Disney Seas...I'm gonna hurl...

[Lani]

Originally posted by MMFan
The comparison of JJ at TDS and JJ at DCA makes me think of those before-and-after pictures, the ones showing a person bald and then with a full head of hair, or the ones showing the before-and-after differences caused by liposuction or a big facelift, including a significant nose jobYeah... seeing the comparison shots of the Jumpin' Jellyfish attraction in the two parks was a real eye-opener for me. While I thought the Tokyo version was nice, seeing them compared like that actually made me gasp and grimace. The pictures really speak for themselves.

[Doodle Duck]

...gasping and grimaceing..*sputter*...spit...I think when I first saw tha comaparison I must have looked looked like ******lio.
Jolting.

EDIT:
The word so adroitly edited above by the robotic censor was c.o.r.*.h.o.l.i.o.
Whoopie.

[disneyhead]

When comparing the two different JJ you have to remember that in Japan they were trying to make an undersea environment where you are actually riding on jellyfish and sea shells. In DCA they wanted it to look like a seaside amusment park ride. Fantasy vs. realism. DCA is based in realism and I feel they achieved it in some portions of the park. My big beef is where they really cheaped out ("Make grandma wiat in the rain for 'Steps in Time', the show will be so good she will forget she is soaked to the bone. We don't need a clean room for the projectors in Sorin', they will think the dust flecks are birds, We don't need restrooms in the Hyperion Theatre, there are some right across the street. And so on...)

[JimG]

I do indeed agree that Disney Seas looks terrific and, unfortunately, shames Disney's California Adventure park. From the information and vivid photographs that document Disney Seas (not just on MousePlanet, but various other sources..), I concur that American Disney fans are being greatly shortchanged by having Disney California Adventure (DCA) as the companion park to Walt's Disneyland. Disneyland, when it opened, was most highly innovative for its time, while DCA is, at best, a second-class Disney park; actually, I'd rank Animal Kingdom at WDW above DCA as far as "imagination" and "atmosphere" are concerned.

What happened to Michael Eisner*? He was the executive who encouraged and gave the green light to DL's Splash Mountain, and to the WDW version of same. Splash Mountain was/is a simply wonderful atmospheric "Disney" attraction, capturing the classic "Disney feel". However, afterwards, we got the very marginal DL "New Tomorrowland", and now, DCA, a very marginal companion park to DL.

Disneyland *should* have had a companion park on the equal to Tokyo Disney Seas, and I sincerely feel that most Disney fans, and even the general public who visit the park, realize this.

Jim

*P.S., I find that Michael Eisner's sensitivity to "Disney quality" plummeted after the untimely death (April, 1994) of Frank Wells. Frank was a proponent of the Disney parks, and an intellectual/philosophical counterbalance to Eisner.

[Doodle Duck]

"*P.S., I find that Michael Eisner's sensitivity to "Disney quality" plummeted after the untimely death (April, 1994) of Frank Wells. Frank was a proponent of the Disney parks, and an intellectual/philosophical counterbalance to Eisner."



Couldn't agree more...and your 'take' that it was a 'sensitivity to Disney Quality' was right on the money IMHO. Wells had the visionary ability, he was the 'actor'..Eisner, the 're-actor'. As an 'actor' E. falls a bit short. Didn't help when the Big K moved over to Dreamworks either.

[merlinjones]

>>When comparing the two different JJ you have to remember that in Japan they were trying to make an undersea environment where you are actually riding on jellyfish and sea shells. <<

That's why we like it. It takes us out of the dull everyday and into an escapist world, as popular Disney entertainment has always done.

>>In DCA they wanted it to look like a seaside amusment park ride. Fantasy vs. realism. DCA is based in realism and I feel they achieved it in some portions of the park.<<

How do you "achieve realism" when it already exists? Is this what passes for accomplishment?

I put up a steel rod with paint! Congratulations, you've really acheived the look of a steel rod with paint! What remarkable, utter realism!

