave.

But you won't see this because we aren't getting any more page views from you, are we?

I've been coming to MP for a looooong time now, and as you'll see from the number of posts I've made, I don't come here for the community. I just come here to read the articles.

That is, I used to. Don't really come by much anymore, except to read the threads in this section to get a feel for what direction MP is headed in. I was hoping I'd hear that you'd take the constructive criticism to be found here and do something with it; instead what I'm reading is that you don't want to hear it.

Look - I could just leave. But I feel like after coming here so frequently for so long, it would be wrong to just leave without letting you know why. If you don't want to hear it, then well, that just makes me feel better about leaving.

I'm disappointed with the slowing of the output of the articles. I'm disappointed with the way many queries as to why this was happening were shrugged off. I'm disappointed that the number of strongly voiced columnists has dropped, leaving us mainly with Cranky Al.

I can't speak for anyone else, but that's why you're not getting as much traffic from me. Just in case one of you actually cares.

Originally posted by PEZaddict

I'm disappointed with the slowing of the output of the articles. I'm disappointed with the way many queries as to why this was happening were shrugged off. I'm disappointed that the number of strongly voiced columnists has dropped, leaving us mainly with Cranky Al.


I've noticed that Al's output has dropped proportionately to the rest of the output. I don't think you're hearing any more or less of him than before. As far as I know, David Koenig and Kevin Yee are still around to offer their own opinions. I counted the last 40 new articles posted to Mouseplanet. Of them, only 5 were written by Al and 3 others contained a paragraph or two from him. That hardly constitutes "mainly".

I agree that the drop in output is disappointing, but Mouseplanet still seems to be updated more often than any other Disney sites I've seen out there.

Originally posted by PEZaddict
I was hoping I'd hear that you'd take the constructive criticism to be found here and do something with it; instead what I'm reading is that you don't want to hear it.

Hi Pez,

Actually, I did try to get a feel for who posted what on which date as far as the 50th Anniv. goes in order to address rightofcenter's concerns. A quick review showed at least 3 mentions by Al and at least 2 by westcoaster. But I saw right away that each update (by both gentlemen) gave different information each time. All on different dates too.... :confused:

Rightly, Alex asked rightofcenter to please post exactly what information he felt was duplicated by Al -- it's hard to make a judgment call until we know what ROC was referring to. However, from what I could see, both websites have posted the information with different viewpoints, which is appropriate as each website has a different audience and purpose.

I'm disappointed with the slowing of the output of the articles. I'm disappointed with the way many queries as to why this was happening were shrugged off. I'm disappointed that the number of strongly voiced columnists has dropped, leaving us mainly with Cranky Al.

As far as server stuff and number of articles goes, we've answered these questions over and over and over. It's going to take a bit of time to fix the server speed issue and I hope that you can bear with us as we resolve this problem. And as Uncle Dick has pointed out, it just looks like the proportion of the articles (trip planning vs. inside info stuff) has changed. It's actually still the same.

I can't speak for anyone else, but that's why you're not getting as much traffic from me. Just in case one of you actually cares.

We care. But know that generally we don't step in and join these types of discussions. Differing opinions are fine with us. Sometimes a moderator will step in if someone seems to be veering over the line in terms of community standards. But, rightofcenter is certainly free to keep posting.

I hope you stay with us. It's good to have differing viewpoints -- it certainly keeps the discussions lively! ;)

Sheila