Too bad they were only able to achieve this "in some portions of the park", as you say. :confused:

[Lani]

Originally posted by disneyhead
When comparing the two different JJ you have to remember that in Japan they were trying to make an undersea environment where you are actually riding on jellyfish and sea shells. In DCA they wanted it to look like a seaside amusment park ride. Fantasy vs. realism. DCA is based in realism and I feel they achieved it in some portions of the park.That's definitely true to a certain extent, disneyhead, but I think the bigger picture here is that DCA was perhaps designed with a carnival environment because they found that that was much cheaper than creating an immersive illusion.

"Hey, this is pretty good... for a TV dinner" just does NOT compare with a four-course meal at a fine restaurant.

[disneyhead]

I'm not saying that I like realism, it's just that what it is. I'm wondering who thought that someone would pay $43 for a Disney konck-off, when you can get the real thing for free. Also I think that Disney's no longer understand thier demographic. People don't go to a Disny theme park for realism, they go for escapist fantasy. I undersatand they were taking a creative risk, but I would rather them stick with what they do best.

[TokyoInsider]

Originally posted by disneyhead
People don't go to a Disny theme park for realism, they go for escapist fantasy. I undersatand they were taking a creative risk, but I would rather them stick with what they do best.

I think you hit the nail on the head with that one. As for Tokyo DisneySea, it should be noted that OLC was not(is not) taking a creative risk, but a financial one instead. Case in point, when I first heard to the Tokyo DisneySea project many years ago, I thought it would be a blatant rip-off of Tokyo Disneyland. After all...

TDS had a carousel. TDL has a carousel.
TDS has Sinbads. TDL has Its a Small World
TDS has Flounder's Fish Coaster. TDL has Gadgets Go Coaster
TDS has Mermaid's Lagoon. TDL has Fantasyland.
TDS has The Whirlpool. TDL has Alice's Teacups.
TDS has Magic Lamp Theater. TDL has MicroAdventure (Honey, I shrunk the audience)
TDS has a fortress you can explore. TDL has a castle you can tour.
TDS has the electric railway. TDL has Western River Railroad.
TDS has Transit Steamers. TDL has Mark Twain.

The word is that early on, people in Walt Disney Imagineering were not in favor of having so many attractions similar in type between both parks, but OLC was insistant on NOT taking creative risk- they wanted MORE of what worked, (and as befits many Japanese companies these days) and were afraid to really stick their necks out and experiment with a radically new concept.

But the reality of it is that Tokyo DisneySea works well, in large part to the people in WDI trying desperately to give OLC what they wanted (more of the same), but in new and creative ways. With their design, Tokyo DisneySea did not become a rip-off of it's sister park. Far from it, it has become a perfect compliment to it. TDL is heavily stacked in favor of attractions, and has very nice theming, too. TDS is heavily stacked in favor of theming, and has very nice attractions, too.

Whereas Tokyo Disneyland is about escapist fantasy into a world that never existed, Tokyo DisneySea is escapist fantasy into real lands (foreign, NOT domestic)and eras. (The sole exception being Mermaid's Lagoon, but even that works, because it has been taken almost entirely indoors. ).

Perhaps the problem with DCA is that the planners didn't think that having similarities with Disneyland would be advantageous. Remember, this is the same company that thought OLC was nuts for wanting to 'repeat' attractions at TDS. The truth is, done with enough money, good design, and good old fashioned Disney-style over-the-top detailing, people would be satisfied in ANY park- no matter that it is right across the way from Disneyland.

[Disney Deadhead]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MMFan


I used the example of colleges/universities as but just [B]one area where people will discuss the differences, similarities and quality of things. And since this is a board dealing with theme parks and Disney theme parks in particular, you're going to find discussions about the differences, similarities and quality of...theme parks! [QUOTE]

I understand that people on a Disney park board will compare the various qualities or lack thereof of various Disney theme parks. I enjoy it doing that myself, which is why I'm here. What I do not understand is why rather than simply showing how nice TDS is, the pictures on this site must be accompanied by trash talk about another park which in fact is not terrible and which even shares some of the same flaws as the new wonderful one. And why do people who might just enjoy DCA suddenly decide that since TDS exists, what existed before must be automatically worthless? For that matter, why do they think that because DL is wonderful that DCA is worthless? DL is wonderful, DCA is fun, bottom line. DCA is not as as cool as DL, but so what? It's a very pleasant way to spend a day.

Let me speculate as to what might have happened on this site if the internet had existed when WDW opened. I'm old enough to remember when it did.

This site would have posted pics of the hotels, the wide open spaces, the total environment of WDW. But they would have been accompanied by pics of run down motels, sleazy liquor stores, and hookers parading down Harbor Blvd in Anaheim. Disneyland would have been lambasted here when epcot opened. Where are all the AA's in Anaheim??? Why did Florida get epcot and we get Mickey banging on a bass drum?

Just because a possibly superior park opens does not mean that a prior park loses all of it's positive attributes.

Comparing parks is part of what goes on here; I have no problem with that. What I do object to is leaving comparison behind for the embracing of unhealthy hysteria.

These are not universities we are discussing, this is not our future. They are theme parks, and some will be better than others. Some you may not enjoy. But the bizarre vilification that goes on here is unexplainable to any rational person.

[Disney Deadhead]

Originally posted by JRob2k1


Im going to DisneySeas in the Spring. I'm going to have an amazing time!! See you there???

As for taking this discussion seriously..yes I do!! I LOVE Disney, but keep it on the down-low in my personal life. Here I can rant on and on, because its JUST a discussion board. I'm having fun being WAY TOO SERIOUS!! If you dont like it, then maybe you're being way too serious.

If something means a lot to somebody, but not as much as you..Dont try and put them "down" because you dont feel that way.

Oh wait...Was that too serious???

Relax, Im kidding!!!:cool:

-JRob

I'm glad to see you have a sense of humor about these things.

I would love to visit TDS, but since I can do almost everything they offer right here in Vegas or a few hours away in Anahem at a much cheaper cost with smaller crowds, I probably won't until I have some other reason to visit Japan.

[wtg2000]

>Remember, this is the same company that thought OLC was nuts for wanting to 'repeat' attractions at TDS.

Interesting. WDW-MK just opened Aladdin which looks very much like Dumbo.

DCA has two 3-D movies with special effects, and one at DL.

Body Wars uses the same cabin as Star Tours.

World Showcase has two 360 movies, and MK has (had) one.

Repetition is certainly nothing new. It's been done before. (isn't that irony?)

:)

[Kuzcotopia]

Originally posted by Disney Deadhead


I would love to visit TDS, but since I can do almost everything they offer right here in Vegas or a few hours away in Anahem at a much cheaper cost with smaller crowds, I probably won't until I have some other reason to visit Japan.


That should be the new slogan for Tokyo Disney Sea:

Just like Vegas, but without the hookers!


;-)


-Kuzcotopia

[MMFan]

Disney Deadhead wrote: What I do not understand is why rather than simply showing how nice TDS is, the pictures on this site must be accompanied by trash talk about another park which in fact is not terrible and which even shares some of the same flaws as the new wonderful one.

As I wrote in my previous message, I'd rather not have photos of DCA intermingled with shots of TDS, but mainly because the latter makes the former look so lousy. As for comparing two different things, praising one and dissing the other, have you ever read a lot of newspaper or magazine reviews of movies, TV shows, books, restaurants, Broadway plays? Have you ever read Dear Abby or home improvement columns in the real estate section? And I won't even mention all the reviews (although some would use the word "analysis") of different politicians and the policies and governmental programs they're either creating or promoting.


And why do people who might just enjoy DCA suddenly decide that since TDS exists, what existed before must be automatically worthless? For that matter, why do they think that because DL is wonderful that DCA is worthless? DL is wonderful, DCA is fun, bottom line. DCA is not as as cool as DL, but so what? It's a very pleasant way to spend a day.

Using the analogy in one of my other messages, I'll just say that TDS seems like an HDTV set (widescreen, even) to me, while DCA is more like a regular TV, perhaps even a black-and-white one that on some days has a fuzzy picture and a problem with horizontal control. Envision how these 2 kinds of TVs would be reviewed, by a customer at Best Buy or a writer working for Consumer Reports.


But they would have been accompanied by pics of run down motels, sleazy liquor stores, and hookers parading down Harbor Blvd in Anaheim.

A lot of books written about Walt Disney and his company have mentioned the honky-tonk condition of Anaheim and how Disney wasn't happy about it. So much so, it's supposedly one of the primary reasons he turned his attention to Florida.


Comparing parks is part of what goes on here; I have no problem with that. What I do object to is leaving comparison behind for the embracing of unhealthy hysteria.

You must never hear (or read) some of the hot and furious debates that take place on any given day among sports fans, video game fans, movie buffs, political junkies, fashion mavens (ever hear the sniping that regularly takes place among women who are discussing the clothes worn by other women?), girlwatchers or boywatchers (ever hear the sniping that sometimes takes place among the 2 sexes as to what they like or don't like in the opposite sex, or why a current S.O. or spouse is better than the previous one?), and so on, and so forth.


But the bizarre vilification that goes on here is unexplainable to any rational person.

I think to an outsider looking into many debates taking place among fans of any number of hobbies or subjects, the passion and intensity of interest displayed by those fans would seem "bizarre" or irrational on certain occasions. This reminds me of all the jokes about Star Trek conventions, where I've read that attendees are infamous for being way too intense or wound up in every aspect of that TV show. Now those people ARE bizarre. And I bet a lot of people (me, for instance) who aren't into computers, as but one example, would read a magazine dealing with that subject and think the endless pages of this-is-good-but-this-stinks and microscopic fussing by the writers and readers were way too much, certainly boring. What's that phrase? Computer nerds?

What's really irrational, though, are the recent cases of coaches and umpires being attacked by parents at their kids' ball games. Imagine the debate and fighting among those people, and they're probably not that much less vocal (or definitely passionate) than quite a few sports fans at the local ball park or sports bar! Talk about irrational. Worst of all, talk about some of them (the parents, for example) deserving some jail time or a few lawsuits.

And what's that ridiculous in-fighting that's been going on for centuries between Catholics and Protestants in Northern Ireland? Or the dissing between people who prefer one country over the other, one city or state over the other?

Believe me, this board ain't too different (heck, it may be even better) than what takes place in the rest of the real world, on any given day of the week.

[disneyhead]

Be nice. Vegas is no longer the tacky, neon embarrasment it once was. They have built some fantastically themed hotels, and added some top notch entertainment, (Cirque du Soliel, The show at Treasure Island was done by some of the guys who did Fantasmic!, The fountians at Bellagio, etc.). Not to mention the hottest hookers in America.

[merlinjones]

>>But the bizarre vilification that goes on here is unexplainable to any rational person.<<

You seem to be saying:

A British bank is run with precision;
A Disney theme park requires nothing less
Tradition, discipline and rules must be the tools.
Without them;
Disorder.
Chaos.
Moral disintegration.
In short you have a ghastly mess.

The children must be molded, shaped and taught
That's life's a looming battle to faced and fought.

In short I am disturbed to hear the children talking about popping in and out of chalk pavement pictures... foxhunt (well I don't mind that quite so much, at any rate it's tradition).

But tea parties on the ceiling - - I ask you - - having tea parties on the ceiling!... and highly questionable outings of every other kind.

If they must go on outings;
These outings ought to be
Frought with purpose
Yes, and practicality.

These silly words like
(Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious)
And popping through pictures;
Serve little use,
Fulfill no basic need.
They must learn the honest truth;
Despite their youth
They must learn...

(now responding)...about the life you lead.

We must feel the thrill of touting up a balanced book
A thousand ciphers neatly in a row.
When gazing at a graph that shows the profits up;
Our little cups of joy should overflow!

It's time we learned to walk in your footsteps
To tread your straight and narrow path with pride;
Tomorrow just as you suggest
Repressed and stressed
The MousePad posters will be at your side.


(Thanks to Bob and Dick and Bill and Don and Walt and Pamela for their wisdom in creating archetypes that still find mirrors in our lives today, even here).

[EandCDad]

Good points MMFan and well stated. Speaking as someone who hasn't gone to DCA and therefore doesn't get involved in specific criticism or praise of the park (and I've read both on this site), I agree with you wholeheartedly (sp?).

I don't agree that there is a "bizarre vilification" of DCA. There are people with legitimate opinions about the quality of the park and it is natural to compare two parks that open within one year of each other. You do have a point that some who don't like DCA occasionally seem to (metaphorically) rip the heads off of anyone who praises aspects of DCA or claims that they like the park. Some people take it more seriously than you or I do.

[Disney Deadhead]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Kuzcotopia



That should be the new slogan for Tokyo Disney Sea:

[B]Just like Vegas, but without the hookers! [QUOTE]


See, why go to TDS when there'a always Vegas?

Someone should post pics of 20,000 Leagues and juxtapose them next to pics of Brandy Midnite.

Which would you rather ride?

[Mike]

Originally posted by merlinjones
>>But the bizarre vilification that goes on here is unexplainable to any rational person.<<

You seem to be saying:

[txt - mary poppins parody]

(Thanks to Bob and Dick and Bill and Don and Walt and Pamela for their wisdom in creating archetypes that still find mirrors in our lives today, even here).

A nice job, but sadly you didn't work your noodle enough at parodying... Let me see if I can take what you wrote and expand on it, shall we? Complete with "bizarre vilification"!

Mr. Eisner: A British bank is run with precision;
A Disney theme park requires nothing less
Destruction, closures and fast food must be the tools.
Without them;
Theming.
Attractions.
Financial disintegration.
In short you have a ghastly mess.

Mary: I quite agree

Mr. Eisner:The Guests must be molded, shaped and taught
To enjoy whatever new ride that we just bought.

In short I am disturbed to hear the Guests talking about popping in and out of E-Ticket rides... Consorting with Country Bears.. Cutbacks (well I don't mind that quite so much, at any rate it's tradition).

But theme parks in Tokyo - - I ask you - - having theme parks in Tokyo!... and highly questionable outings of every other kind.

If they must go on outings;
These outings ought to be
Frought with tortillas
Yes, and practicality.

These silly words like
Sub..Subma.. Sub..

Mary: Submarine Voyage?

Mr. Eisner: Yes, well done, you said it.

And popping through attractions;
Have little use,
Fulfill no basic need.
They must learn the honest truth;
Despite their youth
They must learn...

Mary:...about the life you lead.

Mr. Eisner: Exactly.

Mary: They must feel the thrill of touting up an inflated stock.
A thousand layoffs neatly in a row. (Quite right!)
When gazing at a graph that shows the profits up;
Their little bonuses should overflow! (Precisely!)

It's time we learned to walk in your footsteps (My footsteps)
To tread your straight and narrow path with pride; (with pride)
Tomorrow just as you suggest
Repressed and stressed
The MousePad posters will be at your side

------

Okay, so that was more than a little lame, but blame me for feeling creative. :cool:

[merlinjones]

Imagineer: Sometimes a person we hate, through no fault of his own, can't see past the end of his nose.

(Holds up spectacular photos of Tokyo DisneySea)

DL Guest #1: That's the Tokyo DisneySea fortress and volcano. Eisner passes that on his way to China. He sees that.

DL Guest #2: You DO see the difference, don't you, Eisner?

Eisner (Offended): Of course I see it. Do you think I can't see past the end of my nose? Where are you going with that tuppence?

DL Guest: I want to go to Tokyo DisneySea!

Eisner: Tokyo DisneySea indeed. Feed your budget and what've you got?... A fat budget!

When we get to the Disney's California Adventure I'll show you just what to do with your tuppence. I think you'll find it very exciting. Very exciting indeed.

(Eisner, with his theme park and finance executives in tow, shows the guest DCA)

Eisner: Here is the practically perfect way to spend your tuppence.

Guest: It doesn't look like Disneyland.

Eisner (very pleased) No indeed.

Eisner and company:

When you invest admission wisely in a park
safe and sound
Soon that admission safely invested in the park
Will compound
And you'll achieve a sense of stature as your affluence expands
To the high financial strata
That historic Disney Stock commands.

All because of...
A budget
patiently
cautiously
prudishly
invested in a
to be specific
in a half-scale, mostly flawed, finiancially expediary park.

(they demonstrate the wonders of tortillas and carnival games with glee. The guests are not impressed)

Eisner and company:

Just think, you'll be part of
International brand marketing!
(Shopping opportunities!)
Management retreats!
(Cheap... tell them how we're cheap)
All manner of private enterprise
(Fine dining!)
(Longterm planning!)
Corporation!
Amalagamation!
Banks!!!

Eisner: So stands our twenty percent growth rate, Disney stands. So long as Disney stands, our executive bonus stands! If falls our bonus... we'll take the whole damn thing down with us!!!

All for the lack of
A budget
patiently
cautiously
prudishly
invested in the
to be specific
in a down-scale, mostly flawed, finiancially expediary park.

(Eisner snatches the tuppence from the guest)

DL guest: You took my tuppence. Give it back!!! Gimme back my money!!!

[Mr D]

I wonder what thoughts Ei$ner had going through his head when he made the opening ceremonies speech at TDS today, or when the sun came out to shine on the jewel of a Disney park.....that he did not build? Course then again the suggested 7-10% royalties (sp?) were most liking ringing bells like a cash register. If any one person should be the one to really feel the achievements of OLC and what they have done for the Disney legacy its Roy Disney, I bet he was very solemn and proud, its a damn shame we get a media black hole about the TDS opening here in the states somebody should come out and really do an extravaganza show about TDS even if its the BBC or MTV, anyone!

[TokyoInsider]

The inside word is that Roy Disney is more than just a little impressed with Tokyo DisneySea- (word is that he loves this park- from the tip of Mt. Promethius to the foliage, he's all raves) and those in the know say that his allusions to Walt and Roy in the grand opening speech weren't mere lip service, either- he was very serious and quite sincere when he said that Tokyo DisneySea was a park that Walt and Roy would have loved, and felt immensely proud of.

You can say that Tokyo DisneySea has the Disney stamp of approval- literally.

Plus- that thing with the sun breaking out when Michael Eisner was reading the park dedication- what an absolute perfect thing to happen. I still can't believe it.

[Mr D]

This is going to change things a lot, unless Roy is locked up and completely removed from the board I feel that he is going to make a dramatic decision soon, if it happens I would not be surprised if he takes a bolder stance in directing future decisions in the Disney company, it really must have been something there at TDS, about how many people did the park get? over 50,000? 75,000?

[coronamouseman]

Kids,

Let's remember a couple of things about Disney Management thinking before jumping to all the conclusions regarding their deficiencies or heritage:

1. Many amusement parks open with a fairly small collection of major attractions - Universal in Florida, Disney's Animal Kingdom and obviously DCA. True, IOA in Florida, US in Japan
and Disneysea opened with essentially a full compliment of attractions but IOA is still counting to see if they are profitable - the Japanese parks seem bulletproof but again, isn't that because
they were funded outside of Disney (DS) and Vivaldi (US) and the risk was taken by their Japanese partners? Let's face it - the US is in a recession, discretionary spending on amusement parks is down and thus don't expect big risks by theme park companies. Sure, existing franchises will add value with new attractions but big spending on new parks will probably be done they way
Disney did it at DCA - start small and add on attractions through time. I'm sure many of those folks critical of DCA would not be so vocal if they were riding Twilight Zone Tower of Terror and
Rock 'n Roller coaster attractions, both of which are rumored to be coming in the near future to DCA.

2. Disney, Universal, Six Flags and Cedar Point (Knott's parent) all have a tradition of "exporting" popular attractions from one park to another. DisneySea is a perfect example of how this system
did work (new version of Indy and Journey to Center of Earth using Test Track ride system) and how it might work later as some of it's attractions could be brought stateside (JTCOE, 20K Leagues, Stormrider, etc.) Disney designed the new rides and paid for the technology, but did not have to foot the bill for the construction - what imagineer would not kill for the opportunity to work on a project where construction costs were not a huge constraint? Look at Universal - every park complex now has
Jurassic Park, T2-3D and Back to the Future. Six Flags changes the names of some of its rides to suit each park but has versions of Batman, Superman and Riddler's Revenge springing up everywhere.

The real test of this observation will be the extent to which Disney does export its new creations, be it in pieces or perhaps into a whole new park in the Orlando wetlands - it would not be surprising if this takes place in the future as there have been very few new major attractions in Disneyland or WDW Magic Kingdom. A new mountain with a couple of new Captain Nemo rides would fit very nicely in either park or form the backbone for an entirely new park in either location. Nothing like having some new toys (at a substantially reduced development cost or with some experience in working out the initial problems) in the parks when the recession does turn around and folks have discretionary income again.

So yes, DCA is a disappointment but Downtown Disney is a nice addition if only for the chance to eat real food right outside Disneyland. Cut the Disney guys a break until we find out what they plan to do with the technological bonanza of new attractions which Oriental Land Co. has essentially dropped in their lap - let's hope we're all surprised by the speed at which they bring these attractions to the mainland. After all, Walt himself was never one to turn down handouts (remember Small World, Mr. Lincoln and the Dinosaurs from the 1966 World's Fair in New York) - all of these attractions eventually made their way to the Disney parks.
Let's see if the Disney Corporateers can uphold Walt's legacy in this particular area.

Lastly, if the Disney Corporateers don't bring the new attractions stateside, don't sweat it - save up your money and frequent flier miles, hop on the Internet and book a trip to Japan. Not only would you then get a chance to see DisneySea, but you could experience something wonderful outside a Disney park - there is a real world which provides some of the inputs to Disney Imagineers outside of Harbor Blvd in Anaheim and International Blvd. in Orlando!

[Mr D]

I agree with you about the advantage of somebody else building the projects, testing and modifying as time goes, but overall do you really think after a while with and possibly if that TDS with its big e-tickets becomes so good like say Stormrider, 20K etc. that any of these would be put in other Disney parks? Possibly in TL at DLR I would like to see Stormrider but what about DCA? The themeing of DCA is too restictive for anything from TDS, about the only thing that I can see in the future that would put US Disney back on top would be to buy a chunk of the area around the Queen Mary large enough to build a similar theme park as TDS, but it will not happen with Ei$ners spending program. Unfortunately what this company actually needs is a merger or a MAJOR sponsor to fund this building and expansion, now as of lately Disney is selling some securities to drum up over $7.5 billion dollars, as economic indicators are in a real bad fix right now what would you do if you had that much to spend? Would you improve excisting areas of property like refurbs? Would you buy a cheap media group? Would you pay off some loans and back purchases to stay marginally in the red? Myself if it was mine I would stay pat and wait a while at least 6 months, wait for TDS to show positive numbers, collect the 7% royalty from OLC and reinvest that into stability of products and merchandise that has been selling and think ahead for the next seasonal spending trends. next year will be the time for expansion, DCA will just get some :fluffing" a bit here and there just enough to keep the guests coming in and no more big ticket installations. The third park idea will be just that, an idea not another DCA park in a can project but more of an alternative Disney. My two cents and $7.5 Billion and I could put up a coastal version of TDS anywhere from Monterey to San Diego that would put TDS to shame!